Character traits of a sociopath by Dr Robert Hare

These are the main character traits as outlined by Robert Hare

Factor 1: Personality “Aggressive narcissism”
Glibness/superficial charm
Grandiose sense of self-worth
Pathological lying
Cunning/manipulative
Lack of remorse or guilt
Shallow affect (genuine emotion is short-lived and egocentric)
Callousness; lack of empathy
Failure to accept responsibility for his or her own actions

Factor 2: Case history “Socially deviant lifestyle.”
Need for stimulation/proneness to boredom
Parasitic lifestyle
Poor behavioral control
Lack of realistic long-term goals
Impulsivity
Irresponsibility
Juvenile delinquency
Early behavior problems
Revocation of conditional release

Robert Hare thought that Factor 1 traits will always be present, whilst factor 2 traits can improve with age.

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41 thoughts on “Character traits of a sociopath by Dr Robert Hare”

  1. I believe my daughter is married to a sociopath. For no apparent resone he has cut all ties with our family & my daughter. The police will not step in, & therefore our hands are tied. Is my daughter in danger.

    1. Yes, try to stay in contact with her. Even if she rejects you. let her know that you are always there, ignore rejections from her, and don’t give up. Let her know that she always has a safe place to come home to with you. They are very good at brainwashing their victim. So if you react in hurt and her rejection of you, it will make her believe that what he is saying is true. You really don’t care about her. Which of course is not true.

      What makes you think that she is with a sociopath?

  2. Questions:

    Do you think a SP can have a conscience but yet still have most of the symptoms of sociopathy? (Moving fast into relationships, initial obsession, the stare, narcissism, evading direct questions, accusing you of cheating or lying, CONTROLLING everything, temper tantrums, lack of patience, boredom issues, financial issues, unable to cooperate or compromise, unable to keep a steady job due to inability to take direction, blaming all problems on others – always looking at another or pointing the finger to highlight someone else’s shortcomings when he’s called out for doing something, petty lying (who knows possibly tall tales as well), lack of intimate friendships and close family relationships etc. and still be called a sociopath?

    The SP told me someone had indicated he was a SP but the only thing is he had a conscience. Have you heard of that? If that would be the case, couldn’t therapy help huim? However, ALL the above qualities I’ve identified hold true. Another strange thing is that I do believe he told me much of the truth about himself and do not feel that the info was grandiose in any manner. I’ve watched him tell petty lies for no real apparent reason that didn’t make sense to me and found it strange. What are your thoughts?

    Could there be hope for him if he did have a conscience and acknowledged the traits and characteristics possibly receiving medication and therapy to change the behavioral patterns? I wanted to believe if I could research the condition (the condition he told me he had and I knew nothing about; we could discuss and truly make this work). How would you if someone truly has a conscience if the SP’s place masks on their faces to most people charming them with their outgoing and larger than life presence?

      1. So honestly, how do you tell if someone even has a conscience if they are a SP? You can’t really tell the difference because they are so darn good at the game. I have dated a SP for 7 years. It literally ruined me and I am unable to commit. Is it possible though that if you have fallen prey to one SP that you are likely to attract another? Also, can a stare not reflect the supposed SP as having past hurts as mentioned and is trying to look deeper. At the end of the day it could work either way so the tests are extremely helpful however one would need to be assessed to be considered a SP for sure.

      2. You can’t tell If they have a conscience, it is just blatantly obvious when they haven’t got one!! When the truth comes out and the lies start to unravel is the only time you see their lack of conscience. When you see what they can do to you with no guilt no remorse and no shame.

      3. Yes If you have fallen prey to one and begin dating before you are healed you are more likely to attract another as a sp will offer to heal your broken heart and be everything that your psycho ex wasn’t. But of course this is all pretend.

      4. Not true. If we trully love a person we care to an extent. I am not a danger to my fiance. I love him and he understands that if he acts illogical I will not be emotionally gentle. I am cold calculating and intelligent. I do not manipulate because most of the human population is too annoying. I am not a leach and do not lie because it is too time consuming. You people trully are sheeple

      5. Lol yeah we are ‘sheeple’ you know what I would prefer to have the ability to love and to feel emotions. I would rather be like that than to live in the dark cold world that you do. I don’t need to be calculating – because I am happy. I have the ability to feel…. due to this – I will always be the winner.

      6. Lol yeah we are ‘sheeple’ you know what I would prefer to have the ability to love and to feel emotions. I would rather be like that than to live in the dark cold world that you do. I don’t need to be calculating – because I am happy. I have the ability to feel…. due to this – I will always be the winner.

      7. All sociopaths lie…. you say that you are cold and calculating whoopee…. and as for how you are with your fiance, I am sure that he has something you want. Wonder what would happen if he tried to leave you? and you didn’t want that? Am sure you would absolutely be a danger to him and would do all you could to punish him and destroy him. Sure sociopaths can be great, until they dont get what they want.

    1. The key phrase here is “could there be hope” and “I want to believe”. IF this man is a sociopath, but he is being very open about it to you, then it is nothing but a tactic to gain your sympathy and compassion for his otherwise unforgivable behavior. Waiting for him to “get help” and “change” could drag out for years while he systematically sucks every last bit he can get from you. Do NOT be fooled. Remember, actions are the only true indicator of change, not words. Don’t hold your breath waiting to see the proof of his transformation though, life is too short waiting for a sociopath to come through on a promise. (He never will.)

      My ex spath would usually confess and express remorse for the last set of grievances, coming “clean” about everything he’d done. He’d usually then claim he was changing, or that “he only hurts the ones he loves”, and with some sort of gut wrenching sickness I would let him creep back into my life so that he could turn around and commit a whole NEW set of offenses against me. The cycle is devastating to one’s self worth. Don’t get caught!

    2. Mine apologised. Said he ended it as I deserved better. But he had an agenda. The breakuo I wanted weeks before was manipulated to keep us together so he could control me & end it. He would tell me his apologies but also blame me. A show of conscience but at the same time leading a double life. You can not believe a word they say. And the hard part is still loving someone who never existed in the first place!

      1. I agree with alot of the things that you have said. The SP I was with was my ex-husband whom I was with for 12 years and married for 10. Within the past month or so I have just realized that he is a SP. The reason that I filed for divorce was because I caught him cheating for the last time. He copped to cheating for 8+ years. (I actually believe it was for 11 years). Right after he told me about the 8 years, he quickly told me that wasn’t true. He’s so good at what he does, he can tell you one thing one minute and the next minute tell you he never said that. I also know that he only apologized to me approximately 2 times the whole time we were together he didn’t take responsibility for anything. I also know that he tried to blame me for his infidelity. And what’s even crazier is that for a period of time, I took that on! I wonder what I did wrong. I kept telling people, I love him, I love him. But I also knew that I don’t even know this man. How can I love someone that I’ve never known? I loved the man that I thought he was. When I filed for divorce, he asked me not to gossip about him to our friends, which I didn’t. I only spoke to my close friends, who aren’t gossips. He didn’t do the same. He said things to people that I thought were my friends, because I’d see them once and I wouldn’t see them again. I know that I’m not perfect but I haven’t done anything to make people not want to be around me. Anyway, I’m sad that my marriage ended but I’m also glad that my marriage ended.

    3. My counsellor says most people will exhibit sociopathic traits from time to time. Its when they are always present the person can be catogorised as a sociopath. Sometimes when I read peoples stories I think “no, that guy is not a sociopath, but he sure is a prick”. lol

  3. Questions:

    Do you think a SP can have a conscience but yet still have most of the symptoms of sociopathy? (Moving fast into relationships, initial obsession, the stare, narcissism, evading direct questions, accusing you of cheating or lying, CONTROLLING everything, temper tantrums, lack of patience, boredom issues, financial issues, unable to cooperate or compromise, unable to keep a steady job due to inability to take direction, blaming all problems on others – always looking at another or pointing the finger to highlight someone else’s shortcomings when he’s called out for doing something, petty lying (who knows possibly tall tales as well), lack of intimate friendships and close family relationships etc. and still be called a sociopath? A trait not specifically mentioned that I felt that this man had was overstepping personal boundaries. It could tie in with the fact that the SP does not care what others think so they just do whatever they feel they want to do. I remember how fast he moved in and changed things in my home without discussion. I would’ve agreed to alot but he just made it very split. It was outside the bedroom and then inside the bedroom, never interacting with the rest of the house ever for the most part. He had OCD and was
    in need of routine/structure, which I thought was wonderful as I needed a bit of that and this is the good part that I take moving forward.

    The SP told me someone had indicated he was a SP but the only thing is he had a conscience. Have you heard of that? If that would be the case, couldn’t therapy help him? ALL the qualities I’ve identified hold true. Another strange thing is that I do believe he told me much of the truth about himself and do not feel that the info was grandiose in any manner. I’ve watched him tell petty lies for no real apparent reason that didn’t make sense to me and found it strange but not harmful. What are your thoughts?

    Could there be hope for him if he did have a conscience and acknowledged the traits and characteristics possibly receiving medication and therapy to change the behavioral patterns? I wanted to believe if I could research the condition (the condition he told me he had and I knew nothing about; we could discuss and truly make this work). How would you if someone truly has a conscience if the SP’s place masks on their faces to most people charming them with their outgoing and larger than life presence?

    1. Sociopaths are manipulative and deceptive. Without an actual diagnosis from a doctor, it is impossible to say whether someone is a sociopath or not. However, Sociopaths don’t immediately portray the lack of conscience, so this isn’t something that is evident. It is displayed when they do something incredibly hurtful and then act as if nothing has happened and why are you making a fuss? Terrible things which other people would feel bad about, the sociopath doesn’t. They also struggle to empathise – they can sympathise, but not truly empathise. They are unable to put themselves into someone elses shoes. Somebody could have sociopathic traits, but not be a sociopath – sociopaths are manipulative, deceptive, have an agenda, use others for their own needs, wear a mask of deception – pretending to be something that they aren’t. When the truth comes out, they show a stunning lack of empathy, and zero conscience for how much they have hurt you. They don’t care at all. They can’t as they just don’t have that part of their brain the same.

      1. I only ever got the apology after breaking free and he wanted me back in the web again. Which I fell for. Everytime. I just hope I can be strong when it comes again. It will.

  4. ok.. my original soc and I broke up a while back and I have been doing much better. I have been concentrating on me and I am actually happy. I just met someone who seems great.. here’s the problem. I have been reading so much and educating myself about sociopaths that I am really not so sure this new guy is not in fact a one. I am going to take it very slow, and see how / if he mirrors me. If he is in fact one, what the hell am I doing wrong?? Just in the couple of days of meeting him this is what I already know. He has had problems in his juvenile years. I know he doesn’t have a good relationship with his mother. He is a fire fighter/police officer.. death doesn’t seem to bother him the way he talks, and the stories he told were upsetting, but he said as long as it wasn’t his family he was ok.. I try to rationalize this with all that he has seen and been through with his profession. He mentioned if he could be president what he would do and change. He seems to really like himself after all I’ve already received several pics of him. However, after asking him if he “really liked himself” because of all the pics I received that has now stopped. He sends sweet text messages and I’m suppose to meet him again Friday with his friends. Now that I typed it all out, I am thinking he is but idk.. any insight on this ladies?? Am I over reacting??

    1. Sounds like you should pay attention but hard to tell. What was he looking for with pic sending?? Did you meet online or something? As for the death thing I have a paramedic friend and they just deal…she’s a loving wonderful person and she has said the same thing almost verbatim. The mummy issues… I had that too. Other than that I don’t know what to do…but I’m only four days after crisis and in post traumatic stress. :(

    2. I have just ended a relationship with a sociopath. I am in the recovery phase. Reading your post my heart dropped. I actually thought you were talking about my ex. The exception was the police officer part. He is not. Let me just say HUGE “red flags” went up. If they don’t have a good relationship with or do not respect the woman who gave them life. Don’t expect them to respect you. You are amazing and beautiful – you deserve better. Believe that!!! I wish you the best!

  5. My 14-year-old daughter just ended a relationship with her 15-year-old sociopathic boyfriend. He fit every requirement for a sociopath; if it was a survey with a checkbox, every single box would be checked. It really makes you wonder if they are born that way. He is an only child from a seemingly loving family and is very spoiled. I wish he had to wear a shirt with a warning printed on it.

  6. The first thing I noticed about my ex Sociopathic husband was on our first date he kept trying to touch me as we were seated talking in the restaurant…not normal really on a first date but I ignored it…should have skipped the coffee!
    He also had a fascination when I was in the bathroom of saying “what are you doing,, can I watch” and trying to open the door, but when I called him on it he laughed it off like a naughty little kid.. I was wondering if this type of behaviour is common with sociopaths..
    Strangely I used to know a girl who told me similar things about her husband and at the time I thought she was exaggerating because he seemed so nice and normal. Then she left him for abuse…should have learned from that I guess

  7. Positivagirl, please help me! I am in such a bad way tonight, yesterday. Despite all my attempts to NC since last New Year’s Day, when I felt totally discarded after a brief fling with my ex! I thought I had welcomed into my life, only to find him the next day acting suspicious, making me paranoid. His reasons for being unavailable on New Years day made me angry, yet they seemed believable. Now I here I sit, crying my eyes out, a terrible rush of emotion that had me compose an unsent text. I think I butt-dialed him on my mobile, I am not sure it rang long enough for it to register. I am having a severe panic attack. Uncontrollable crying. All I know to do is to reach out to you on here, my only support. My friends think I am bat shit nuts to even consider defending his actions and yet now I feel as though I have made a dreadful mistake. I am not sure he is a sociopath! I had said in previous posts that maybe he is a hybrid. I mean, he doesn’t have all the traits, he is self-supportive. He doesn’t lie about a bunch of stuff I have ever verified. He has lied a bit but don’t we all? He does seem cold and distant, but I have seen glimmers of sincerity in him. Could it be, since the death of my mom, and him losing his mom only ten years ago, that maybe he withdrew and made a mistake due to the chance meeting of this guy he had an affair with by happenstance on his fucking cruise. Can we, do we not forgive some things humans do? I can go back in my past and know how horribly I have hurt others in the cheating dept. Is this karma? OMG I am so wretchedly in pain, my heart literally feels as though it will burst out of my chest! I had blocked him on my mobile, only to have unblocked tonight for the slim chance that he would be sending me some goofy message like he used to. And now I feel so totally stupid. Why can’t I move on, why am I so terrified of losing him? Yes, he is not the man so many would fall for, he is not the greatest of all humans, nor the cutest or anything other superficial. But he kept coming back for ME, and I have rejected him so many times only to relent and keep it going, due to all my other circumstances. Is this a life lesson that I must bear? Am I being a fool for going through even the thought of resuming contact all on the supposition that maybe he really is the psychopath I thought he was? Maybe I am the one with the real psychotic problems, he used to joke that I was crazy! And I’ve heard/read from great philosophers that we are ALL on the edge of being batshit crazy at any given moment. My GOD what a weird place to be, to have all this consciousness and the pressures of what that involves. I literally would take a pill right this moment if I could to totally erase these thoughts. I needed/wanted to go to sleep early for tomorrow, and yet here I sit in total chaos. Am I being a drama queen like he always says I am? Did I pick up on some of my drama from maybe my drama-makers that are oddly absent from my life anymore?
    I don’t know what to think. All I know is I feel a profound loss, and not a loss where a person was abusing you constantly, either physical or emotional, but maybe just a little and I ran with it. I created his symptoms to satisfy a need to be more normal? To be superior? Oh God, if I have, I guess it’s too late, he’s love bombing someone new and perhaps moved on. I almost don’t want to hear what he would say if I professed my position to him at this point. SO what do you do in this situation? Have I made a huge mistake and now must suffer the consequences? Or do I embrace what life has shown me and deal with it? I guess only I can answer that! I already feel better that I have written these thoughts down. IF anybody has read this tonight or in the morning, please chime in with your thoughts. Reality is driving me nuts! Somebody please help me through this!

    1. Hi eldadude sorry for delay have only just seen your post. My first thought was unless you have not discovered the lies. Sociopaths are compulsive pathological liars and masters of deception and illusion. My thoughts are it does not matter what he is. But how he makes you feel. How you feel about yourself with him. Does he damage your life (sociopaths do they can’t help it).

    2. Telling you that you are crazy. Is not a joke. It is emotional abuse. If he was a sociopath you would have no doubt about it, once you knew the truth. They do create carnage and work against you, in the guise of working for you.

    3. Wow, edaldude, what happened? Surprised to hear you working so hard to justify him. “Cold and distant with glimmers of sincerity.” You and I could’ve been dating the same guy. Is this what you want?? Anyone can pull off a facade in the short-term.

      “He has lied a bit but don’t we all?” I’m about sure you probably don’t start a relationship with the hope this is what you will find. My soc told the truth sometimes too. lol! What was really sick though is that he lied on the big things; the important stuff. It’s not quantity, friend, it’s quality. One truly destructive lie is one too many.

      One thing is certain—you are addicted. You need some distance to locate yourself. When you can do that clear-headed, then ask yourself this question again.

    4. Edaldude, I can tell you from being in a very emotionally abuse relationship for on and off 7 years with a SP, you CANNOT expect to get your power back whilst playing into his hands. Most SP’s know what your next move is let me tell ya. They are sick people and are not governed by normality. The best thing you can do for yourself is walk away when he least expects it…that is if he isn’t violent. If he is violent, get your family to surround you and get the police involved. You DO NOT have to be a victim of emotional abuse. No one deserves to have their soul played with. It is sick and vile and you need to get your power back by showing him who is in control. You do not need to have emotional breakdowns or be tormented by someone who is incapable of the type of love you deserve. You need to take your life back for you. When I made this decision, I literally closed the door to his nonsense and sobbed and released all that I felt and thought I knew. I sobbed in the shower, on the couch, in bed….I spoke to people about it and verbalized it so that I had people i became accountable to. You can do it! You have it in you to be loved and cherished and not treated like an option. Go for it!

  8. Jusagirl, you are right I am addicted. The proof is in the pudding as I, i my state of supreme sorrow, accidently called him last night in the wee hours ( I swear I was just looking at a video we had made together before all this latest round of BS). So, I cried composing a text to him, but didn’t send it. Now, a day later so much slippage on this slippery slope of “love” I have fallen once again.

    The difference? He called me today, we talked, I tried to stay with friends, but soon found myself making excuses to go and be with him once more. But then I was going to not have him come by as he was, once again, pushing for! But he left a bombshell that exploded all over my being- he’s leaving tomorrow after work to go and stay the weekend with the new love down in Houston. See what I mean? He could’ve lied, but after I said tonight wasn’t any good and why not meet up this weekend like we always did before, he told me about this trip. So yeah, anxiety filled, I kept my composure and questioned him about where this was going. And he had a valid answer, after last week’s fiasco on new year’s day. Oh yeah, I brought that up, and he as usual said that how’s was he to know where “we” were at from one more night of intense pleasure, and me jumping to give him coffee.

    He told me this other person “is laid back, doesn’t question him all the time, makes him laugh, etc.” I was like, “well, he’s only known you LONG DISTANCE for a couple months” give it some time! He know’s it’s true, he knows all the bad attitude and just generally crappy behaviour he leaves on my doorstep. It took about 2 months of us dating ( seeing each other many times throughout the week) for me to see his dark sides.

    So I made a deal with him, he could go off and do it, no questions asked as long as he will be honest when he returns next week about what he thinks now ( after all, this will be the first time since they were on the cruise that they spend a lot of time together). We made passionate love, and upon him leaving just now he offered to show me a picture of him ( a video he shot of them on the cruise). Incredibly gorgeous this person is ( and I think, LOL, way too gorgeous for him!)!
    I know people like this, and even though they are coming out of a supposedly 8 year relation, I don’t give it long at all that this would last. But that doesn’t change anything. I am okay. Certainly better then the dispair I was in last night. Why? Because I was satisfied to be with him on the physical level, the level me and him are only the most best with ourselves.

    Does that make any sense? Like I said, this blog is for people dealing with true, hateful sociopaths. I don’t think mine is, and I am not making excuses, I think he suffers from something less severe if not equally distressing. Narcissism, low self esteem? Don’t us humans come with a barrage of mental issues. Yes, I get your point, and I can see how anyone looking on the outside could say how pathetic I’ve become to allow. But, like this thread was talking about, we have to come to a place of understanding and forgiveness, and I guess I wanted to show that. I DO forgive him I guess for what has happened. It could’ve happened to me, but never had such a thing like that happen, doesn’t mean it can’t. And I have chatted and talked to some new people on this dating website and will continue to do so.

    I don’t know what will become of us. I do know that the addiction I have for someone I loved for almost 5 years is not something I can let go so easily ( DUH). I do know that, like many have commented on here, that he told me the likes of tonight that he’s not relationship material, he doesn’t want marriage, or kids, or anything like that. So he wants me to “just go with the flow”, and that’s what I did. I figure, this blog is my place to get some ideas exchanged, and we all are on a path to figuring out things. I want a loyal lover. We know now that is not going to happen. I don’t know if he will have a blast this weekend and it will peter out between us now. Or, the opposite could happen. Who knows? I feel like I can pull off keeping him in this new light, or not. Only time will tell. Him showing me how gorgeous this person is, I seriously can’t see it being a long term thing- I cannot believe he would be able to pull off being so great as that their chemistry will be anything more than physical.

    Or I could be totally wrong, they hit it off, and he soon moves to be closer to them. I am at the mercy of time, but like I say, I am NOT going to wait around for him to be who I need him to be. If, in the unlikely event that we patch things up and somehow get back to focusing on us, well, I will worry about that bridge to cross when I get to it. So it’s open season! I can continue to date and get to know, and he can believe that this new fling is the answer to his life. I am going to try and be hippie laid back, and like I said, go with the flow. Am I crazy and stupid? Probably, but it seems like I have seen too many get caught up in whether a situation is black or white. We even talked about that tonight. There are gray situations, and I think this is one of them. But I must keep this a secret- all of our’s secrets on here. Nobody that knows me will accept this decision, hell, maybe I will wake up tomorrow and be against it again. I don’t know. But I do feel clarity. I do think he has shown me honesty about this situation and I will give him credit. Life is too short, yeah, and that is why I will continue to seek a soulmate. In due time we shall see what becomes of this soap opera. Will I have anyone there to listen on here? Will you all let me explore this new avenue and not judge? No judge! LOL
    I want you all’s input and together we help each other. I will soon know what the answer is, or not. I just hope you all will not abandon me, or be thrown off this site. Please everyone, don’t give up on me!

  9. @Edaldude
    I will go back and read the rest of your comments in a bit, but I had to respond to paragraph 4: You made a deal with him? After you outlined to him, and yourself, what the appeal of the other person is? He is pleasing himself. Selfishly. And, if you will continue to sit there awaiting his return, he will happily let you do that, use you, entertain himself, and throw you away. You are hurting yourself, knowingly. Simple sex is not worth your self-respect, ED. :( More to follow…

  10. I have reread today what I wrote after last night’s passion, Jusagirl. Okay, my thoughts weren’t too succinct and I didn’t put down a lot of what I was meaning to. Of course, it was not anything specific that I left out, but I just can’t seem to lay out what I really am feeling. Of course, if you read my old blogs on the many threads on here, through the course of everything that has happened to me, you will think ( as would anyone familiar in my life) that I am batshit crazy to even have missed with this again. You know what I left out is that he only made this trip this weekend because I didn’t ever call him back last week after that terrible day! I told him last night that he had been a total jerk ( in a nice way) and how would he have felt if I had done this to him!
    This is where I think he is not a true spath- he agreed!
    He then went on to say he thought that we would never work in a relationship because as many times as we tried, it always ends in fighting. I gently reminded him that most of that friction was the immature way he handles conflict, and that with some therapy ( which I still would be willing to explore with him) could go a long way in solving that. I think we left it at the doorstep of maybe.

    Prolonging my suffering? No, I don’t think so this time ( and I may totally be kidding myself). But I plan to keep using my PAID membership on this dating site, and maybe join some others. I think if I can meet someone like he did ( cute, successful, funny) I would soon be able to let this whole sorry mess go. And I know that it’s not healthy to try and date while you are still attached. But I am not attached. I truly feel my healthy relationship with him had ended a long time ago. You see, I have been the one that was lazy with moving on, because I am lazy, and he kept up the antics with me just enough for me to go along with it. Truth is, he will probably have a blast down there this weekend, and won’t be bothering me much anymore. I bought a bit of happiness ( and paid for it with my heart) last night. I know it will be difficult to meet anyone, hell it’s already been a letdown but it hasn’t been that long on this new site. I still have options. I must learn to get out and socialize, which is perhaps my life’s biggest struggle. Always had a tough time meeting new friends/lovers. It has been a cause of depression in my life since a teenager! God, I can remember only in my twenties being satisfied briefly, but I fell back into the loneliness. Despite me being somewhat of a homebody, I always envied people with active social lives. Alas, I am in the autumn of my life pretty much intact except for this bitter relationship.

    I am not saying it’s better to be in a lousy relationship then nothing at all, but part of being a wallflower is to find contentment with what you have. I don’t at all recommend anyone in a seriously abusive relationship to continue on, as this blog is set up for those that indeed are suffering from severity. Mine is like I said, in a gray area, on the fringes. I am not even sure he could be considered a spath? I think he harbors many odd, negative traits, but I do feel that deep down he does perhaps love me more then anyone he’s ever known. I think that is why he, even after committing to this trip, will come back and remain in contact. I would love it if this trip, which I would never try to stop him from taking, is a journey he NEEDS to explore. I was his age, too ( remember he is 16 years younger) and so that is why I am in the thinking that he’s got to explore this part of his life. Maybe this new person will breakdown his old persona and help him to grow into a new and improved version. Or not. Like I said, I am on this trip called life like everyone else. I don’t want to look back on this and think how I just rolled over and let him have his affair and hurt me. That is why I plan to hopefully get my act together, and meet new people like I have done on this website, if only I can find someone as nearly supportive as all of you have been!
    I still say, ask the Universe for something different, special, or exciting, and it usually delivers. Sometimes sooner then you’d think! Happy Friday to everyone!

  11. Honestly, ED, when you say things like this (justifications): “You know what I left out is that he only made this trip this weekend because I didn’t ever call him back last week after that terrible day! I told him last night that he had been a total jerk ( in a nice way) and how would he have felt if I had done this to him! This is where I think he is not a true spath- he agreed!” I really wonder where you are in the world, and if we were seeing the same guy.

    What’s different about your message now, is that, in the first, you were acknowledging what can never be, and in this one, you are back to hoping that will change with counseling he really doesn’t seem interested in. I think you are holding out hope because he gives you just enough crumbs to keep you, but not really what you want or need, or what is good for you.

    You and I could have the same story. I decided to see others too, thought that put me in the driver’s seat. He messed that up because I still really just wanted to be with him. He messed up any chance for me to be free though because he would say he was coming, then cancel. With this type person, they like to keep their options open, while tying yours up.

    Your mood is also more upbeat now, and the only thing that’s changed is that you’ve been able to reason with yourself how you can see him again. I see you heading for a crash. I know you don’t want to hear that but, I wouldn’t be authentic if I didn’t say it. Doesn’t mean I don’t understand and relate to it. You know, he could’ve canceled the trip though. Someone who really cared about you, once they knew you cared too, would have.

    1. I know he’s a spath, but there are some days where I just don’t want to believe it. I think, maybe there is a sliver of a chance that I’m overreacting. I’ve turned and twisted, trying to justify his behaviors, but nada! It’s useless! Doesn’t mean it doesn’t hurt. he question remains…can you love a sociopath and stay one step ahead of him? Or is playing the game just a waste of time?

      1. Yes its a waste of time and energy as they are ALWAYS playing a game. Life is a game. They turn good things into bad. As if it is good, they fear that they have lost control, so they take back control. Read the post confusion of kindness if he is being ‘good’ and you are confused.

  12. Jusagurl, you’ve been in my shoes, many on here I suspect have. I know I am guilty as charged of making excuses for his actions. That’s why this whole thing is a cyber confessional secret. Anyone that knows me would be mortified to hear that I’ve said and done this now. Reminds me of a story, early on in our relations, when one time, upon his graduation from college, I put together some planter boxes for his patio and delivered them. We were out there on his balcony and I was trying to help him put it together ( being the gardener in the family). He got angry that I wouldn’t stop trying to help, and wouldn’t just sit there and let him do it wrong! It led into a big argument ( I was mad that he wouldn’t let me do it for him) and he threatened to call the police if I wouldn’t leave! I was so shocked that I did start to leave ( he was on his phone acting like he had called)! He told me to go down to my truck in the parking lot and wait for him to call me back after he collected himself and would give me permission to come back up if he did decide so! Yeah, he called after I finished my cigarette, I went back up. But you know, the whole way home from that experience I was saying out loud to myself, I cannot tell anyone what has happened with this psycho. I literally have to treat him as a total secret lover. Nobody would understand putting up with such theatrics! That was over 3 years ago!

    So, from what you are saying, my “using” him for what physical pleasure we still enjoy, until I find someone new, is not going to work? Even if I blessed this trip? I don’t think I would’ve wanted him to cancel, ironically! I want him to move on! I should see this as a gift from the Universe because as we even discussed last night, we can’t seem to make a relationship work. He’s an asshole, he knows he is. I don’t even want to be considered his lover. But it’s too late for what has happened and both of us carry around all the history we have of one another. Does that make sense? I mean, me desperately trying to hold on to something so wrong is not what’s happening. I am using this as a vehicle to go onto the next phase of my life. I have no hope that he will somehow reverse his decision, and no hope that he could ever be the type of person to settle down with now. I’ve known this fact for some time. Like I said, I am lazy, and yes I am making excuses for this situation, as horrible as they may be, it at least buys me some time to move on. I looked up some support groups locally today and will continue the quest for healing. I hope what I am doing is not so far-fetched as to be self-destructive. I hope that I can honestly look back in a year or so and think what ever became of him because he is NOT in my life.

    God I was so hooked on the physical side, I got all choked up with the prospect of being alone and look, I text him and BAM! He’s right back at my door the next night! I felt satisfied and yet full of anxiousness at what happened yesterday. Other people can think what they want, but how many out there really do have such a wonderful physical relationship, husband or otherwise? It took me so long to find someone like this- that satisfied me in such a profound physical way, it’s such a pity that they weren’t the complete package.
    I think as far as human relations go, there are a lot of worse things going on out there! Don’t worry, Jusagurl, I heed your warnings and I have my head somewhat on tight. I may indeed be walking into yet another minefield, but I’ll be damned if I know right now where else to go on this path called life! Thanks so much for your wonderful and kind insights! You didn’t beat me up, like so many of my friends do, you just humanly gave me some food for thought! You’re an angel! And anyone else on here, positivagirl especially, y’all are too!

    PS- Just between us, I hope that he has a lousy weekend and they both get food poisoning, and other minor accidents ruin his romantic getaway! LOL Just kidding…

  13. can they be a SP without mirroring too much? The person i’m married too definitely has something wrong. cant put my finger on it. Here are some of the things he does-
    Always blames me for everything, in the small case he owns up to something and apologizes 99% of the time it happens again and therefore seemed fake, he constantly dumped me while dating, took my ring back 100 times while engaged, now married will leave over the dumbest things and packs up and moves back in with his parents (he is 32) and they allow it, he cant stand if i say anything about how he should “spend his money”, he refuses to get a checking account with me, he seems very secretive most of the time, he drinks a lot, tons of broken promises to stop these behaviors and never follows through, cries on the drop of a dime, anytime i seem upset after a “break up” he is nowhere to be found, as soon as I seem happy and as if im moving on he swarms in and is relentless, calling nonstop, needing to talk to me, crying, coming to my house multiple times, etc. He has lied many times about drinking, going out, what he was doing when he went out, etc. lying comes easily. sometimes in convos that are arguments he will repeat what i say- like if I said “well by all means go with your friends” then later in the convo he will use the phrase “by all means” for something when its not his normal lingo, seems happier to be “dating” me than acting married, at first said i love u in 2 weeks time and wanted to get married right away and had a prob that i wasnt super affectionate from the get-go, i let it go b/c i have known him since childhood, seems to go to church for a while to please me b/c after a while he stops and then im controlling if I ask him to go, which makes it like it was all fake the past few months when he was going, and the list can go on. His brother who is almost 40 does same thing with his wife, in/out, lives at home off and on.
    I didnt see too much mirroring though but maybe he does and i’m missing something? Definitely not the typical behavior of someone who is married and 32 yrs old. There is something amiss. I cant figure it out. There is a cycle and pattern that always repeats itself and i get hooked with false promises and lies only to have the same crap happen again.
    How do you guys deal with when you finally walk away and are beginning to feel happy and they come back and start calling/coming by needing to talk to you nonstop and cry- mine wont ever take no for an answer and he breaks me down until i say ill think about it, which turns into ok. then the cycle continues. its so hard b/c unless your being totally rude and nasty he dont take no for an answer. i have a child with him- i cannot have no contact yet.
    Thanks!

    1. “..hooked with false promises and lies..” — there’s the mirroring behaviour, telling you what you want to hear and pretending to be the man you want, in order to hook you into giving them what they want.

  14. oh one more weird thing- if he moves out and then is begging me to come back and i say no. he will keep begging. then if i say ok come home, he will all of a sudden not want to come home. has his lists of reasons. OR sometimes if i continue to say no and he isnt getting anywhere, he will just come out of nowhere and mention he doesnt want to live with me. and im like uh i never asked you to. he has this thing of turning it around so its him the one saying no. happens all the time. is that SP?

  15. I have left my sociopath husband three months ago. He has tried to contact me many times…. Same old pattern of trying to worm back into my life. I am not allowing this time. I am glad we don’t have children.

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