@ Broken 😃
Story about a heart ❤️️
One day my heart was just relaxing & minding its business when suddenly, a horrible, crazy, malevolent beast jumped up & tore heart from its safe place.
Safe place could not fight nor believe what had happened 😔
Safe place, picked heart up & said, ‘please hang on ‘, i will get help.
Ah, safe place went over to healings place & laid heart on a beautiful cushion filled with, love, light & power.
Heart looked awful, it was touch & go for a long time. Heart was on life support, poor heart so badly hurt.
One day, safe walked in & heart was sitting up 😃❤️️
‘My heart, you are looking better, your colors coming back!’
Next day, heart was practically dancing & beating like a child. Heart was recovering, no more bleeding, scars looking better, a light was shining wirhin heart.
Safe place said, Heart you look fabulous, wonderful, beautiful 😃
Safe place cranked open their rusty old rib cage & placed heart back inside ❤️️😃
Heart was so happy & started singing, safe & healing place got married & heart witnessed the ceremony ❤️️
Safe, healing heart lived happy ever after. Never the end, just the beginning 😘
Long live hearts ❤️️❤️️❤️️
PR xoxo
@PR,
This is very beautiful. Today I’m doing a little more than going through the motions. There’s a flicker of hope inside me. I spent the yesterday with one of best friends and workout partner. We got out of town and spent the day in a small city where I met some of his old buddies. I calmly explained to them what had happened, and described in detail the shit my ex pulled over the past year and a half.
After their jaws stopped dropping they all said the same things:
1. “You weren’t weak to stay with her. The fact that you could endure this abuse for a year and a half shows how resilient you are”
2. “Please understand, even though you can’t feel it but can probably see it, that you are lucky to be rid of that skank. After you are away from it for awhile you be grateful. You are far too good for her and you know it. You just thought you could fix her”
@PR,
I’m not that religious but recognize the spirituality in things. There is a story in the old testament called “The story of Job” that speaks of men that appear like angels to help Job sort out his loss and faith.
Even though it was just in really cool Mexican restaurant in Syracuse, NY, I realize that the discussion I was having with these other guys that I had just met held dimensions of angelic and spiritual dimensions. The way they were able to plug into my struggle with such wisdom and perfection was amazing.
I have to truly stop worrying about what she is doing. She is a dirtbag without a life. Her life has been propped up by her looks, charm and family money and public assistance. All these things are just illusions of a person that does not really exist. No soul. This person was abusive and dangerous.
I go to court this week to resolve my DWI of 2 years ago. Hopefully I’ll get my license back. I lost a lot over the past to years and made some very bad decisions in choice of a partner. She didn’t ruin my life but broke my heart.
My friend kept reminding me that I have a successful career, have many of the traits a good woman would be interested. AS I rebuild my life I may meet someone when the time is right. The tragic relationship I was in was a learning experience that was so aversive that atleast I was smart enough intellectually (not emotionally though) to not get myself sucked in too far financially. It was just one last sign the powers that be sent me to drive me away from making self-defeating decisions in the future.
I’m starting to pull away from the horror of the jealous emotions and obsession of who she is having casual sex with. IN the end, that is all she is capable of. She is 45, and yes still beautiful, but that will fade, and she is going to find herself very alone. I suspect that when she slows down enough to think about her life, she will realize that. SHe has said to me over and over again, “I know I’m going to end up alone.” Yes H.E. …..you will
I know I’ve left a few apparently harmful/hurtful comments, however I’ve cooled down a tad now, and have a few questions, if you’d like to answer; if you don’t, I guess I understand or something, I have been a bit blunt and it’s hard for me to remember that people can get offended easily >.>
So I’ve been extremely introspective as of late – most of my day is filled up finding out how other sociopaths work, how neurotypicals generally think when they hear the word ‘sociopath’ (usually disgusting, creep, and so on and so forth).
As a child, I was extremely cynical. I knew I was different as such, however I thought it was because I just didn’t care to pretend. I was truly convinced everyone in the world cared as little as I did, that all their tears were fake, that they all hated small talk with a passion and all had triggers. I just assumed they had more patience to pretend, and I always used to wonder how they managed to do it for so long when I found it difficult by the age of only nine. I was convinced everyone was horribly selfish, moreso than I (I’m less selfish than you may think).
It’s only been about a year since I’ve been aware of the term sociopath. What I am makes sense now, however questions of how empaths function still remain.
It feels as if there’s constantly a party and you’re never invited and you don’t understand why. As if you’re missing out on something big in the world, that your life is somewhat devalued because you’re not as ‘human’ as someone else (in some people’s definition).
I’m an alienated disempathetic/hostile type of sociopath, according to Lykken, some dude who does research on sociopaths >.>. because of my crappy childhood and my crappy mind and crappy everything else, inevitably I became quite angry with the world. I also have somewhat poor impulse control. I, understandably, am now extremely asocial.
I guess this site angers me at times because when people say they are currently in a fine relationship with a sociopath, everyone screams RUN.
I’m in a relationship and have been for 3 years now, and honestly, I don’t know how he deals with me. I get bored often, and stir shit up subconsciously, or get irritated. I apologise afterwards, and I mean it. I want the best for him. I’m still not sure if our relationship is selfish or not, but it doesn’t matter to me.
There is a system we find works, however. He’s completely aware what I am, what my triggers are, and how to help, whether that be just leaving me alone or just giving me a hug. He’s aware of what I do, how I get bored, when I lie and how to react.
I have never and will never cheat. and am extremely frustrated at people who do, because what are the chances you’ll find someone to deal with your crap? Why would you want to fuck that up?
Another thing about relationships, sociopaths do not fall in love. We walk into it. We can control how we feel very easily and our love isn’t ‘blind’. We see every single flaw in our partners, yet we love them regardless. Hope that answers a few questions.
I commented earlier that sociopaths come in bad, neutral, and good kinds, as well as many subtypes and blahblah.
There are many different kinds of sociopaths. My father is the only other family member that is one, and he’s the ‘bad’ kind. He used to rape his sister, abuse my sister and I, rape my mother, on and on. I need you to understand that most sociopaths are nothing like this. Half of my genes are him, and I’m exactly like him, yet nothing like him at the same time.
I do apologise for the long life story (half of me is still a child and honestly believes no one actually gives a crap and you’re all just lying ;3) however through this I do have a few questions.
Some of them I expect to be very difficult to answer.
1. What does it feel like to ‘fall’ in love, without being able to have any control? Is it frustrating, blissful, scary? Sorry for the bad wording.
2. Why are empaths so closed-minded? Does it not make sense to keep open minded about all of your opinions so if someone was to bring in a more logical argument against your opinion, you can end up being the wiser? I guess the question here is, why is ignorance equivalent to bliss?
3. Why do you care? This is a very open question, but I don’t know how to word it any better. When someone dies that didn’t benefit you in any way, why do you cry? When you lie, why do you feel guilty? What does guilt feel like? I’ve heard people say it makes your face feel like it’s on fire but I honestly cannot fathom what that feels like.
I apologise for the somewhat childish questions, but I hope you can understand these questions and many more have been on my mind for a long time.
Firstly, thanks for your honesty.
I think most people when hurt by a ‘pathy’, react accordingly & wish to protect others form the same fate & empathize & sympathize also according to the experience.
1. Love is ‘Euphoric’ & does ‘blind’ us, even to lies as love also allows our vulnerability to be on full show. If it then gets violated then, naturally we are deeply hurt. We trust the person we give our love too.
If the trust is broken & we are betrayed then, hence our ‘stories’.
2.We aren’t closed minded, just mindful of your motivations & curiosity about us. We have all dealt with someone that has hurt us, you represent those people. I know that sounds harsh but, like racism, we are not haters of other races, just the individual bad ones.
3.I do not cry at funerals for evil people although, I respect others that do. If someone has hurt me, I will not cry for them. I will not cry for my Soc, never have & never will. I cry for myself & my misfortune is being used etc…
I go to a funeral to support the loved ones, not always the departed one.
If they have been a poor representation of a body/mind in this life, I am saddened that they did not leave a better impression as love never dies except if you are never loved.
So, continue to treat your partner with respect & truth & if you cannot love, then don’t deny his ability to grow & love with you & without you.
If when you die, you are loved, then you have succeeded in this life.
It’s not about you, it’s about how others ‘feel’ about you.
Aww. Well. This is my site. The clue is in the title dating a sociopath. It’s not called hating a sociopath. Socio in my life is still around and as you describe its quite similar. He still does his socio ways control winning snooping etc and the rages come sometimes too. But… On the whole we get on well. I have ptsd from a trauma before I met him. WhIle sometimes he is a problem esp (for me) when he is ranting. I refuse to engage with his psycho self. I know it will pass. He has since last summer changed a lot. Finally got a job, paid me back money he owed. He hasn’t totally changed. He never will. I don’t think. But what has changed is his understanding of himself and his ability to try to manage his behaviour. Like your partner I accept him for who he is. Don’t want to change him. The one in my life doesn’t cheat either not with the other sex. I think that helps. It’s hard enough without bringing in others to the equation. Yeah I think his thinking is the same, I cope with him and his behaviours I understand.
So do you think sociopaths can love? I see it more as ownership possession and control? They consume you which is why partners have a hard time moving on. You talk of your childhood. And I think that is quite often common. His childhood was not good.
In answer to your questions
1. I don’t see love as ownership or possession. I don’t want to control my partner or own them. And would prefer if they didnt own me. Love is unconditional, about loving someone for who they are. Feeling secure enough in that relationship to fall in love but most importantly allowing someone else to love you. When you control you don’t allow someone else to love you. Not naturally. So it is always staged. This caused a lot of fights with the socio in my life. How does it feel? It feels amazing. It feels free. It feels warm inside. Most importantly it’s about trust. The ability to trust. I think that this is something that sociopaths struggle with. It’s about letting go and trusting. Trusting someone with your heart that they will not hurt you. Not controlling and wanting the person to grow and shine and having the confidence that you are still good enough just as you are. I find the concept of control difficult with love as to me control is not love. It is forcing your will onto someone else. I know that socios struggle with trust. They need to control someone else. That isn’t something I ever need. Yeah it can be scary in the beginning. As you don’t want to get hurt. But we take risks with our heart because we can trust.
2. I don’t think I am closed minded. I worked for decades with homeless people. I try not to judge. If you see judgement here it is because people have been hurt. Betrayed let down. As you have acknowledged yourself. There are varying degrees of socios/psychos. The last one in my life had a good heart despite sometimes a bad mind. Not all are like that. You acknowledge some are bad. They are. Really bad, sick sadistic, cruel. I have dated one like that. This type, there is not much to be understood as it is so far away from who we are.
3. Why do we care? We care because we feel someone else’s pain. We are able to put ourselves In someone else’s shoes. To understand how they feel. To be them. It is a natural response to want to help someone even if there Is no benefit to me. Seeing someone smile is my reward. I dont really lie but if I had to tell a lie I would feel bad. Just the same as sometimes when you tell the truth you dont feel right (as the truth exposes you and leaves you vulnerable). Guilt is a horrible feeling. You feel it in your stomach. It eats you up inside. It is a knawing nagging feeling. And you have the overwhelming desire to put what you have done wrong, right. It feels bad to hurt someone else.
I appreciate your questions. And also your honesty.
Story about a heart ❤️️
One day my heart was just relaxing & minding its business when suddenly, a horrible, crazy, malevolent beast jumped up & tore heart from its safe place.
Safe place could not fight nor believe what had happened 😔
Safe place, picked heart up & said, ‘please hang on ‘, i will get help.
Ah, safe place went over to healings place & laid heart on a beautiful cushion filled with, love, light & power.
Heart looked awful, it was touch & go for a long time. Heart was on life support, poor heart so badly hurt.
One day, safe walked in & heart was sitting up 😃❤️️
‘My heart, you are looking better, your colors coming back!’
Next day, heart was practically dancing & beating like a child. Heart was recovering, no more bleeding, scars looking better, a light was shining wirhin heart.
Safe place said, Heart you look fabulous, wonderful, beautiful 😃
Safe place cranked open their rusty old rib cage & placed heart back inside ❤️️😃
Heart was so happy & started singing, safe & healing place got married & heart witnessed the ceremony ❤️️
Safe, healing heart lived happy ever after. Never the end, just the beginning 😘
Long live hearts ❤️️❤️️❤️️
Welcome back Lyss,
I also appreciate your honesty. I have also been honest in my response below. I found your last post quite interesting and find that it is in line with how I believe sociopaths think and feel. However, I also believe that you are in the minority of being good and like everything with sociopaths, it’s good on their terms – as long as they have control and as long as they aren’t bored. Anyway in response to your email…
You say that you control love. Real love is not controllable. Real (unconditional) love is given despite what the other person does or say. Real love is a feeling that comes from your soul. It makes the world glow but it also make you vulnerable. Although you “love him” in your way, it’s still conditional. By definintion, to control love means that it is conditional. Real love is unconditional. You say that your relationship may be selfish, but it doesn’t matter to you if it is or isn’t… but as a normal functioning human that your partner is, it would matter to him. But you don’t care because you need to control it. We say run because the relationship, as you stated yourself, is a roller coaster ride. When you get bored you stir it up. That is not a fulfilling loving relationship. That is a constant battle. We say run because no matter what happens, the relationship is one sided in that you control the relationship and he has to surrender to your needs – i.e. its not conditional. The love that you have for him is dependent on how he behaves. WE say run, because being lied to is betrayal and disrespect but for you it is a way of life. But mostly we say run because there are thousands of men and women on here that have been treat so incredibly horribly, and very very few have said differently, that we see that as the norm. You are not the norm. We might be able to get our head around that there may be a few “good” ones out there but the chances of that person being one is very very slim. Tell me, how many good sociopaths do you know? Youre the first that I have come across or heard of. Therefore the advice is much more likely (99%) to hit the mark if we say run. Lying to someone to get your own way, causing pain because you are bored, is not the normal way to live. There are people out there like us (24 out of 25) that can love and respect us equally and that is why we say run, because a caring empathetic person deserves to be treated with respect and to experience real love and to be loved unconditionally so we want them to go and find one of the other 25 – not the sociopath.
IN answer to your questions:
1. What does it feel like to ‘fall’ in love,
To fall in love is the most incredible human emotion there is. To trust and accept someone for who they are and to give yourself completely to that person is beyond articulation. It is amazing, wonderful, beautiful. It is better than anything else in the world. The warmth and fulfilment that comes with it is overwhelming. To love completely and unconditionally, you become vulnerable (and that is a little scary), but that very vulnerability, is what makes the love so complete. Unfortunately, that is also what makes it so painful when that trust is abused, betrayed, broken – whether through infidelity, lying, or abuse.
Why are empaths so closed-minded?
I don’t’ think that we are being ignorant/closed minded. You have to take this site into context… this is a healing website. The people that have come here have been hurt badly both mentally and physically by a certain type of sociopath… the dominant type of sociopath. These type all behave in very similar ways (you can see that by reading all the comments) so we give the advice that we know works. Almost all of us were cheated on. Most of us realise that there are some that do not do this. But we are discussing the masses here. I don’t’ think that is closed minded. Like you, I find your comment a very big generalisation and coming from a very closed minded point of view. You do not know us. You are reading only the bad that you want to see. You are possibly missing the part where we are comforting each other and supporting each other, because by your own admission, it is alien to you. Where has your opinion been logical? You have told us that we are wrong and then got angry at us. How was that disabusing our opinions? It was simply reinforcing it. Yet as you can see, when you come here with a set of non offending aggressive abusive questions, we answer. So who here is closed minded? Neither of us it would seem when taken into context.
3. Why do you care?. When someone dies that didn’t benefit you in any way, why do you cry? When you lie, why do you feel guilty? What does guilt feel like?
Wow, what a great question and one that really shows insight into how hard it must be for you. Especially when added to your earlier paragraph about feeling like you are the only one not invited to the party. We really do have empathy for you lot when we take away our own hurtful experiences (which is hard to do). How empty you must feel. To not have that part in you that cares. To not have compassion. That part that feels pain when someone else hurts themselves. We care because we are human. We feel pain even when someone dies that did not benefit us because we have empathy. We feel their loved ones pain. We feel sad that they no longer have a beautiful life ahead of them. We empathise with how hard it is to loose someone you love. We have compassion for their family. I see a dead cat or dog or bird on the side of the road and I feel sad for that animal. It hurts me for a few moments. I feel sad for their owner. I feel sad that the animal can no longer live, that life and running free is gone forever. I feel sad at the pain it must have felt at impact. I can imagine how that must have felt. You may wonder why this is worth feeling empathy and compassion – sadness is only one side of it, there is also so much joy and happiness that we get from other peoples happiness. And this is part of the unconditional love… love is amplified by knowing how the other person feels, it is holistic. Also, apart from that, without the sadness you can’t have the highs. it is because it makes you appreciate life. It makes you happy to be alive. It makes you appreciate what you have. Life is wonderful and beautiful and full of love and joy but also sadness. One without the other is only half a life. Half the feeling. Empty.
Guilt comes from knowing how that person would feel if I got caught. That person will feel betrayed and hurt and a little part of their love for me would die. I feel guilt because if they did it to me I would be hurt and angry and a little bit of my love for them would die. I feel guilt because I know what I did was wrong. How does that feel? Like a spasm of anxiety. Not overwhelming but when my thoughts go over the betrayal (big or small) I get a stab of anxiety as I know htat I have wronged that person. That if that person finds out that it would hurt them and that if that person finds out I may loose them.
I do feel sorry for you lot that you can never live a whole fulfilling life. That you will never know unconditional love. That you do not feel compassion. How empty and dull your life must be. I am not belittling you. I mean that sincerely. Because I know what it is like to feel and love and to be loved and feel their love holistically. I am extremely empathetic. This has made my life difficult because I care too much. I have too much emotion. But I would never ever swap it for what you have.
If you are truly good. If you really are looking out for your partner. If you really do not treat people as if they are animals because you don’t have compassion or understanding of the pain that you cause them with your behaviour, then I wish you luck. But realise that with the 1000’s of women and men on here that have had horrendous experiences, that you are by far the minority.
I will never go out with a sociopath again. Why would I when I can have the real deal? When I can have unconditional love. A real life. I think though, that this would be very hard for you to understand because you don’t know what the opposite is like. Because you can’t grasp how that feels. But I can imagine what it would be like without it. One, because I have empathy. But two because it is easier to imagine what it would be like if you remove a feeling an emotion than it is to make one up.
You know, it is possible for you to be healed. But you would have to really want too. Perhaps something to think about. Then you could join the party. And although the party does have pain, it has holistic unconditional love and compassion. Without pain, it is hard to learn and grow. Without love it is hard to live.
Love is endless & unconditional, if love is with conditions, that is not Love, that is control as you so eloquently said 🙂
When I ‘pass over’, I will do it knowing I am truly loved by those that I love.
I think the Soc’s will wander endlessly because, even spirits on the ‘other side’ only come back via the eternal connection of love.
Evil spirits are those that have no connection so, if you believe in that, then that is what ‘hell is’, destined to roam forever without a home of love.
Soc’s won’t have that conduit back, ever!
Even if others left behind love them, they don’t love in return so, therefore the ‘loving connection’,is severed by the Soc.
If you harm others by using their love for you against them, that will provoke bad ‘karma’, I can guarantee it. The evil stay lost forever & the good find ‘peace, love & harmony’ for loving in any way, even towards a fellow creature, love pure & simple is returned & rewarded.
Cruelty, selfishness etc…has no reward.
Heaven is not materialistic nor full of possessions, no-one owns anything, just love & love alone 🙂
Keep loving & growing & Soc FREE (yay us)….love but, never forget the lesson the Soc taught us, Love is reciprocal, love is peaceful, love is pure & love is the gift you give to the world.
Soc’s don’t & cannot give this gift, what a shame but, it is what it is.
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
Thank you for replying.
I must ask you however to not feel sorry for ‘us lot’ or anything. We do not feel empty. You can’t miss something you never had. It’s just confusing, is all.
It isn’t, however, possible to be ‘healed’. Telling a sociopath they can learn to feel empathy is like telling a cat to start barking. It can’t. It doesn’t have the capacity to.
@ lyss, I feel sorry for you because you will never know a fullfilling life, you will never know the true beauty of being human.It is sad not to be able to feel life to the fullest, to be connected to everyone and everything. That is why i feel sorry for you. Because I can empathise and I care about other people – even those I don’t know. Its called emapthy.
With regards to being healed, I have heard and read that it is possible. Not by teaching you empathy but by healing your past and the inner hurts. By a lot of therapy, bringing to the surface the real you, the human that you have hidden away and facing your true self and vulnerabilities, you can be “cured”. But you have to want to. YOu have to be ready to feel the pain. But that is the problem, you have hidden the pain so deeply that even you dont believe it is there. THat is what i have read anyway, and it was by a sociopath that was healed.
@It is done
I fail to see how I am any less human, though. I have the exact same amount of personality as everyone else, I laugh, cry, smile, yes it may be more shallow but it still happens. Regarding the life fulfillment, I feel I am very fulfilled. I’m happy where I am, I do not see how empathy allows one to ‘complete’ their life.
And unfortunately, that person was not a sociopath. It is entirely possible for someone to be traumatised and to act cold and isolated, to convince themselves they do not care, however that is merely a protective layer.
I think you fail to understand, there is no pain for me, I don’t care about what happened to me nor can anyone bring me to care.
My mother sent me to therapy for many years because she thought I was twisted, and no one helped. That’s another thing I do not understand, how talking seems to help people. A sociopath does not need nor want help, it’s an altered way of thinking, not a condition.
@ lyss,
You will always fail to see because you don’t know what unconditional love is. There is nothing that I will say that will enable me to show you that. Your life is half a life because you are missing the most amazing part of being human. It is good that you are happy the way you are, but that doesn’t stop me from feeling sad for you because I know what you are missing.
I read your comment written on MARCH 24, 2014 AT 8:08 AM last night and started to write the below response. I think that will go some way to explaining it but as you said, you cant’ teach a cat to bark. Or in this case a sociopath to understand empathy and what that means.
What stood out to me the most (about your comments written march 24), was that your comments were founded on your beliefs not on our reality. And that is because you don’t understand our reality. One thing that you were completely wrong about is that we do care about other people’s life stories, even complete strangers. We really do. We want to make their life better, even though they are complete strangers we empathise with them. We feel their pain. Most of the time there is a side effect of making us feel good as well which is nice. But we would still do it even if it didn’t BECAUSE WE CARE (as long as it doesn’t hurt us too much). We don’t do it to make us feel better. we do it to make them feel better for no other reason than we are human and we feel their pain and we want them to feel good and also as we know how nice it is when someone does that for us.
You also said that sociopaths don’t wake up and say we are going to be knob heads today we just wake up then just go by exactly what you are feeling. But that is the issue. You don’t feel compassion nor understand empathy so therefore everything that you do is self serving. It may seem illogical to you but what we do is not always self serving. We do it because we actually have a connection with every living being through our empathy. We don’t’ go and help someone because that is what is expected, we do it because we truly care. About them. We want to make them feel better. We have a connection with that person (called empathy) that makes us care about them – even complete strangers. Our empathy connects us to everyone. That you said there is not much difference, just our motivation is where you are getting it wrong, all though it is good that you do the right thing despite your lack of care, it is the motivation that separates us and that makes all the difference, that makes life so much more alive. That you have to force yourself to help someone, We don’t’ force. It comes naturally. We want to help. Our empathy which connects us to everyone is what separates us. Our compassion completely separates us.
My question to you is how many good sociopaths do you know? How many do you hang with and discuss their intentions? I assume You have gone to sociopath world at some stage and seen that there are many nasty egotistical bad sociopaths out there. You just have to read this site and read all the damage and destruction that sociopaths have caused these people to see how many bad ones there are. Some of those may have even been “good ones” but they decided to move on because they didn’t care anymore. They also didn’t care about the consequences of their actions nor the damage that they did to the people they once professed to love – because they don’t have compassion, they cant, they can pretend, but they cant mean it. Most don’t even bother to pretend. When my ex finally decided I was no longer fulfilling whatever need it was that I filled, he did not give one thought to me. He did not care that his actions hurt me. He did not care that he disrespected me. He did not care that our life of lies that came out destroyed everything dear to me. He may have cared before and pretended to feel things to please me but once he no longer cared, He was done. My feelings no longer mattered. He completely dismissed me because he no longer cared. That is betrayal. That is hurtful. That is incomprehensible to us because we have compassion and we would not treat anyone that we once cared about like that, not even someone we now disliked.
What makes a good sociopath? Someone who follows the rules? Yes that is true, but do you know the rules? All the rules? When you are done with your partner, you may not lash out and hurt him, but it’s pretty much a certainty that you will also not pretend to care because “you will go by exactly what you feel” This will break your ex partners heart, because even after a break up our feelings for you are still real. Because of that very connection that we all have for each other. Love does not just stop. It takes time to dwindle and go out. But the memory of that love is still in us. For you it is gone. It is done.
I am sorry that you have had a hard life. I am sorry that you are not complete. That you can’t feel empathy or compassion. That you are not connected. I am sorry that you are right, that we don’t want to be associated with sociopaths. But we don’t because of everything that you wrote on this day (March 24) , you don’t understand us and never can. You don’t have compassion. You don’t care about people except those that serve a purpose for you and that you can control. You live by different rules. I understand that this is not your choice. But that doesn’t change that you can’t do selfless acts from a place of compassion. That you can’t truly surrender yourself to love. That you lie all the time and maybe in your case it is because we have forced you into this position. But no one forced my ex to cheat on me and lie about it. No one forced him to pretend he was someone he wasn’t so that I would love him. When I really needed him he didn’t have compassion. He didn’t understand what I was going through and he didn’t want too because he couldn’t. Do I hate him? No. Do I feel sorry for him… I’m not at that stage yet, maybe one day. Can I feel compassion for you? Yes. But can I help you? No, no more than I can help the mentally retarded guy. You are missing something fundamental. But you only suspect it. You will never know what it is and you may be happy that way. But we know. And we feel sadness for you.
Again, I hope that my comments haven’t offended. I am not trying to do that. I am just trying to articulate something that is so hard to explain to someone that cant feel it. That your feelings are shallow show that your life is not as deep and fulfilling. We all have to live life to our best ability and if you are able to do that despite your “shallowness” then that is good as long as you are not hurting those around you. But you are by far in the minority.
@It is done
Thanks for your response.
I must say though, in defense, I do many things selflessly, but my motive is only one of yours; knowing that if I was in that situation I would like it if someone did that for me. That, I guess, shows selflessness, to hope that people see me donate and keep a reminder to do the same to everyone else in that position just in case one day I am.
Aside from my boyfriend and one family member, I have never told anyone I am a sociopath (obviously here I have, as I am basically anonymous), and most sociopaths do the same. Also counting in the point I am asocial. So, aside from my father, I am the only other sociopath I know fullstop.
I have been, and many of the people there are those people who believe it will make them cool to be cruel and cold. I do try to avoid that place, aside from reading M.E. Thomas’ articles.
I believe what makes a good sociopath is, yes. following the rules, but it takes a certain amount of intelligence and self control to be able to KNOW to follow the rules, when to follow them and how.
It’s difficult to do, and takes patience. I remember it was only last year I picked up on the fact that you’re supposed to apologise when someone says someone they knew died. Before then I would just be all ‘oh, no… um.’ and it would sort of put people off. Funny but true little story for you there ;3
You don’t need to worry about offending me, it’s extremely hard to get me offended.
I do believe I am living life to the fullest, however I think our definition of life is different. Yours may be to love, be loved, communicate, and so on and so forth, however mine is to gain knowledge, to be comfortable, and to be free (at least the most one can in today’s extremely restricting society).
@ Lyss,
Hats off to you. I liked your reply. If what you say is true (and excuse the bit of doubt but i do have a bit of experience dealing with sociopaths) then I wish you luck in your life.
I do want to point out one small thing that really defines this whole topic. Where you said:
“I do many things selflessly, but my motive is only one of yours; knowing that if I was in that situation I would like it if someone did that for me. That, I guess, shows selflessness, to hope that people see me donate and keep a reminder to do the same to everyone else in that position just in case one day I am”
The first part of it made me nod my head in approval, but then the part where you say “to hope that people see me donate… in case one day i am” That is not what motivates us at all. We dont’ care if anyone sees, we just know how nice it feels when someone does it for us. There is no pay off for it. THere is no “maybe someone will see and then do it for me”. Its just we know how nice it feels therefore we do it for them. This makes us feel nice. This is that whole connection thing, that holistic magnified feelings thing. When someone loves me and I love them it is magnified because i know they love me and they know i love them and that makes the whole thing even bigger and better. because I know that me loving them makes them feel good, this therefore magnifies my feeling and makes me feel great and makes me love them even more and visa versa…. It really is so hard to articulate.
I really do hope that you stay “good” and continue to get your fulfillment from it.
Peace
@Lyss
I have a question if you don’t mind, do you believe this was genetic make up, or learned behavior or both? Reason why I ask, I have 4 children, 2 raised by NS (ages 8, 10) and 2 fathered by NS (currently 10, 13). My younger son is exhibiting behavior, my daughter 13 does not. Just curious on your thoughts.
It’s extremely hard to tell, I do believe it may have been somewhat genetic makeup, because my sister is, while messed up because of what happened, not sociopathic. However, I did cop a lot more crap than my sister unfortunately.
I think it would most likely be a bit of both. I could have possibly been genetically predisposed to it but it may have become more severe because of what happened, but there’s no way to tell.
Sorry I couldn’t answer your question any better.
@Lyss
What you wrote to It Is Done,
“it is a altered way of thinking, not a condition”
This is what I was looking for. I just couldn’t find the right words? I don’t believe it’s necessarily a DNA thing, (could be) I think it’s a way of dealing with ones life out of circumstances, be it self learned, or taught. My son exhibit more traits when he spends more time with his father, (addict, alcoholic, neglect, etc). As opposed to when he’s with me, he doesn’t have to use NS defense in my household because he isn’t in those circumstances with me. It’s very upsetting for me, it’s like being around a miniature version of his father.
Thank you very much for your reply, it makes a lot more sense now.
@normalisboringsoIheard
It’s quite a problem with the stigma many people create, I think.
You must remember it is also possible for someone to show tendencies but not actually be one, due to it being a self-defense mechanism. In my opinion, sociopathy isn’t a way to deal with things, just a way we were born/brought up whatever it may be that caused our way of thinking.
Glad I could help in any way
@Lyss
I think the boy is on the border, especially since he feels unloved by he’s father and both (the boy and girl) will do anything to have his attention, (maybe love). Their father will do anything to torment me, he HAS to be the best and most loved, (really who cares)! So I just have to be neutral, explain to them please take responsibility for your actions, the easy way is not the best way, etc. Their father is one of those NS’s the ones who think they are God-like and us peasants are here for them, charismatic, life of the party. In reality, horrible, mean, abusive people when the mask is off. And when I say self “defense mechanism” it’s how my son has to deal with life at daddy’s house because it’s not safe. I am sorry let me correct my self, the parenting style is “Free Range” as opposed to my “Dictatorship”. I was going to say there is no parenting in the home, but in California, even no parenting is a style. Lol.
Thank you again, I am beginning to understand more the condition, (the why), not just the actions. Take care.
NIBSIH.
@normalisboringsoIheard
One more thing I must ask however, does your son like his father?
I say this because you said it’s upsetting for you to see how he is like his father.
My mother has said this to me, that I am just like my father many times, and personally I would recommend never saying that and trying to deter from thinking that.
For instance, recently my father called me, abused me over the phone (luckily I do not have the capacity to give a crap about what he says ;3) then literally ten minutes later texted me asking if we could forget that and move on, and that he wanted to spoil me with gifts for my upcoming birthday mark. Me being a sociopath just as he is, I could see right through his games.
My mother told me to not say yes because, in her words, it was ‘selling my soul to the devil’, however I replied with, ‘he can’t beat himself at his own game’. She got extremely upset, began to say I was just like the lying manipulative ass my father was and she would never trust anything I said again.
I wish I could get her to see I don’t want to play his game for the sake of the game (although it is exhilarating seeing his own game being played against him), but because I want to get him to see he can’t just keep fucking up people’s lives like he does without consequences.
My mother thinks I’m doing it for the same reason as my father, to benefit me and only me and to have fun, but she cannot come to terms with the fact that yes, I may have the same personality traits as my father somewhat, but I am definitely not him.
I apologise for the long rant, but my point is, you need to realise that while your son may show the same tendencies, he is not his father, he is still just as human as you and, if you raise him right, he will still be a good person, empathy or no empathy.
@Lyss
They both love their dad, it’s the excessive blaming others and manipulation and lying, especially my son. My daughter she SEES daddy, which makes me sad for her too, she wants to believe her daddy is the best, but she can’t. So she says nothing. I have told them both, daddy has his good qualities, focus on those things about him.
I do not say anything neg about daddy to my children, he does a good job making himself look stupid with out me having to help him. Plus it would hurt my children’s feelings talking bad about him. The only request I ever made of them is when their daddy talks bad about me to them, is to not defend me. I will not have a child defend me. It’s not their place.
I do understand the issue you have with your mother, I haven’t spoke to my mother since 7/2008, until this last 11/2013. I think when our parents get to be a certain age, they can’t change and don’t understand. I will be polite and courteous, I just don’t want her in my life. No games. Because I am me, I shut her out, because you are you, the game excites you. I am played out of the game. I think it makes sense? I don’t think your a liar either. I think your just keeping the game fair regarding your father. With mothers, (and most fathers), children are sacred territory, until the parents die, you just don’t cross that line. My ex tries to all the time. To him, it’s money, a tax write off, a possession, like a car, or shoes, another girlfriend, no seriously. The children are a commodity.
Ugh it’s late. I have to get up early, looking forward to conversation another day!!
Good night, and take care.
NIBSIH.
Hi NIBSIH,
I reas that having a Soc/Narc parent, there are two types.
1. The abusive parent, the child is never good enough, always trying to appease the parent & kept down, not valued, just an annoyance etc…the Soc/Nar can ignore their kids & like a complete strangers child, usually to procur a new target. They ignore their own flesh & blood to impress a new partner by winning over their childre. They set up rivalries etc…
2. The engulfing Soc/Nar will dominate & control their children to do their bidding etc….these children rarely make any independant decisions without consulting the dominating parent. These children become enablers & followers & like to basque in the Socs perceived supremacy etc…. They pander to the Soc for attention & rewards & sometimes emulate that parent. This is how it is perpetuated & those children can become the next in line to the Soc throne.
When the Soc is removed etc…these children flounder as they have always been controlled & manipulated.
@broken. They sound like very supportive people. During our recovery, we really do need to hear those types of things to help us move on. Positive words and Positive reinforcements.
Sadly, the person who I thought I could always lean on, my best friend, barely said two words to me about my relationship break up and our friendship has deteriorated since my break up. She didn’t congratulate me on my house or take any interest at all or wish me a great holiday. I told her that I was suffering from anxiety and depression and that was why I couldn’t go out all the time, once again, she didn’t say much and I felt like she didn’t believe me. She has turned to drinking even more while I have settled down and tried moving forward. I think that a huge part of this has been because of the situation with my Spath and my depression from being in an abusive relationship. In saying all of this, I found a huge supporter in a person I worked with. We laugh, talk about crap and give each other so much support. So thanks to my Spath, I kinda lost a friend but found a new one who has been my strength. This is the kind of people we need to be around. They pick us up when we are down and enjoy the ride when we are on our wave of happiness.
@EX DEF,
Thanks for your kind words. And I too have experienced distance from some good friends on the topic. Fact is they were tired of hearing about it and warned me over and over again to get rid of her.
I’m sorry for your depression. It is brutal after being in an abusive relationship. People outside of it sometimes can have a difficult time identifying with it unless they have been there.
Its been a weird trip for me to go through this as a guy. People tend to be confused when a guy like me gets burned so bad, and can’t understand the depth of my inner despair. “Come on man…you’re a dude, shake it off” is usually what I hear. I have a couple very close female friends that have been helping cope with this dilemma. But in the end, it appears that It’s the couple close guy friends I have that are similar to myself that are getting me through this. I realized yesterday there are just kind nice people in the world that can recognize and tune into someone else’s despair deeply enough to help you through it . These re the people I need to gravitate towards.
I was invited up to a lake party that is taking place when it warms up being hosted by a guy I met yesterday. HE said, “buddy, you just need to get out of that town and meet some new people. Relearn how to talk to women. You have been hanging out with a low life that entered you r life when you down, and she took you down further. She has nothing other than looks. She is a parasite that lives of her millionaire mother and the state. Her mother is forcing her out of the mansion. SInce she is a leach, she was trying to set you up to take care of her. Her mother even offered to buy you two a house. But you know what, you know you would have been paying all the bills. When she realized that you weren’t going to “fund her life or put up with fucked up kids..she moved on to do the only thing she knows how to do: manipulate another man into hopefully doing what she wants them to. Again, there will be a lot of really nice successful women at this party. Don’t try to hook up (which isn’t really my style anyway). Just practice talking to them. You have been a state of despair and need to starting caring about yourself again. THe punishment is over if you want it to be. The punishment is over. In a year when you have your life, a nice apartment (or house) and car back you will meet a women that is good for you. But you have got to love yourself enough to do that.”
Pretty amazing insightful words from someone I had just met. Maybe the punishment is over. I just need to listen to good advice
@ PR,
ANd by successful women, I mean successful in life, not wallet.
I refer to.the basics:
good values
kind
self-supporting
@ Broken & Ex 😃
I read this today & thought it timely so, here is a quote by George Sand (Amandine Dupin) 1804-1876
‘Guard within yourself that treasure, kindness. Know how to give without hesitation, how to lose without regret, how to acquire without meaness….
Know how to replace in your heart, by the happiness of those you love, the happiness that may be wanting in yourself.’
@Broken, your friends, new & old are the greatest allies so, go forth & re-engage with life 🙂
They sound like great guys so, enjoy the male bonding as the ‘brotherhood’ is just as vital as the ‘sisterhood’.
@ Ex Def, likewise, rally your supporters, old & new. If someone lets yoy down, forgive them, they don’t understand thats okay. If they find solace in drinking then they have their own demons 😦
Make new friends but, befriend yourself & keep nurturing your growth & repair. Be proud, you are growing at your own pace & independant of others, that’s a great way to be, self reliant & resilient.
Go out & enjoy life, keep it simple & take it at your pace. No-one has an agenda anymore.
Keep being authentic & true to yourself.
The rest is easy 🙂
Love PR xoxo
@Broken
I love the Story of Job, I googled it once – it was titled “why do the innocent suffer….” Sigh. Just proceed with life the best you can.
Also I love this song, when I am down in the dumps I go to gospel. Don’t ask me why? I just do. Hopefully my non techie self can put a link up here. 😡. And no my computer and lap top are not working.
@PR,
It is a great song! I just got done reading “Psychopath Free” written by a woman named “Peace.” Its helpful. I hurt a lot as I read through it knowing all that has happened. I’m praying for the day I can just accept it and move on.
Right now I’m just hanging onto the fact that she is a subhuman loser that isn’t fit to tie my shoes
I have been having problems with my yahoo and ymail accounts, I am soo done. I am slowly transitioning everything over to gmail, aol, and hotmail . – hackers grrr – destroyer of lives!! It’s yahoo which is the worst. – sorry yahoo people – but you are!!!!
Like right now, I can’t even get into the blog?? What the heck??
??? I don’t know why. I haven’t blocked anybody?
Ugh and they still aren’t seen on the site? Oh crud??
@lyss…I also fond your posts interesting. It is always good to hear from your side how things are and you are not rude about it either. It is quite refreshing really.
Thanks, I admit I can come across extremely rude sometimes, but it’s difficult to remember that people can be so easily offended. I must say, a few people stay away from me merely because I do not get the point of ‘beating around the bush’.
When I was in my final years of school, and girls would cry about how they didn’t get a certain formula or their friend got a better mark than them, I’d tell them they were being ridiculous, not in a cold-hearted way, just blunt, and would tell them there was no use in crying over it because that wasn’t going to achieve anything.
So for the last 3 years of my schooling I forced myself to avoid everyone because I couldn’t understand their emotions and didn’t want to bring unintentional harm to them ;3
A question, as your partner knows, does he get tired of the Jekyl & Hyde behavior? I still can’t fathom being with a Socio/Narc? Knowingly?
Is he co-dependant?
Thanks,
PR 😃
@Pheonix Rising
He does tire very often. However he is certainly not codependent. I make sure he’s aware at all times (to the point he gets quite pissed off when I say it over and over) that he can leave whenever he wants and I never want to make him feel forced to stay with me.
He is bipolar however, so I think he would understand the reasoning behind some of my tendencies as well, seeming as he knows what it’s like to have triggers and to not be able to control yourself sometimes, even though it’s not exactly the same.
@Lyss
Thank you for your message. It is very insightful into sociopathic thinking for both the elements you express directly and also your indirectly expressed thinking. In the latter category, your reasons for not cheating are very insightful. It shows a clearly calculated cost benefit analysis from a self-centered perspective. The reason something is not done has nothing to do with a perceived understanding (a form of empathy) of how it might hurt the other party. Rather, it is done because to do so might “fuck up” the currently beneficial situation and then force a hunt for replacement. It demonstrates that even in the closest of relationships there is inability to make calculations apart from how they impact self gain or loss.
The asking of questions regarding how “empaths” think or feel about things seems to imply a binary way of looking at humanity. There are only empaths and sociopaths in that construct. Many of the studies out there, however, seem to show humanity instead rather being spread across a spectrum. Individuals come out in all ranges between empathy and sociopathy, possessing both characteristics (See Pos’ recent blog post on “How much of a Sociopath are you?”). There will, however, be many individuals on each of the far sides of spectrum. Why people are where they are on the spectrum still seems to be a matter of debate between nature vs. nurture and seems unlikely to be sorted out anytime soon.
Regarding the vast middle part of the spectrum there have been numerous studies and writings on how the development of the limbic brain and its giving the human race the ability to be empathic, care and love has advanced our species from both the individual and group perspective. Without it, life is a singular, struggle for survival, not unlike the antelope out on the African savannah. With it, we can have society and the increased benefits that cooperating and sharing brings about through division of labor.
Why the individuals in the middle care, share and cooperate are diverse and can range from the subliminal feelings that come from belonging(more towards the empathic side of the spectrum) to the calculation of enhanced personal gain that can come from cooperating with another (more the sociopathic side). More information on such writings can be had in Margaret Stout’s work as well as writings from the Ludwig Von Mises Economic Institute.
Numerous studies have also been done with those very high on the sociopathic side of the spectrum that show how they bring about through their behaviors the very outcomes they fear the most. One of those being abandonment. Most of these studies revolve around Nash Equilibrium and the Prisoner’s Dilemma, where players can choose strategies of cooperation or sole benefit. Payoffs for sole benefits are high for single round wins. Cooperative strategies will bring higher mutual payoffs over time. Sole strategies chosen by one player, however, force other players into sole strategies if they are to get any payoff. The studies show that highly sociopathic individuals will always adopt a sole benefits strategy even though the payoff over time to them is less. They can not seem to adjust their thinking to getting less of a payoff on an individual round rather than a higher payoff over time.
Your comments about “your crappy thinking and your crappy life” triggered this in my mind. Perhaps your way of thinking(sole benefits strategy) and the subsequent life actions it brings about are responsible for the “crappy” outcomes you experience.
There are true incentives and benefits to approaching life from an empathic point of view. Whether a shift out of the wings of the spectrum is possible can be debated. However, the incentives to doing so are empirically backed and should be explored.
@agoodplantoday
I find your comment very fascinating.
It’s interesting to see the spectrum, and how there are even variations within the term sociopath itself. While generally they all suck at planning for the future, some are able to overcome this in different ways by applying other kinds of logic.
M.E. Thomas, creator or sociopathworld.com and a sociopath herself talks about how she managed to create a sustainable retirement fund by the age of 30 by countering her sociopathic traits. She knew she was bad at planning ahead, so what she dd was every time the thought would come to mind, she would transfer all her savings to an account that was difficult to withdraw from and made it her retirement account. It would make her feel bad for losing money at that time but the feeling would quickly fade, and because generally sociopaths get bored quite easily and do not have much motivation to go out of their way to do things, she made the process of withdrawing so long and difficult that she couldn’t even be bothered.
What I take out of this is that it is important, for neurotypicals and others alike, to discover all their weaknesses and built defenses against them. I was extremely impressed when I heard what she did, and think it could apply to almost everything, not just financially.
Whether is be poor future planning, poor commitment, over commitment, there are ways to put strategic defenses up to prevent the worst happening (which has happened to me, I am currently unable to pay even my mobile phone bill because I’m irresponsible with money).
Hello, I’ve read some of your posts and it has helped me confirm so many of the things I experienced while dating a sociopath. Many of your comments rang so true they hurt. It was like hearing a more intelligent version of my Soc articulate the very things that I saw during my down fall. She too (after the honey moon of 3 months and her love-bombing was over and I started getting annoyed at her bazaar insulting comments that would come out of nowhere and her periods of complete silence and going off the radar) she would say, “I know this is really hard for you. If you choose to break up with me I would understand.”
My mind would state the obvious of “why couldn’t she just pick up the phone when I call. And why doesn’t she try to change this if she cares.? Again, this is only after 3 months. I would foolishly ask her if she even cares about me or the relationship. She answer yes. At periods when her bizaar and often emasculating behavior would drive me over the edge, I would tell her I didn’t want to see her anymore. She would come over with tears in her eyes and somehow warm her way back into my heart. But in hindsight, she would never apologize or take responsibility for her behavior that made me break up with her. Her brazen laziness really amazed me as well. I’m talking about being too lazy to even see if I needed anything after I broke my leg and ankle. She choose that incident as a stage to tell me how bored she was.
She often would use her kids as an excuse for not being available, then show up out of the blue all manic and wanting to do “go out.” Of course, when I called her and tried to initiate a date, it was always a struggle for her to just say yes. Again, I realize in hind sight that this was her poor impulse control and selfishness. She would only want to go out when “she thought of it.”
Her mother offered to buy us a house. (which I of course would pay all the bills to maintain). Because of her behavior (for lack of better term), I passed on the offer and thought we needed to build a stronger relationship first. that never happened.
She would often accuse me of saying things that I know I didn’t do just to put me down, and basically create a crisis and power struggle. I know now that this was gaslighting.
Her final discard of me ended with her saying, “You can’t drive me anywhere cuz your leg is broke and you won’t take me on vacations and trips. You put no effort into this relationship.”
Any feedback you can give me on this I welcome. I’m not so worried about my heart..that will mend. But, I must admit, my mind is still in a confused state.
Thanks,
Broken
@Broken
I almost laughed at the whole silence part. I know you might think it’s on purpose and it’s t hurt you, if they suddenly go silent and their behaviour is very back and forth like that, but it’s not intended at all.
I get yelled at a lot by my boyfriend because I’ll randomly go silent and stay in my own head. I know I need to say something to stop the issue going on, and I try force words out of my mouth but for some reason it’s almost impossible. I’m unsure whether it’s to do with lack of deep emotion and therefore having too many objective thoughts in my head, but it feels like my head is spinning with facts, deep thinking, I can’t put it into words, but all of these thoughts sort of suck me in and I’m left in my head. I assume that’s a reason why we’re so good at lying, thinking objectively and quickly, and not so great at social skills; because we spend too much time in our own heads.
I can’t exactly comment on the fact that she used to whittle her way back into your life part, each time he’s broken up with me, I haven’t tried to get him back at all I’ve just let him go and he always comes back, I swear not on purpose! I guess that’s an individual thing, not specifically a socio thing.
I do assume however she always struggled to say yes to your dates is because of the sense of power. Most socio’s are terribly stubborn, and want it to be them starting something or no one.
Thanks for your comment though, interesting to see how some other types, clearly more social socio’s live.
i am in the process of getting a new job, we work together and NC is almost bloody impossible. i am so caught up in it all. countless times i have had to hear, “i am leaving her” i keep asking when and he keeps saying when he has settled his son and other issues. Why can i not bloody let go!
Yes, I have that problem but now that he has a new source, he isn’t contacting me as much. I think he thinks I will always be around because in the past I had that addiction to him. I have moved a long way from then but he doesn’t see that, he will always see that crazy person.
I think it is human nature to respond to someone. When he sends you a message, don’t respond to it immediately. What helped me was reminding myself how crappy it felt to be yelled at or get a response of hmmm or eye rolling or something negative towards me. Even when his response was nice to start with, towards the end it would make me feel like crap. That helped me to not want to contact him or respond to him.
They create an addiction towards them. You know how PTSD, anxiety and other mental illnesses have triggers. I believe when an Spath contacts you, it can also be a trigger for that addiction again.
Hi Ex D & Esperanza 😃
They have formed a betrayal bond with you, they betray, you stay addicted.
Why, it’s because if ‘cognitive dissonace’. That is you can’t reconcile in your brain the initail person you were ‘sold’, with the one behind the mask.
We all default back to the ‘good’ times & block the ‘bad’, until the final penny drops & the reality of who they are & how they conduct themselves sinks in.
Stay NC & get healthy & healed. Life is about balance so, you must focus on you 😃
If you have contact, stay in your power of knowing who you are & who they are. Tell them that you know what they are & are not interested in being a ‘game piece’. Forgive them their inability to be the person that they ‘sold’ you etc….they hate it when they know you know 😃
It shut mine down, game over & we all move on. Up escalator for us, they stay on the Merry-go-round forever!
wow thanks so much everyone for your support. its been a rough time for me 😦 but at least were helping one another through our experiences with these depraved individuals. Even though were all different people our stories are so similar you’d think Sociopaths were created in a factory somewhere on a remote island! lol, but on a serious note, more people seem to be coming out with their stories, and thats a good thing, at least.
love and hugs to all of you
Esperanza
🙂
Sorry but that’s definitely not what cognitive dissonance is >.>
wow thanks. and I have to remember that. whenever he didn’t get his way he went from sweet talking me to yelling in my face and cursing at me. that’s certainly something that won’t be forgotten
Esperanza, resisting temptation is a daily struggle. Resisting the urge to believe them again is hard, really hard. They know we love them (or are addicted to them) and to them that is the key to keep control over us. That’s why no contact it’s so important at least until you are strong enough to realize that every “I’m sorry…I still love you…Why we don’t meet again…” it’s really a “what else you have that I can take?” And when you are strong enough you will not have any desire for anymore contact.
Keep your hope, your esperanza…everything will be better
This site is great. I was struggling a bit before I found this place and now I have made quite a bit of progress since. Just being able to vent or come on for support has been great. It is very scary that many of our stories are quite similar or the things they all say or do are similar as well. Also our reactions and thoughts are very similar as well. I have days where I wonder if my Spath is actually an Spath. It is sad that I have to remind myself what he did to me wasn’t normal at all and he is a sick individual for expecting me to forgive and forget that it ever happened or that it happened in the first place. They taint love for us and make us question everything we believe in.
Hi Ex D 🙂
Don’t worry whether he is a Spath or narc or whatever, just know he has a disordered mind & has hurt you 😦
You keep focusing on you & your healing & remember that whilst we have all been hurt, we are rising & healing to a greater awareness.
I found this verse today so, I’d like to share it with you 🙂
‘Be patient toward all that is unresolved in your heart….
Try to love the questions themselves….
Do not now seek the answers,
which cannot be given because you would not be able to live them,
And the point is,
To live everything.
Live the questions now.
Perhaps you will then gradually,
without noticing it,
Live along some distant day into the answers.’
Rainier Maria Rilke.
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
P.S. we are all the same empaths, being hurt by the unempathic, that’s why we are all here supporting each other 🙂
@ Lyss,
Re cognitive dissonance, tell us what you think it is.
That was my take on it from a clinical psychologist. It was simplified somewhat as I hope people will look it up themselves.
Cognitive dissonance is a phenomenon where a person’s attitude and behavior do not match, and one feels internal anxiety from it.
To reduce this anxiety, the person will change their attitude to fit in with their behavior.
For example. Someone who is strictly against smoking but has recently become stressed and took it up will experience cognitive dissonance. They will change their attitude from something like, ‘smoking kills and doing so is a death wish’ to something more like ‘everyone dies some way’ or ‘it doesn’t do that much damage’.
@Lyss,
can’t find the thread, but thanks for the feedback. Its very insightful
Broken
@Broken
It’s all on the next page if you’re wondering.
@PR
Good morning. I just read the whole chapter Identity destruction and the manufacturing of codependency the soc creates through cognitive dissonance after the initial assessment stage and love-bombing. Once they have assessed you & gauge your insecurities and things precious to you, they start saying and doing very hurtful things that are directed to deconstruct your identity and replace it by an addictive cycle created by the emotional confusion they cause with the hot and cold act. You end up looking to them for mediocre crumbs which they are happy to dish out to string you along before they attempt to discard you. I realize now because I’m intuitive and started recognizing her traits, I probably wasn’t of a “source” for her anymore…..not much fun.
I more or less explained this process to my SOC last time there was contact before her discard. This more or less made her fly into a rage to say things like, “I’m tired of being with an old man who can’t even walk. I need a young hard D*&K.. I need someone who is going to show me a good time and take me places.” Yup a real sweety
Cognitive – thought process
Dissonance – Confusion
I posted about 6 months ago my story and I’ve followed along since then to others. I have a question now though. It’s been getting close to 3 years since I finally got out of things with my soc ex. I am now actually married. My ex, as I mentioned way back when, even tried to have me commited when I tried to leave him! But now, almost 3 years later, he’s still emailing me and either something nice, or he’ll tell me he thinks that -I- lied about things despite everything he was caught doing and his last tactic is to threaten me. It happens every two weeks like clock work. I almost feel like he is writing to an audience. I don’t reply, yet they still keep coming. He’ll say things like how I clearly misunderstood things (like being cheated on?) and I should be more understanding of people. Or threaten to try and steal my dogs, things like this. Now, I live literally across the world now so the threats are starting to just bounce off. But to be honest he still scares me, and the fact that after 3 years he won’t stop…. I am scared it’ll continue forever. How do I make it stop forever? No contact isn’t working, a restraining order isn’t working… What do I do? It’s such a trigger when I get these emails…
@Lyss,
On a more humorous note, these are some of her ideas of dates:
1. Asking me to go for the long 2 hour drive to keep her while she took her 11 yr old home. She said I had to ride in the back.
2. Inviting me over for dinner & then trying to goad her psycho 25 yr old son into “fighting me”
3. Driving with an open can of beer and casually handing it to me when the cops pulled her over for speeding.
4. Taking me to her old house she had lived in when she was married and proceeded to tell me how many guys she f*&$%d there while her husband was at work.
*I grew up taking care of an alcoholic mother so I was pre-conditioned to try and fix her which is why I stayed so long. I must admit though, I do feel like a chump.
nice girl
Well.
Clearly sociopathy isn’t the only thing in her brain ;3 I think a site more along the lines of ‘datingacompleteweirdo.com’ would do her more justice
@Lyss,
That’s funny and thanks again. I remember I made the mistake of letting her “escape” to my apartment a year ago. Her mother, who she lives with, was mad at her. I let her hangout there while I was at work. She made a point of announcing got me that she “brought me art supplies” (a couple markers) and put them in my bottom desk drawer That drawer is where I keep my most personal information.: Financial, education, and military records, etc.
When she got drunk she would, describe in a very round about way. certain items I had. She would do this by saying “I wish I had…..”. She is at heart a coward, and really has the focus of a 3 yr old. She is only dangerous emotionally. And she knows from my own background that I don’t play around with people that try to rip me off. So I don’t think she is capable of doing me any real harm by having my information. And she knows that I’m astute enough to figure it out quickly and would take immediate action. The damage she caused with me was my health and emotional wellbeing, which for me, was enough.
Yes, she is a freaking weirdo. And maybe when I’m feeling better I’ll write a book of her antics, and it would probably be funny and very sad at the same time considering she is the one who is left with her own mind. Not me.
*One more thing she did was ask her own son (one of her sons) to hop in the trunk to save admission fee when the three of us were passing the ticket gate to go t an event.
A real peach that girl
Hi Lyss,
I don’t think your a monster at all as I do not know you & you have not done or offended me in any way whatsoever.
I would call anyone who hurts another individual a monster, they could be an empath, a homosexual, a person with autism.
If their intent was to harm another etc…
I would call myself a monster if I hurt someone badly enough to make them become depressed or take their own life or if I murdered them by my own hand.
Unfortunately some people here have been driven to the point of no return purely because the person they thought loved them & had their best interests at heart, betrayed them.
I don’t think my Soc/Narc or whatever is a monster either.
I do however find it appalling to be ‘targeted’ as a possession, (his words) & pathologically lied to & had my life ‘put on hold’ until he found another source of supple etc…this was my individual experience & my individuality, like yours was not a consideration to him. He wanted to control & manipulate & therefore I did not ‘grow’ independently from him, rather I was his object (I deplore objectification of anyone, including you).
I am sure, you ‘feel’ emotions but, loving is unconditional & not a ‘means to an end’.
If someone else to take advantage of your feelings I am sure you will agree. If someone used your vulnerabilities & weaknesses to manipulate you, I think you would have a different opinion.
If the people you ‘love’ use you purely for a supply source, then that is a monstrous act & I would never do that to anyone else.
I had an abusive background as a child but, fortunately I did not let that change my mind to, hurting others on my quest to have ‘power’ or play games etc….
I’m a mother & I want to nurture my children into ‘free willed’ & ‘free thinking’ independent people & I protect them as best I can from abuse.
I teach them to never accept the unacceptable, from others as no-one deserves to be treated without compassion & love& humanity.
If an action is designed to hurt or abuse or strip someone of their humanity, then that is not worthy of who you are, you deserve the best, everyone does.
I wish you love & light & I truly do 🙂
As long as you are not harming another by your actions, I have nothing against you or anyone really.
PR xoxo
@Pheonix Rising
I must say, I found your most recent comment extremely contradictory to your previous one.
“If someone used your vulnerabilities & weaknesses to manipulate you, I think you would have a different opinion.”
I cannot really comment much more on this one, as I assumed you would have been able to acknowledge the fact that, as a sociopath, I would not get absorbed enough to allow them to get to that point. That is not to say I would not let them in, however I do believe sociopaths are a lot more emotionally intelligent in that way, as to be able to shove aside their emotions to be able to look at everything objectively, and when I were to see what they were attempting to do, I would easily leave, no emotions there as I can take them at will.
I guess that causes much frustration between empaths and sociopaths; the fact that sociopaths basically think, ‘why not just not be stupid and use your brain and leave’, meanwhile empaths are thinking, ‘if you think it’s that easy you’re the stupid one’. From what I gather, anyway.
You mentioned “a means to an end”, when referring to love. I don’t think you quite understand what I mean. There is no end to the love, it’s still love, the only conditions put on it are, ‘if you become a complete dickhead, I’ll just take my emotions elsewhere without a second thought’. I don’t steal money from him, I don’t do any of that, it’s basically normal relationship terms aside from the lack of residual feelings after the termination of the relationship.
It’s hard to think how the majority of the people here manage to pick such bad people, mainly because I do look at all flaws in everyone and don’t ‘fall’ in love. For a very long time my thoughts to everyone who dated someone like that was, ‘you’re the idiot for going into a relationship like that, not them.’ There are signs. I’m not talking about sociopathic signs, as I said before, the majority of the women here on this site pick dickheads, but dickhead is not equivalent to sociopath. People like the people I’ve read women rant about on this site WOULD HAVE basically screamed ‘HEY I’m going to ruin your life’, and somehow they go ‘that’s ok I’ll let you anyway, for some strange reason, then I’ll cry about it later and say it was your fault’
^Veeeery blunt. But think about it.
If you have any more questions, feel free to ask.
Hi Lyss,
I wasn’t being contradictory & I relate to each person here individually & my response to Broken about his relationship, not everyone else.
My Soc was a charismatic one/covert narcissist & appeared for some time as the hero, not the villain in my life so, I did not run screaming & probably never would have as it was only another woman that alerted me to his behavior. I was none the wiser & was being kept in his ‘collection’ but, I had no clue of his activities until after I was informed via email…it’s a long story.
My Soc used the ‘mind-gaming’, hypnotic influence & was very charming & normally stayed in the seduction persona with me & I rarely saw the mask slip until after the ‘fog’ lifted.
He worked 2 jobs, & we did not live together as we both had our own homes etc…
As you said & I reiterated, each person is different & so is everyone here’s journey.
We are not ‘Soc’ haters, just haters of the experience that our own Soc/Narc etc…created in our lives.
I would have run screaming if I had been given a heads up earlier & the fact that mine has duped a Dr of Sociology (she now sees this) , he is very clever & crafty & involves enablers & followers as he does it withing his family, at work & in his private life etc…he used to call himself my ‘Master’, I thought it was a joke but, he is supremely delusional & full blown, like Richard Fuld, Lehman Brothers type….mine is covert though & not overt.
I didn’t run screaming until I realized what I was dealing with & I am still running & he has tried to triangulate me back in! I am forever in NC.
@ lyss, your last comment To PR just shows how little you understand. You will never understand because you don’t have the level of emotions that we do. It made me laugh out loud when you said that sociopaths in this case have a higher emotional intelligence. That is not what emotions are about. You probably have a higher rational intelligence because you can devoid yourself of emotions at a blink. That is not a higher emotional intelligence, that is the opposite. It is removing the emotions. Which is completely the opposite to understanding them. Which is what emotional intelligence is. You have already shown in our previous conversations that you do not understand what motivates us. You can not comprehend it. even when you thought you had, you got it wrong. That comes from not understanding our emotions.
As well, you have said yourself that there are different sociopaths. All your comments have been based on your experience and how you feel and act which is basically good (in a weird sociopathic way) There are sociopaths out there that want to hurt people. That don’t believe that they should live by the rules. That want to squash empaths for whatever reason. When someone slights them, they want to hurt that person because they believe that they are better than us and how dare we do that to them. Where is the proof… all over this site and the others like it. There is even proof on sociopath world from the sociopaths own mouths.
You say that you don’t understand how we picked bad people. We didn’t, we picked a wonderful, caring, loving guy (or girl) that had the same values as us, as that is what they showed us they were. They pretended to us so convincingly that they were these amazing people. They lied on purpose to get us to love them. Just because you are a “good” sociopath does not mean that all the others are. Just the same as not all empaths are good. Our mistake is not realising that sociopaths existed. That Bad sociopaths existed. That people could pretend to love someone. I am sure in some of their cases, and even probably mine, they thought that they were doing us a favour by being everything we wanted and in their own way they “loved” us. But they couldn’t keep up the appearance. They couldn’t’ pretend for long. and when we slighted them, they got angry. And when we weren’t as perfect as they thought – they got mean, and when we showed signs that we may leave, they punished us for their perceived abandonment. Or even, when they started to care to much they left us. We did not choose bad people. we were lied to and manipulated and we stayed because of the cognitive dissonance because we wanted to believe that they were who they said they were so much that our brains convinced us they were and it was us not them.
As you have said, there are many different types of sociopaths. In our experience, mostly bad. I think that everyone here should be aware that you speak from one point of view of a certain type of sociopath. And although it can give us insight, by your own admission , you are not all the same.
I am glad that you have managed to use your sociopathness for good. But people here need to be aware, that you are the minority and the proof of that is from the terrible things that these people ahve done. Most of the sociopaths talked about here have not jsut walked away, they have tried to destroy that persons reputation, life, friends, family – everything. These actions are not the consequences of someone who has just switched off and walked away, they are of people that are trying to purposfully and maliciously destroy the one that they once “loved”. I am glad that is not you. but read the stories here and you will see that you are the minority.
@Pheonix Rising
Psychologists, psychiatrists, people who study sociology – the majority of them are fools. They’re trained to listen to people’s problems and no more. They think they’re intelligent, that they could detect almost anything, but honestly they’re even easier to fool than most people.
@It Is Done
You say you understand your emotions and I do not. Yet, it must take some level of comprehension to be able to control them, and it also implies a very little understanding to not be able to control them. Knowledge is power, after all.
There are different sociopaths, I have said that many times indeed. And that’s not to say the ‘good’ ones want to live by the rules. They don’t. they just do it, with spite. There is one reason for the existence of rules and one only; to govern those who do not have the intelligence to make their own. You may read that as ‘fuck the rules do bad things’ but that’s not what I mean at all. Sociopaths create their own rules, whether that be anywhere near your standards or not. For example (and example only) some of mine are don’t fuck with something unless it’s broken, always look when you cross the road, and don’t be a sheep. Others create other rules. It depends on the personality f the person as to which rules they create.
As I said, the majority of people here whine about dickheads that THEY chose, not sociopaths.
If you honestly think ‘good’ sociopaths are the minority, look around you. Approximately 1% of people are sociopaths, heck your best friend may be. They don’t have a site for people who date ‘nice’ sociopaths. By saying we’re a minority, is like saying you’ve never seen a giraffe in your life therefore they don’t exist, or saying you’ve seen one giraffe and therefore coming to the conclusion they must be severely endangered. It’s ignorance, and I guess to you, that’s bliss.
There ARE signs to everyone’s personality and who they are. It’s easy to tell, within a minute, even, who that person is, why they are like they are, what issues they face and what issues you will face because of them. It’s called analysing someone, reading into their words, their actions, their appearance. I assumed you knew how to do it from the get go. My bad. Learn. It helps.
@ lyss,
No, i didn’t say that you didn’t understand YOUR emotions, I said you didn’t understand OUR emotions. Being able to control someone doesnt’ mean you understand their emotions, it just means that you can rationally deduce that if I do this, then that person will do that. As my ex very quickly learned, I did not react the same way as his ex wife did, yet he expected me too. Infact, i believe that he left me because he couldnt figure me out as i did not react the way he expected. This is because you can understand the symptom but not understand the problem. Sociopths read the reaction and can logically deduce how to “shepard” that person but still don’t understand the emotional reason why.
With regards to your comments about the giraffe and 1% of the population, rather than a giraffe, why dont we use the term devil. I only have your word saying that these people exist and are good. I have no more proof than god exists – just your belief, because if they do exist and are good, how are you going to prove it? You yourself are asocial, so you don’t insert yourself into society normally so how do you know? Those that are “good” may appear that way but we dont’ know what damage they are doing at home, to their family, to their children through their own self serving lives. Therefore, You can also tie that in to your comments about rules. Again, you talk about (and i may have misunderstood here as your communication is a bit confusing here) good sociopaths living by the rules and yet now you are saying that sociopaths make their own rules, and as already discussed, sociopaths are self serving because they are not connected to the living by empathy as the rest of us are. Therefore your rules may be good to you, and how you perceive them to be good to everyone else but they will still be based on what is self serving to you and what you perceive as good, which undoubtedly misses the mark on occasion no matter how good because you dont’ understand our motivation or empathy or compassion which (coming full circle) connects us to everyone else.
Again, your last comment made me laugh. You will never get it. You may be able to get insight into who you think we are but you dont’. You just get the symptoms. I find it amusing that you sociopaths call us sheep. Your own ego’s just think that you do. We believe the same about you sociopaths, we just don’t use the derogatory term. You all act the same in the end. You react the same way to certain triggers. You behave the same way in situations. I understand and read people on a level you never can. I just choose not to control them by that understanding because my empathy knows how wrong that is.
Now I am aware that sociopaths exist, you can be sure that I will spot the next one a mile away. It’s quite easy to do. Because of those triggers and behaviours i just talked about.
@It Is Done
“No, i didn’t say that you didn’t understand YOUR emotions, I said you didn’t understand OUR emotions.”
You’re again referring to sociopaths as if they are not human. We all have the same emotions, just to different extents. JUST like the variety in ‘normal’ people. What may make you overjoyed might make some other empathy slightly happy and it might make a sociopath somewhere in between. It’s the ability to control those emotions that separate us.
So, in accordance to your ex, if you think he broke up with you because he couldn’t figure you out compared to his ex-wife then man, get your head out of your ass. He broke up with you for other reasons, I can guarantee.
“Why don’t we use the term devil.” That comment has absolutely no value in this discussion whatsoever. Please, elaborate. And please, explain why you completely disregarded the actual purpose of my comment.
We do create our own rules, however we are smart enough to realise it’s not the most appropriate move to break society’s rules at certain points in time. The fact that we have to abide by some of these stupid rules, is what annoys us.
“You will never get it”
How many times do I have to hear that before you realise you get way less than you think you do, too?
“I understand and read people on a level you never can.”
Lol.
So you talk about how you were fooled by some guy so badly, then al the sudden that one experience turned EVERYTHING around and now you’re a psychologist?
I repeat. Get your head out of your ass. I’m clearly not the egotistical one here.
You couldn’t spot one for the life of you. Not if they have any smart to them.
I do not wish to reply to someone who is so unbelievably hypocritical anymore, if you have anything of value to say then sure, I’ll read and reply, if not, I tire with your idiocies and your contradictories and your naivety and ignorance and your bad attempts at hiding how emotional you are.
@Lyss,
I read your post to POS about there not being any therapy out there for people with AsPd. Actually I believe there are some options. Behavioral therapy points directly to cost/risk assessment. aka “If I do this, then that is going to happen.” IF you could identify those areas/behaviors that you would like to harness and point in a more positive direction, it might work. Impulse control, rage control, and decision making would be key. There would not be a spiritual element that would relieve your boredom or emptiness.
I’m currently working a twelve step program and you might want to look into that as well. Just google 12-steps. There is a protocol to following them (you have a sponsor or mentor), but the payoff for many people is remarkable. Its not holy roller stuff, its about developing a connection with a power greater than ourselves. Again, its a personal process that needs other people at the same time. It is a very non-judgemental environment that may well provide you with a spiritual element that would relieve your boredom or emptiness.
I hope I didn’t offend you as I am only trying to help
@Broken
Not meant to be rude but, isn’t that just learning how to have a better mask? You can lead a horse to water but you can’t force it to drink.
Impulse control training I could use (although unsure of how on earth that would go down) but I really don’t believe any of the others would help. I hardly have a sense of spirituality and personally find it an unnecessary concept.
Plus, I don’t think I’d be able to work with people >.>
Glad it’s helping you, however ^^
@ PR, thanks lovely. You are spot on as always. Yet, I have a desire to respond, even though i know I am wasting my breath, I feel the need. I know it’s not wise and I am aware that she will never understand, so yes, I am now banging my head on a wall. But i want to try a logical discussion and see if she can be as logical and unemotional as she claims she can be (and yet just disproved).
@ lyss, first off, I was not trying to offend you, but obviously I hit a nerve. If you cared that I felt bad for doing that, I would feel bad for doing that, but as you don’t, I wont waste my emotions. So let me respond to your last comments logically, paragraph by paragraph.
You say we all have the same emotions just different levels, but you are wrong, and you know it, as by the very definition of a sociopath you lack empathy and compassion. They are massive emotions to miss. But as you don’t have them you don’t’ understand that nor the massive difference that this makes. Again, these emotions are what connects us all. You are human obviously, but you are different because you are not connected to us as we are too each other through empathy and compassion. But also because of this, you don’t understand the rules, but you will never understand that, no matter what I say. It is so much more than the ability to control emotions that differentiate us, and that my friend is what you can never understand. That you don’t feel nor understand empathy and compassion you don’t realise how big these emotions are and how they motivate everything we do and how they magnify all the other emotions. Yes, different levels of emotions are amongst us all. Yet let me reiterate: the definition of a sociopath is (amongst other traits) they do not have empathy and compassion. That is not a different level. That is none!
Your attempt to upset me with comments about my ex only serve to add to my arguments. Furthermore, how can you guarantee why my ex broke up with me? Do you know him? Do you know what type of sociopath he is? You have no idea. According to you he is probably not even a sociopath, so how would you know why he broke up with me? I see that comment as having no context to our discussion other than an attempt to rattle me. Either that or you are assuming that you know all sociopaths and how they behave. If the latter is the case, then It is ok for you to assume that you know everything about all sociopaths and me and my ex but it is not ok for me to do that about the sociopaths that I know or have heard of… hmmm that sounds hypercritical to me. Except I at least know a multiple of sociopaths and my ex and how he behaved which is more than what you do. Unless I completely missed the point of that comment which is possible as you were not clear.
Next para: My context of the term devil refers to your giraffe analogy. Your analogy of the giraffe in my opinion was flawed as we only have your word that good sociopaths exist. So I suggested that rather than a giraffe in the analogy, substitute the devil (or god if that makes you happier). Because we have no proof that the devil (or god) exists either. The same as nothing htat you have said is proving that good sociopaths exist. I’m not saying they don’t, but you are just saying I am good Believe me! Why should we? We have more proof that they are all bad. You say that sociopaths are good but there is multiple examples of extremely bad behaviour by sociopaths and yet, I haven’t seen any good ones (but as you said, they may be hidden in society therefore I wouldn’t).
Furthermore you say “this is how sociopaths think and behave” on one hand yet then on the other you say “not all sociopaths are the same” which is it? You then went on to say that you (as a sociopath) make your own rules. You try to stick to societies rules but as you do not understand the motivation behind our rules this ensures that eventually you will break our rules, even if it was accidental. You say you are smart enough not to break society’s rules yet you are “annoyed by these stupid rules”, how long till you slip and break one because it didn’t suit you because you make your own rules? You see what I mean? You are not making sense. Maybe you will abide by all the rules, maybe you wont. Anyway, At this point you are the only good sociopath that I have heard of. I am sure if there is one giraffe there must be more, but again, I only have your word that you are a giraffe.
Funnily enough, I actually believe that you are what you say you are and logically it makes sense that there are different sociopaths that have different motivations and different levels of good and bad, But your good is different to ours because you don’t and can’t relate (because of no empathy and compassion). But how do I really know you are a giraffe? By your own admission, you lie – already you are breaking the rules. By your own admission you cause problems in your relationship because you get bored or are triggered – but you are right, non sociopaths do that too but we are not talking about them.
But ok, I accept and believe that you are really trying to be good and on the whole you are. And if there is one, then there has to be others. I get that. But just because you are good, certainly doesn’t prove that all the others are too. You talk as if speaking for all sociopaths and know all sociopaths and it appears from your comments that anyone whose ex hasn’t reacted the way you would have, therefore he couldn’t be a sociopath just a dickhead. Now who is generalising? even though there is proof all over this site? I think that most of these people would have been able to deduce if their ex has empathy or not. Once the rose coloured glasses are lifted and the cognitive dissonance is removed, we know. Suddenly all those red flags that we ignored because we wanted to believe in the good in people scream to us the truth. That you think you are so much smarter than all of us is one of the sociopaths biggest weaknesses.
So on to the next paragraph, With the “you will never get it comment” haha, lets agree to disagree. I think if you could think like we did for one day, you would be blown away with how much we really understand of your disorder and how little you really get us. Remember we can put ourselves in your shoes (as we have empathy) but you can’t in ours! If you could you would have empathy and then you wouldn’t be a sociopath. But I call stalemate as its “he said she said”. But I know (sorry, couldn’t help myself)
Your next para, Again, your attempt to insult me by bringing up my ex and telling me my head is up my arse… Very logical and great debating intelligence there. Impressive. And assuming that I now think I am a psychologist…. Sorry but two things to say to that… firstly, who is the hypocrite? You who knows everything about all the sociopaths in the world and how many good ones have you met? Yourself and your father and by your own admission your father is a bad one. Secondly, you don’t know my experience, nor what or how I have learnt from the experience. I could go into it but you wouldn’t understand. You can’t. If you can, you are not a sociopath. Since learning about sociopathy I have actually spotted 4 others that I know. Without a doubt. Believe me or not. Don’t care. But according to you, they cant be smart then or are not socipaths at all. Even though 2 of them are in extremely high positions in billion dollar companies. But they must be dumb. Once you know what a sociopath is and you learn to trust yourself, you can spot them a mile off. But you wont believe me because it goes against your thoughts and what you need to believe so that you are right – or that is how it appears from your reaction to my comments.
Your last paragraph, again is not doing your argument that sociopaths are intelligent and in control of themselves and their emotions any good. You insult me because you disagree with what I have said. This is a discussion and I have not purposefully insulted you. If you perceive that i have then know that this was not my intention, yet you automatically assumed it was and attacked with personal insults. How do you know I can not spot one? I didn’t realise that you knew me that well? . This is good behaviour? I was merely putting forward my opinion, which may have been off the mark, but nothing that you have just said has disabused that notion. I am proud of how emotional I am and have no desire to hide my emotions at all. They are a strength. You seem to imply they are a weakness and that is another thing that you will never understand. Once we reach a level of spiritual awareness, our emotions actually make us stronger and more alive. I have actually enjoyed my debate with you. It has actually made me look logically at feelings and emotions and empathy and humanity in a new light. I have found it fascinating. Just because my comments somehow insulted you though you have got nasty with personal insults. Again – a bit hypercritical and none to logical or smart.
Lastly, let me just say, I agree with you that it is not fair that we tar all sociopaths with the same brush. I agree with you that there are different levels of sociopaths. But unlike a homosexual or another minority group, those sociopaths that are bad are really really really bad and destructive and abusive because of their disorder. And those that are really good, are not able to love us how we need/deserve to be loved and treated. But i personally try to judge each person and each sociopath on their own merits. As I said in one of my previous comments, I really do feel bad for all of you but particularly for those like you that try to live with in “rules” that they don’t’ understand. It is not fair that it is like this. I can even understand why it makes you angry, however, it doesn’t change that you don’t and can never understand. I realise after the last comments that this annoys you, but this is the truth as I see it. I agree with you that it is unfair. Life is unfair. . If I knew you and believed that you were trying to be good regardless of your disorder then of course I would treat you with respect and friendship. But I would need to know the rules. Your rules as well ( I already know mine) so that it was a fair playing ground. But you would only get one chance.
Again, if you have misread read my comments as an attack, this was not my intention. But just because I don’t completely agree with your comments does not mean that my head is up my arse. It just means that I have an opinion and that the type of sociopath that I have dealt with and those hundreds of empaths that I have talked with and listened to that have dealt with them realise that 1) you are not the norm and 2) that as they don’t follow the rules (which by the way are based on morality and understanding other’s feelings and compassion) that they make their own and that will always be based on self serving motives, which is dangerous and 3) that you have to tread very carefully, otherwise they very quickly put your head up your own arse.
Happy for you not to respond. as i realise that you will not agree with most i have said. And unless you have anything of value to add then please don’t. If you do, try not to revert to personal insults, it doesnt do any justice to your argument. Furthermore, this is a healing website, lets stick to that shall we? I just want everyone to remember that you are not the norm and all soc’s don’t behave and act like you do. It will not help with their healing if they believe that the guy who broke their ribs and keyed their car because they lost control of them is really a good person or not a sociopath.
@It Is Done
Oh look another thing you don’t understand. You hit no nerve, you didn’t get me to back up and want to fight. I have the exact same expression right now as I did writing my first comment. It’s me being blunt. Not angry. Make the distinction.
Empathy is not an emotion, empathy is connecting to other people’s emotions. It has nothing to do with the person itself, only those around them.
And again, I do not attempt to insult you at all. I’m just being extremely blunt. I get tired of putting pleasantries in every paragraph I write, and I figure over time people would understand it’s just me becoming more comfortable and not wanting to beat around the bush.
I’ll reword “get your head out of your ass” for you. “Um, sorry but, I find it slightly hypocritical to call sociopaths egocentric and yet you’re boasting about how you can spot any sociopath anywhere, and that it was your ex’s fault he broke up with you, because you’re apparently mysterious, and it couldn’t be because he maybe didn’t like you? I’m terribly sorry to be so blunt about it, I just thought it would be good to think about. Didn’t mean to insult anyone!!”
See how much easier it was to just say it bluntly.
About the giraffes, it has nothing to do with whether they exist or not, it was you claiming they are the minority. So that point of yours is invalid.
All sociopaths have some traits in common, that’s what makes it able to be labelled. The only thing sociopaths all have in common is the fact that they lack empathy, HOWEVER this lack of empathy causes a few things, some extremely prominent and some much less (for example, sociopaths WILL think a different way because of their lack of empathy. However, pathological lying, is a trait caused by lack of empathy only over half have).
“By your own admission you cause problems in your relationship because you get bored or are triggered – but you are right, non sociopaths do that too but we are not talking about them.”
Well why aren’t we talking about them? Why label someone as something and add these traits in yet other people do it too? It’s not a sociopath thing! It’s a HUMAN thing!
You say it appears from your comments blahblah.. and then ask who’s generalising now. You can’t do that. You can’t assume, then ask a question about the assumption before I even verify your assumption was correct. Sorry, no. You SHOULDN’T. Because you just wasted your breath asking me a question when your assumption was incorrect. Well done.
You can’t put yourself in our shoes, nor can we put ourselves in yours. You do not know what it is like being void of empathy and you cannot possibly fathom it. Nor can we fathom what having empathy must be like. Again. “Pretty please so sorry stop being so high and mighty like we’re not equal”.
Ohmygosh. Four? That’s so many! There’s only approximately 69,999,996 more left in the world for you to discover! Your powers are truly limitless!
(Now that was plain mockery.)
Next paragraph, I do not really need to go over seeming as you didn’t insult me, I didn’t purposely insult you, was just being extremely blunt, heck take it as constructive criticism 😀
Woo you agree with something.
Again, didn’t take it as an attack but ok
You do not have the place to judge what the norm is when you’re on a site specifically dedicated to the rotten ones. Of course no one is going to write an article here about how good their best friend sociopath was, it’s basically a sociopath hate site, masked as a healing site.
Then again, bitching does seem to ‘heal’ many people.
@It Is Done
And again, pretty please stop using cognitive dissonance when you don’t know what it means.
Bored now lyss.
You added nothing new. So typical.
Cheers
@It Is Done
Awh, yet you say sociopaths are the ones who get bored and can’t see things through.
The only reason I repeat is because you make the same mistakes over and over. OH LOOK another sociopathic trait, not learning from experience.
Maybe you’re the messed up one 😉
Whelp, bye.
@PR
I just thought of something…….If I was showering or using the toilet she would come into the bathroom. I felt like she was doing it to make me uncomfortable.
Yes, they like to over step the boundaries 😦
I had 10 years of ‘grooming’ so, it was gradual & subtle & not so subtle especially if I annoyed him!
Years ago, he tried to make me have sex with him at my office!
I literally had to fight him off & became quite distressed & told him to leave & I said to him, ‘I can’t believe you did that!’.
For years, he mimicked what I said back to me & I just shook my head in disbelief. He told me I was being silly & over reacted!
No, I was silly to have even bothered with him!
I hope your still on your road to recovery 🙂
Stay focused on you & remember to separate this world from your ‘real’ world & get back to the land of the living, not the living dead that these disordered minds are! 🙂
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
P.S. apologies Lyss if that sounds offensive but, I truly don’t believe you are fully ‘alive’, without feelings of conscience or empathy.
Again, no need for apologies in case of me taking offense – I won’t.
I am starting to see how ‘life’ and being ‘alive’ can be defined subjectively or objectively.
I love, I cry, I laugh, I have a personality and I must say you’re not the first person to say I’m any less alive or human.
In fact, monster has seemed more fitting for many people.
But if you’re so good at empathising, tell me this, how would you feel is someone said because you grew up differently, and therefore think of the world differently, you are less of a person? That you are not truly alive merely because you are not another clone in the world?
While I do not care whether you pity me, hate me, or what, it angers me that you’re selectively empathetic and you don’t realise it. There’s a neurodiversity movement in the world but sociopaths are categorically excluded. Homosexuality, femininity, autism, hell, a broken leg, that’s all ok to you lot, yet for some reason sociopathy isn’t. They’re a minority just like sociopaths.
Tell me, what if empaths were the ones who were left out of this movement, if they were told they were less human, would that make sense to you? No, because you’re part of that group. Because *you’re* the selfish ones, you’re the ones who can’t take blame, and there could never be anything ‘wrong’ with you, because you’re perfection, right?
What angers me possibly even more is that most people would get offended by my comment and take it as an attack. There are only a few people intelligent enough to realise there’s a goddamn good point in what I say, and I’m not trying to attack anyone, just get people to open their minds for once and listen to something other than the sound of their own bloody voice.
If you prove intelligent enough to comprehend what I’m saying and actually absorb it rather than refute it like everyone else, your reply will be valued and I thank you.
However, if you choose to block your ears with your fingers and scream LALALALA then go ahead, but don’t then turn around and scream MONSTER when I rightfully get angry.
the soc has left me again this time taking my money and some of my jewellery then had the upmost fun in mind games and lied he hadnt …. he was then ironing his clothes and said he was going clubbing … his code word for out on the pull …. let him ive had enough …. i so want to call the police on him for all the things hes done inc everything else but i have no proof ….. why do these ppl always come out smelling of roses its just not fair …. ive been violated in everyway possible
Trying to convince a Sociopath/Narc or whatever they are is like ‘screaming under water’, they cannot hear but, they drown in their own dribble eventually as the predictability & patterning as you mentioned gives them away. They love a debate but, soon change it up if it’s not to their liking & yes, the ‘sheep’ analogy appears.
We are not sheep but, live in a society that makes us queue & Soc’s also have to wait in line like ‘sheep’ 😉
As we know the signs now & are more aware, we will look beyond the facade & we will still love but, with healthy boundaries. 🙂
If a Soc remains controlled & contains their emotions & channels them constructively, that would be great but, they cannot as they get bored & need to ‘stir’ etc…& the games begin. Regardless of whether they are monogamous or not, life is in a constant state of flux!
I could not be bothered with the ‘roller coaster ride’ or the ‘Mad Mouse’,
I prefer the ‘Ferris wheel’, look at the view from all aspects & smell the roses type life 🙂
You just put the biggest smile on my face 🙂 still laughing! You are spot on and i know you are, i was just interested to see what her response would be. I have a feeling that I have reached the point of banging my head on the wall, but still, as you know, I do find it interesting debating with these guy’s.
I am doing really well. I have reached a new level. I feel like the soc is so far in my past now. I recently had a falling out with my best friend. She treated me abominably and i have cut her off. This, along side my last embryo not taking, put me into a massive depression however, it was short lived as I put into practice all that I have learnt. I came out of it with realising that the drama of the ex Soc was truly behind me. I have finally (4 months on) started looking for a job and am looking after myself properly for the first time in years, and all this spiritual learning really is starting to be put into practice and i am starting to believe in myself like never before. I have started dating again but if nothing comes of it then i am great with that too. I am now looking at the next steps in getting that family i so badly want and that has included a complete overhaul of why my perfect little embryos are not taking. Turns out I probably have PCOS which no one picked up on (GRRRR). Anyway, life is good and if i coudl just get the right job, it would really be fantastic.
How are you going? What’s been happening with you?
Cheers
It is Done.
The problem with “making one’s own rules” is exactly why I can’t spend time with the sociopath. He changes th arbitrarily (can we just say makes $hit up?) to suit his whims, desires and mood. Completely disrespects my time w the last-min change ups, and this just isn’t The Soc Show!
Exactly Jusa,
Most of them are like children playing a game that they made the rules too and when they start to “loose” they change the rules to suit them. Or they have a tantrum and quit the game. If we are really unlucky, they will throw the board at us too and hit us in the eye.
@PR,
I want to jump in on the sheep thing! When my SOC tried to throw that dominance weirdness at me, I politely would compare our own lives.
I’m self-supporting financially. She’s a parasite and lives off her mothers purse strings. I served our country. She lives off the state.
I take care of my own problems and don’t wait to get conveniently bailed out by someone else. She does.
I have a severe learning disability but earned a masters degree. Her parents paid for 3 false starts in college which she did nothing with.
I try to look past my own needs in order to see what the needs are of those around me. I will do my best and not make excuses to meet those needs She is only concerned with her own needs and uses her kids as an excuse to shield her from taking responsibility for anything.
I take care of my aging parents. She mooches of her aging parent. Her family, including her kids think she is a loser. My family, including my kids, think I’m a hero.
I’m thinking to myself….”Sure babe…you’re a real hard charger:)”
@Broken
I was referring to more in the personality, not lifestyle. However it is interesting you brought that up.
A lot of sociopaths do have extreme poor future planning and can’t see anything through. But a lot also teach themselves to be better or at least more intelligent about their impatience. Self awareness, I do believe, is a big part of this; if you’re aware of what you’re doing it’s obviously going to be much easier to stop. Not easy, but not impossible.
For example, I, as I previously mentioned, have never taken money from anyone (aside from my father, but lets be honest now that’s justified), I’m in university/college/whatever people around the world call it, about to get my first degree, wish to get another, have have a strict plan to stick to afterwards (I have to or else I lose my mind panicking that I won’t have anything to do). I was, however, absolutely horrible in school assignments if they spanned over too long a time period, I’d start really well but I’d get bored so easily. I still did them, and the way I learned to counter this behaviour is to (yes you might laugh) do it the night before. The sense of ‘ok lyss, it reaaaally needs to be done now or else bitch teacher no.4 is going to crack it’ actually made me produce some of the best work, while it taking a short enough time for me to only get marginally bored with it, so the level stayed consistent.
Obviously, every person is different, and experiences lend a hand in this.
Another thing I strongly believe; sociopaths should not have kids. I don’t care what kind of sociopath you are, if you do not have empathy, you’re never going to feel for them as much as a parent should/would, unless you fake, and that’s either going to make you very very depressed or your child depressed. Especially from a woman’s point of view, as we’re supposed to be the caring nurturing ones. People are disgusted when they hear a mother who doesn’t *completely* care for her child. At least not the way they should.
There are some exceptions, obviously, as there has to be to accommodate extraneous factors. But on a basis, unless you’re an exception for some damn good reason, a sociopath having a child leads to disaster.
On another point, who wants to bring someone into this world? This world is unfair and going downhill, everything is messed up, bringing a person into this that doesn’t need to be is cruel, at least to me.
The family thing related a lot to the child thing, slightly different obviously as there is no preset giver-taker relationship as they are all adults. But the same concept. I’ve always struggled with family, I don’t see the point, and they’re quite honestly disgusting people in my family. I’m talking about triggers galore, and so I stay away. But some people use their family, obviously because the family sets off no triggers. But eh, each to their own.
@Lyss. I wish I could say that my Spath was just a dickhead. It would have been easier to move on I think 😦 What kind of man is in a relationship with me, takes my money, promises me the world and secretly marries someone else. For me, this came out of nowhere. Yes, my instincts were screaming at me but in my wildest dreams I would never have thought a man would be capable of such a betrayal. He Then tells me I am the crazy one and I should be over his betrayal. He has everything with this women that I was waiting for with him. He took my heart, ripped it apart and can’t even say sorry for what he did.
Btw, I find what you say very insightful and I like how you are blunt.
If it’s their idea, they are happy as they call the shots. Mine would ask me out & if I said, i will see etc…then say okay, he would then say, sorry Darl, i forgot & somethings come up at work etc…
If i asked him to accompany me i knew to ask months in advance & then have to remind him. He would wait until the day before to say yes or no, this was a ploy in case something better came along. They are opportunists so, it’s always in their control. They love to say ‘sorry’ darling but, sorry to them is like, ‘pass the salt’ 😱😜😁
Sorry is hollow, like comittment, like them. I used to ask & if he wouldn’t commit etc…i’d say, don’t worry then, i am happy to go in my own anyway & was. He would often change tack then & come! A lot if times, i didn’t even ask him as I couldn’t be bothered with the maybe baby so, got on with my life & went & had a great time 😃
It was nice to go & no cater to Mr, never leave my side!
Lul,
PR xoxo off to gym 😁😱
Please don’t start name calling & games etc… We are emotional, we are empaths, you are not.
Don’t make this a battle of intelligence etc…we don’t need to compete or strain our ‘new found PhD in disordered minds’.
We have nothing to prove to you, or defend but, we will defend each other & I don’t appreciate your tone!
Besides, it’s Arse, not Ass! An Ass is a donkey 😁
So don’t act like one as we are not vets!
Desiderata,
The trotting out (no pun intended) of the word “sheep” whenever a highly sociopathic person disagrees with one possessing more empathy is a tiresome tactic. It reflects an undeserved innate sense of superiority on the Sociopath’s part. However, what is so superior about seeing the rules society operates by and then choosing to not obey any of them? Most people can see society’s rules, sociopathic or not, and can choose whether to obey them or not. There is no specialness in that. It is not unique or noteworthy.
However, people lower on the sociopathic scale have the capacity for introspection and sometimes realize that maybe not all their self-produced rules are better than society’s. As mentioned before, our limbic brain and the empathy it empowers, is what allows society to even exist in the first place. Its existence benefits all of humanity, even those sociopaths that rue its existence and despise how it hems them in. It is difficult to imagine what our world would look like if everyone set his own rules and there was no reciprocal understanding of what certain actions or behaviors would likely produce from others. The TV show “The Walking Dead” comes to mind, but even there the survivors show a great deal of empathy, so I don’t know. It probably wouldn’t be a pretty place.
The fact that the “sheep” are now aware that the self-professed “superior wolves” exist and have developed tactics to ward them off or “defang them” seems to anger the wolves to a high degree. One of sheeps’ effective tactics is “herding” together on sites like these to share what works against the wolves and what does not. It is easy to see why the anger develops. After all the pool of prey is made smaller and their “jobs” harder.
@ Agoodplan 🐑
From one sheep to another, Baa 😃
Sometimes I say Baa-stard! Lol
Great answer & thanks for you great posts.
On a side note,
A programe on TV last night re Physchpaths & assorted other nuts aired. A self professed physco/soc?
was an expert opinion etc…he seemed harmless until he said, the human race cannot survive without physcho’s that lack empathy etc…& war as an example, who better to battle the enemy (perceived enemy) than a person that lacks conscience & empathy!
He actually sounded convincing but, no one countered him with, wars probably would never start if it wasn’t about greed & power & domination so, me thinks I’d rather live in a Soc/Narc or Pathy free world. Baa Baa
PR xoxo
Thanks PR. Your comments have often provided a very welcome dose of spirituality or humor when I needed it. Keep it up!
I am a businessman and realize it would be a quicker and easier way to wealth to just rob my customers each time they came in. However, I think it would be hard to get any repeat business out of them. ;). Being able to think a few steps ahead and see the impacts that changing the “rules” to robbery from customer service would have on business and society provide enough of a reason not to do so. The law on the books isn’t what makes me not do it.
I think I have figured out what the world might look like if everyone made and obeyed his own rules. It would be the TV show The Walking Dead. Only there would be no survivors only Zombies walking around gnawing on each other’s necks. Not sure what that would do to ratings because it isn’t much of a plot line.
Lots of love AGPT. Or in sheep talk. Baa Ba Baah BBBB 🙂
@ AGPT 😃
I have the same business values & good customer service is ‘paramount’ to repeat business.
Keep up the great work in all aspects of your life & within yourself.
Integrity & good values, trust etc…all the things I once admired in my Soc but, silly old sheepish me, I was seeing myself reflected back & no wonder I was impressed! Lol, I should have just brought a Mirror!
‘Ah, what lovely eye’s you have my dear’ , yep, one of his favourite lines!
Biggest Red Flag, plus his collection of Royal Doulton Ladies, his oxy-moron behavior etc….
Still, you could have wrapped me in Red Flags & I would have stood in a bull ring saying, ‘I hate animal cruelty’, let the Bull Shit artist go free!
Lol
Love PR xoxo
You did it again. The ending to that post gave me the best laugh of the day! 🙂
A business friend of mine used to say ” You can give a man haircut a hundred times. You can only scalp him once!”
I was thinking about what this so called military expert said. It is not true. I have military training and experience and am an avid military history fan. Military effectiveness,in large,part stems from unit training,organization and cohesiveness. Cohesiveness comes from knowing and trusting what your squad mates and chain of command will do when the stuff hits the fan. You will probably be pretty unmotivated if you can’t trust the person beside you or behind you. These elements are what allowed the Roman Legions to defeat Germanic armies ten times their size and ten times as individually vicious. I do think that many sociopaths gravitate towards the military as it seemingly presents an acceptable outlet for their antisocial behaviors. They don’t make the best soldiers or leaders.
@AgoodPlan,
Ditto..I was in the military as well. I served on Submarines and then as a Navy Diver. The most these “tough guys” might do is “watch what you are dong” and then try to out do you after you are done and have earned a rest. They would wash out in any form of military training. I do, however, think that hyper-confident types (because they have to be) are prevalent in the special forces.
@GoodPlan,
PS. But even those in Specs have the ability to function individually as well as within a cohesive group. They are normal
@ Agoodplan 😃
I want to belong to that herd & eat grass, not ass! Lol
Sheep unite, Baa Baa & black sheep & rainbow sheep welcome.
I bet we spot the ‘wolves’ in our clothes, they’ll be the ones prowling their asses in the green green grasses! Lol
You have the kindest heart so, don’t let Lyss, mind game you for her amusement. Probably just bored so, came here to play!
She said her partner has Bi -Polar so, that’s a match made in hell!
My ex was Bi-Polar & that’s like driving a manual car always out of gear!
Anyway, we are not here to concern ourselves with Soc’s etc….
I am doing well & reading all my self help books & applying everything I’ve learnt to myself & helping others.
I am actually meeting alot of people generally in turmoil or ‘crossroads’ & battling their own demons 😔
I am just listening & empathizing & giving them love & support.
I pay it forward as this while experience has made me grateful of others & the impact we have on each other.
I am mindful & appreciate having ‘got it’ as I’m sure many others here are.
My daughter suffers PCOD & I hope that her future fertility is not jeopardized? She is only 21 & I am not ready to be a Nanna just yet 😁
She has a lovely partner though & i may end up being the Nanna of a gorgeous Eurasian child? I love babies & children & I hope one way or another you have your much wanted & already loved child❤️️😃
Just keep your options open, have you ever worked in child care? Your great nurturing would be very valuable. I have a friend who does not have children but, works for World Vision as has thousands 😃
You are amazing PR, How wonderful that you are using what you have learnt to help all those people. It’s great to have your support on line but in person must be very comforting to those people. If i had someone like you on my journey in person, it would have helped so much.
I am also appreciative to have “got it” although, now I am going back out into the world and life, sometimes i have fear that the theory wont flow into practice, but every day in some small way i realise i am doing just this. That I have done this. I still struggle with loving myself but I am really getting there and the love is flowing from within to without, it really is beautiful.
With regards to PCOS and your daughter, it is treatable. They can’t remove it forever but they can treat it quite easily. If you stop the medication it comes back pretty quickly. It’s all about balancing hormones and insulin resistance. I know some people that swear by Traditional Chinese Medicine in treating it as well, but i dont’ have the luxury of time, so i have gone western medicine as well as some diet adjustments. So you will be a grandmother when the time is ready! My friend has a Eurasian baby. OMG he is the cutest little boy EVER! I have a long way to go before i come close to it not happening. But it will happen. I am sure of this now.
I think we could get a heap of T-shirts from NZ lol 😁
I will bear that Chinese Medicine route in mind. One day I was shopping recently & a fair skinned blonde lady was holding her Eurasian grandchild & I thought I was seeing my future before my eyes! The woman looked like me & the baby was gorgeous, I melted 😃
As long as it’s healthy, I will be happy 😃
You must look for your Angels, ask for their help. Just ask& always say thank-you.
Ask for help finding a job, ask it daily as an affirmation, trust the universe, I ask everyday & everyday I ‘see’ more gifts.
Fear is such a bugger but, that is Ego & self doubt so, work hard at shutting that down. Before bed, think positive, read affirmations, love your whole self, your body, your arms for wrapping around you, your legs for carrying you daily etc.. Louise Hay, ‘You Can Heal Your Life’, Stephanie Dowrick, Choosing Happiness, really good books/ bibles.
You are not alone & I walk with you daily, you are my ‘other realm’ online friend. 😃👼🙏
I am a SHEEP, baa & you are in my flock & I am in yours 🐑😃
Love Always,
PR xoxo
Wow, can we stop with the personal attacks. My daughter has bipolar that is really offensive 😦
@Phoenix, don’t stop to give “food” to the “beast”…remember they don’t define us, and no contact is the best weapon also with the viruses on the blog. ! The best of mondays for you!
It’s just time that is needed & your at the stage of grieving & beating yourself up for being taken for a ride.
Well your in great company here, I often catch myself thinking WTF or What were you thinking & then I remember, I wasn’t!
My brain was being subjected to immence ‘love bombing’ & smoke & mirrors so, as I just tried to survive a marriage trauma, I was being preyed upon & my vulnerability was very raw!
So, they chose you, your a target, not a victim. They decide the game rules & if you don’t play then, ‘game on’ & the stakes get higher. You are the stakes, you are the object they desire to conquer & keep or discard at will.
It’s never been about us but, always them.
The game is over so, stay NC.
You are a person, not a game piece & life is not a game.
It gets easier but, this is the path you must follow until your head & heart come together & your spirit is restored.
@IID, AGPT,NMI 😃
‘Meet the Flockers’….LOL, maybe I should be a ‘stand up’ comedian?
Bet I know who the hecklers will be!
‘I see a little silhoetta of a man, Socamouche can you do the fandango?
Oops, Revenge is on, more Soc’s!
The Other Woman movie is out next week, guess who’s going 😁
I am Cameron Diaz you know, i am talk & blonde & funny 😁😘
PR x
Oh, i know that & thought you’d have a witty comeback but, I am Australian & we call bums Arse’s & Asses are donkeys. Besides, you missed the point, no insults thanks & we will give you the same courtesy.
Cooler 😁
Thanks for the entertainment today. I was having one of those “poor me” days but reading all of your insights and arguing kept me a bit entertained 😉 😛
@Lyss,
Your not blunt, your sharp! Who cares & stop analizing & changing tack etc…time to take your Ass or Arse & play elsewhere unless you have something nice to say or mature.
Your no a Rhode Scholar so, cut the crap jargon it’s a dead give away. As for Cognitive Dissonance, how about trying to fathom real from bullshit, that keeps it simplfied for us Sheep!
We have troble reconciling the BS that’s all, as there is so much verbal diarrhea with a Soc!
You were so spot on as always PR. ITs like arguing with a child underwater. The rules change according to them and as you said, so does the debate when things aren’t going their way.
I love shrek. Making waffles indeed 🙂
There’s no difference between blunt and sharp, only what side you’re looking at the blade from. It’s the same blade none the less.
By being closed minded you’re showing how immature you can be. Or is that mature, I can never tell with people nowadays.
On a completely unrelated note, you know what would be funny, if we were all placed in a room to chat for an hour and then play a game of spot the sociopath and see everyone get it wrong ;3
Your welcome bella, just stay focused on You & your recovery, it’s really all that matters.
A friend of mine said I was Princess Fiona (before the change) & my Soc looked like Shrek! Wish he’d gad the good heart instead of Lord Farkquar!
I should have sung really high & made him explode! Lol
‘ not the dew drop buttons’.
Pr x
hahaha. Mine was probably rumpelstiltskin, so full of himself and egotisitical and thought he was smarter than everyone else. He wasn’t.
I’m signing off now, so night night my dear.
Peace and happiness to you too.
IID
xxxx
You got mean towards It Is Done & that was not acceptable.
I think that it’s ‘game over’ or ‘copy & paste’ but, as I said, ‘if you have nothing nice to say, don’t’.
If you can refrain from your so called ‘bluntness’ re your responces then I am happy to ‘talk’ but, start games & forget it.
Thanking you in anticipation that you will behave.
PR
@Pheonix Rising
She perceived it as mean, clearly you did too. I did not intend it that way.
“Behave” cute I love being shoved in a box it’s so much fun ^^
@It Is Done
If what I said was taken as an insult, I apologise, however when it came out of my mouth it was not intended as such.
I clearly don’t belong here, among hundreds of women who hate some kind of person for something they didn’t do. Guess it sucks to be me huh ;3 unless someone actually wants to ask me something or approach me for a valuable reason, I do not wish to reply, it’s extremely tiring hearing the same excuses over and over.
@ Lyss, You didn’t insult me at all. I expect that kind of thought and argument from a sociopath. All you did was prove my point from your reactions. You don’t realise it but you are predictable, PR said how you would respond before you did and you did.
Yes Poor hard done by you. As PR said, it can be tiring arguing with a sociopath. for two reasons: 1) The game always changes to suit them but then that is all our fault according to them and 2) you will never understand.
And for that i feel sorry for you.
@It Is Done
I had no reactions, again, my emotions did not alter in any of the points of the argument.
Naw thanks, you’re pretty predictable yourself ;3
I changed my argument at no point, and each time you tried to say I did I proved why it is that I was being consistent.
Again, predictable, being so closed minded aww look at you ❤
@ Lyss,
I would never voluntarily jump into a shark tank so, partying with Soc’s & playing charades is not going to happen.
If you came without the mask then at least we’d be aware of your agenda etc…you see Lyss, Soc’s come in disguise whereas , we come as we are!
If you feel so superior etc…& want equal acceptance like homosexuals so rightly deserve then come as you are & we would be able to ‘see’ you & decide for ourselves whether we want to befriend you. Play fair, that’s all we ask.
PR
You say this and yet this is basically a hate site against sociopaths.
You say sociopath to almost anyone and they think things along the lines of manipulative, liar, inhuman, monster, scary.
It’s a given we come with a mask, if we didn’t no one would ever approach us.
We’re taught to have a mask on at such a young age. My mother, before she realised she just shouldn’t take me at all, used to take me to the funerals she went to and when I was happy or neutral, she’d tell me “Lyss, at least try to look sad” or “Put your head down a bit so you look more upset”.
We’re sociopaths in an empath’s world. We don’t belong. Of course we put on masks. We don’t have a choice. We’d be cast out if we didn’t. Oh wait, so many of us already have been.
But I do think manipulative, controlling, tells lies.
But – what interests me, is why the need for the mask? There are plenty of assholes out there in the world anyway. Of all descriptions, so why do you feel the need to fake the perfect persona? Is this about childhood and not feeling good enough?
This isn’t fair. (I am working backwards through these comments) …. the last comment I read from lyss I thought that she was being open and honest about who she was.
She wasn’t faking to be a victim. That would be coming here with a mask, she out and out said that she is a sociopath.
Glad you can see I’m not lying or masking here.
It kinda sucks being honest with people for once and it backfiring massively. Then they wonder why >.>
I guess so, my father was a corporate man, and I mean CEO level. I used to be taken to corporate dinners all the time and was taught to be the perfect angel or else I’d cop it later.
I remember one time I had to go to someone’s house that was a boss of my father’s and I couldn’t eat or drink for 8 hours because I wasn’t allowed to ask for a drink unless they offered; they never offered ;3
At the age of 6 my father told me I was too old for the playground, that I should grow up already. Kind of funny when you think about it. Never allowed to be a child, may as well be one now on the internet where I’m anonymous >.>
I get you lyss.
Do you feel the need for ‘perfection’ or to be ‘perfect’ or at least give that persona to the outside world?
Do you think a lot of it comes down to inner insecurity?
@positivagirl
I guess so, but at the same time I’m extremely bad at going at things til the end, so I tend to strive for perfection, give up half way, then get angry at myself or something like that >.> I guess I’m my own worst enemy 😀
Well, I’d definitely say insecure. I can’t be in a room with more than about 6 people without shaking from social anxiety. I guess that’s because I know I don’t fit there and so I’d rather be alone.
Yes, this is what I have observed too Lyss.
I understand a lot about Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, as I have had that following the death of my daughter. This is in the mind too, and triggered by what happened during that time.
What i observed, with the socio in my life, was a trigger that was similar to PTSD triggering, but it was about past events, likely events in childhood. Every time the reaction was the same. It was identical to a PTSD trigger.
I know it is triggering as it is repeated. I think that this is what causes the repeated patterns of behaviour with many sociopaths, the triggers related to childhood trauma.
The need to control, because at one time in their life (often in childhood) they were out of control, had no control, no say. So they ensure that they will never be in that situation or so vulnerable ever again.
I worked with homeless people for decades. I learned, that almost always with people. There is a reason ‘why’. I think I have always managed to see ‘good’ in pretty much everyone I have met. Even those who have hurt me.
What is empathy? Isn’t it learned behaviour? If someone grows in an environment with no love, with disdain. This is what they learn. So that when they see other people being loving and caring it seems like an outside world. That can sometimes cause resentment.
You say that you work well with your partner, its not perfect but it works in its own way. This is good.
I don’t believe that all ‘non sociopaths’ are good. Neither do I believe that all sociopaths are wholly bad. I do believe that there is a reason why everyone is the way that they are.
With the last socio in my life – I wouldn’t say that he has changed, but he has I guess. He learned to manage his behaviour. The psycho cycle does happen periodically, but not too often these days.
I don’t know if I see people without judgement (even those who have hurt me) as I worked all my life with homeless people. Or – because I am not perfect. I don’t think anybody is. Everybody has their issues.
I think that there really isn’t anywhere to go, for people who are sociopaths who try to manage their behaviour.
There is a lot of misunderstanding and judgement. I think what is important sometimes, is not what is in the mind – but what is in the heart.
@positivagirl
I was once diagnosed with PTSD by an idiot psychologist. I had to laugh. She said this because I told her about my past. Apparently having a shitty childhood makes you have PTSD without a doubt >.> but I do understand what you mean by they’re similar when it comes to triggers. I just think they react differently to those triggers. One may cry, one may rage.
Was also diagnosed with OCD once because the need to control became so bad it was as specific as having to have every piece of paper on a desk arranged a very specific way.
What I don’t understand is how some other people can say ‘without empathy, you’re less human/alive/whatever’. You’re not born with empathy, as you said yourself. So, no one is born fully alive/human according to their logic.
I recently wrote a short story, for amusement, attempting to see if I could conjure up empathy in my writing. If it’s not too much to ask, would you like to read it? I want to see if I succeeded in mimicking empathy, so sort of an experiment.
Unfortunately I’m unable to access email where I am right now, so here will have to do.
Written from the point of view of a dog, seeming as I suck at human relationships and the such.
He lazily yawned, his eyes drooping and shoulders slouching further into the leather brown armchair, with the same numb expression he wears every day. It had been a while since Master had come home. More than a while.
The rattling of a key in the front door broke the old hound from his trance-like state. Could it be? Jumping off the battered armchair, he mustered all of his energy to run to the source of the sound. The door slowly widened, the cold, harsh winter air rushing through with a purpose. Time seemed to slow down, almost stop, in suspense. A human foot entered, encased in freshly-polished black leather shoes.
No. Of course not.
Two more pairs of feet arrived, slamming the door behind them in an attempt to warm the house up again. He tilted his head up, getting a full view of these strangers. The first had a slightly-too-tight business suit on, under which he was sweating quite intensely from nervousness. The smell of his perspiration, cologne, and the abundance of hair wax smothered onto his short deep black hair poured into the canine’s sensitive nose. The second human was a female with shoulder-length, grey-yellow hair, holding a small, sleeping child in a harness-like contraption connected to her front. She smelled of baby powder, and a hint of burning coming from her hair. The third was a male, hovering protectively over the second in some strange human way of showing affection.
The one in the monkey suit began, “This house… built in nineteen… owner past away last month… leukemia… asking price… one hundred and…” Old age had not bid the poor hound’s hearing well.
The third human – the strange male – caught a glimpse of the old dog, and began to stare in hostility. The dog, now growling in a deep, hoarse voice, wasn’t pleased with this intrusion of his Master’s home.
“Oh, God… so sorry… dog… keeps coming back… hole under the gate…” The nervous man’s voice rose and he approached the dog with a livid expression, “GET OUT… DUMB MUTT… DON’T BELONG…”
The old dog barked twice in his rough voice before sprinting out the door that the man had opened – a big mistake. The door slammed behind him, with the force of a tornado. The pooch found himself in the freezing cold, 5 inches of snow under his oversized paws, with a short, patchy coat to add insult to injury. Getting warm wasn’t on the top of his priority list, however. Finding his Master was. And that was exactly what he was going to do, whether it killed him or not. Lifting one paw after another, out of the snow, then back in, leaving distinct prints with every step, the hound began on his way.
The street was deserted, too full with the bite of winter for anyone to dare to walk out. Trees had frost-covered branches, sharp ice where autumn leaves were only months ago. It was ironic, really, how about the same time the colourful leaves fell off the trees, the dog’s Master had disappeared.
The old pup climbed through a barbed-wire fence, grazing his entire side with a painful wound, the cold wind lashing out against it every second. No sound came out of the dog’s mouth. He had eyes of determination – or desperation. The cold had made the poor pup’s once wet nose hard, biting at his face with frozen anguish.
Long he walked, and it became harder and harder as the bitter and angry blizzard raged on. It was more than difficult to see, the hound’s vision filled with fast-moving white flurry. The harsh wind was trying its best to bowl over the beast. This was not a task for such an old mutt. He was unsure of how much longer his aching legs could hold his own weight up. It had seemed like forever that he had been walking through the icy untamed forest, until in the short distance, he spotted a clearing. It was more than hard for the senior to keep his eyes open; he was tired, bleeding, and the cold had left him tender and vulnerable.
The clearing came after an eternity, and it seemed as if hope had come with it. The dog came to large black gates, vines crawling and wrapping themselves around the thick metal bars. He began to walk. In this small open area past the gates, the trees surrounded from all directions, protecting the space from the blizzard. It definitely was not warm, but the dog’s nose began to defrost a small amount; enough to allow him to take in the smells of this sacred area. It had the scents of many people, yet no one was to be seen. Perfume, flowers – of all different sorts – overpowering smells rushed into the dog’s nose. He paced through the yard, walking past strange concrete slabs he did not recognise. Inscriptions in the shapely stones were not comprehensible for a dog. His ears perked up into the air as he smelled a familiar smell that, if he were human, would have brought tears to his eyes. The aroma of his Master’s favourite English tea and shortbread biscuits, his cheap shampoo and the seat of his favourite rocking chair.
He followed his nose along the patches of grass and snow, to the source of the scent. A great slab of concrete rose from that very spot. He spun around a few times, before lying down, curling around the gravestone, his wound still red and his legs still aching, but he didn’t care. Time seemed to slow down just for the two, and the sly old hound gave a sort of smile, before his tiredness got the best of him, slipping into a long sleep next to his partner.
@positivagirl
Sorry, forgot to tag you in the comment with the story. If you ctrl+f this sentence, “Unfortunately I’m unable to access email where I am right now, so here will have to do.” you should find it. Terribly sorry.
Thanks for seeing my point of view, though. Not many people do. Maybe that’s my fault. I am, however, not going to reply to them anymore. Not in a mean way, but it does tire you out trying to say something when no one listens. Tiring, and quite saddening. Maybe that’s just because I’m really not in the mood to waste my breath, I don’t know. Thanks anyway.
I think your writing is really good. Do you mind if I ask you a few questions?
1. How old are you?
2. You said you learned you were a sociopath a year ago. Was this a self diagnosis or a formal assessment?
3. You talk of abuse as a child and also that you feel not much. Do you know that people with ptsd can also struggle with empathy ? Can feel emotionally disconnected? They can often feel nothing and what you describe as an outsider looking in is also common in ptsd. It can feel like you are viewing the world from behind a glass wall, you on one side everyone else on another.
4. The thing that makes me ask these questions is because you say that you suffer with social anxiety, sociopaths generally don’t. (How could they feel social anxiety? This is something they don’t really experience).
The type of abuse you describe in childhood particularly If it went on for a long time, your symptoms could also be trauma based rather than sociopathy. Have you been formerly diagnosed as a sociopath?
@positivagirl
Thanks, although I was more looking for creating a sense of empathy towards the dog. Did I succeed/to what extent?
Sure, ask away.
I’m 18 currently
At the time, it was a self-diagnosis, however I was forced to see a professional and he did do sort of a quick, not specifically a diagnosis but more a ‘yes, I’d say you are most probably a sociopath’.
I definitely do not have PTSD, however. Yes, bad things happen but I’ve gotten over it. I have had no empathy since I was extremely young. Not sure if you would want to know this, or if you’d think of me any less because of it, but I would torture my various pets as a child, and only ever felt bad the one time I got caught. I continued, though. I think that proves a fair bit there, sadly enough. A few other things I would do when I was a child, before I even realised what was happening or defined it as even slightly ‘traumatic’. I’d hardly define it as traumatic now, because aside from the permanent physical injuries I have sustained, everything feels normal.
A thought for you, a year ago (just after I came to my realisation) my mother came to me, telling me about how someone did a study somewhere (too long ago to recall) and found out that the vast majority of sociopaths tested had a head injury at some point in their lives. Interesting, isn’t it. Correlation does not imply causation, however speculation is fascinating.
I’m extremely confident and relaxed around 1 or 2 people, scarily so. For some reason, numbers frighten me. I’ve had a few experiences there that you probably don’t care to listen to.
I think you should go careful of labels. Someone cannot be diagnosed a socio/psychopath until age 18. That is for good reason. I have known plenty of really screwed up teens who turned into good people. Children rarely have empathy (sociopathy is very like being a child). Empathy kicks In In later teenage years and sometimes that can be delayed for a child who has been abused. I am not saying you will, but you might find that side of yourself kicks in later years.
You seem to have insight. Many of the words you use to describe yourself appear to be words that you are told you are (sometimes when people are told it enough they become it).
Remember you were talking about good and bad sociopaths? Maybe you aren’t one. You just have issues to work through from a damaged childhood.
At 18 I wouldn’t say I was hugely empathetic. Yet I was to go on to spend my working life working with homeless people. I could always see the person behind the behaviour.
Hurting animals in childhood is a indicator of psychopathy. That isn’t normal to do. How do you feel about doing that now? Aside from this, everything else you describe sounds typical for someone of your age who has had an abusive childhood. You don’t feel empathy as your brain went has always been on the defensive to protect yourself. Your social anxiety furthers my thinking this might be the case, but again, hurting animals isn’t normal. Try not to put a label on yourself so early in life. You never know in 10 years you could be a totally different person. I have seen the most screwed up teens repair damage from their parents, and turn out to live successful life’s. Often all they ever needed was unconditional love and someone to believe in them. Strive to be who you want to be, in spite of your childhood. let your experiences make you, not break you. Don’t worry about lack of empathy right now, that’s normal for someone your age with your background. It’s not your past that is important, but who you choose to be today.
What brought you to this site? How do you feel when you read about sociopathic behaviour does it sound like you? Remember socios are like children. That might be normal to still be that way at 18 with an abnormal background. Not normal at 38 when your still behaving this way.
You say you have been in same relationship and faithful for 3 years that is since you were 15. Don’t become what someone tells you you are. Your only 18 and I don’t mean that in a condescending way. You might find in 10/15 years you are a different person as you find yourself.
@positivagirl
I’m not an extreme fan of labels, however I use the term sociopath because it’s much easier than saying ‘a person without empathy’. It’s why I always laughed when psychologists tried to diagnose me; what’s the point, it can’t be fixed anyway.
Which words are you referring to in particular may I ask?
I must say that next comment made me chuckle slightly, sorry. I dealt with my issues long ago, and I got these issues after I was how I am now. Talking didn’t help, learning to suck it up did though.
How do I feel about hurting animals now? I don’t particularly care. I still have many urges to, and I still have pets, and it takes everything I have to not endanger them at many points in time.
There are two separate reasons I have urges to hurt animals, I think.
The first being when I’m angry, or want to be left alone, and they look at you and expect something from you and man it angers me so much and it’s so easy to hit them or something (sorry, was in one of these moods a few minutes ago, feeling is still fresh) to get them out of your way.
The second is more child-like, and tends to be more common, at least for me. And that’s curiosity. Every child is curious, but I was extreme in this. I wouldn’t be mad, sad, or happy, I’d be completely neutral in emotions, and if they were in the vicinity I would get curious and I’d see how hard I could hug them before a sound comes out, how long they could be choked for, how hard I have to sit on them or twist their tails. It was like a child playing with a toy. Those urges happen still quite often now as I still have many pets.
Although my boyfriend has learned when to get them away from me, and if he doesn’t realise I tell him in a stern voice ‘Get. Them. Away. Now.’ and he understands immediately.
If I lived alone and there were no consequences for hurting them, in all honesty I probably would. I’ve had to teach myself to take it out on something else, unfortunately this has turned into me hurting myself (not cutting or anything, more punching something hard purposely to hurt my hand or bashing my head or some crap). Still working on that though.
I’d say unconditional love/someone to believe in me isn’t the case, as I have that and I’m no different aside from me having the motivation to learn a tiny bit more self-control >.>
What brought me to this site? It’s kind of funny actually. Along with purposely messing with my relationship, as I get bored with having a neutral emotion all the time I tend to look for a bit of trouble. Subconsciously, of course, and I realise after it was a stupid idea and change my approach. And it’s not really trouble, just a trigger. My main trigger is just ‘people without logic’ and that sort of encompasses many things. Raging doesn’t make me feel good as such but it’s not boring. It breaks the fast, if you will.
I’ve been taking measures to stop this lately, although sometimes it’s impossible, without being completely and utterly asocial and isolated, which, in all honesty, is what I’ve been thinking of doing as of late. I’m always going to find triggers somewhere, Someone is going to tell me something that makes no sense, and I’m going to attempt to explain why it makes no sense or how they’re contradicting themselves, they’ll get all NO NO YOU’RE WRONG I DON’T WANNA LISTEN and I’ll get angry. If people don’t make sense, and I explain it to them and they go ‘oh wait you have a point’ it’s fine, I don’t get angry, but when people clearly use the same incorrect logic and refuse to keep their minds open about anything, that’s when I get angry.
That’s the reason I commented. The reason I found this site is because I was looking up ‘ways to cope as a sociopath’ to find ways people handle their impulses, but instead I found ‘ways to cope WITH a sociopath’. It irritated me no one wrote anything about how to deal as one >.>
Your right your urge to hurt animals is not normal teen behaviour. Have you tried sociopath world forum? http://www.sociopathworld.com/p/forum.html?m=1 (if the link doesn’t come up type in sociopath world into Google. They might rip you apart at first. But as a socio this might not concern you. When I have read there there is a lot of in house competition of who should be top dog. Also there are quite good posts written by M e Thomas. I have seen a lot of socios write about how they manage to live to a code of conduct (most of the time) so they don’t get into as much trouble. It might be a good site If you are looking for input from a socio perspective?
You might get more balanced views by reading comments to posts. That seems to be a mixture of comments from socios and non socios. I have had emails from socios who say they live to a code of conduct. It works for them. The forum you might find has degenerated into who is bigger and badder than the other 🙂 like a clash of egos. Do a search on the site you might come across some articles of use.
@positivagirl
I have been reading a few of M.E Thomas’ articles lately, although many of her articles are very, well. Shrouded. It’s clear she’s attempting to make it a much more intriguing read for non-sociopaths to learn about sociopaths.
I need more instructions or a variety of coping mechanisms. She obviously does not write like this, as she herself has said the purpose of her blogs is to inform the world about sociopaths, not sociopaths about themselves.
I have no interest in a sociopathic community, at least not one that is full of big-headed idiots. Again, I’d probably just get angry from their unnecessary attempts at establishing dominance online. It’s pointless and ridiculous. All the people who comment there are aggressive or narcissistic sociopaths – the exact kind I do not get along with.
However, if you ever happen to find a community of sociopaths that are actually willing to say worthy content instead of boosting their egos (doubt that would happen, and if it did the party would get crashed pretty quickly) let me know, it’d be handy ;3
Unfortunately that is the problem, you can never find asocial sociopaths like me because they’re, well, asocial.
So basically I’m screwed >.> ahwell, there’s always complete isolation. 😉
Thanks for this conversation though, and sorry for getting people angry and causing trouble >.>
Ditto Lyss, you put yourself in the box i believe so, sorry you couldn’t behave!
You came here voluntarily, we didn’t seek you or your advice originally.
It is tiring, my Soc was always tired especially when he was behaving badly!
That’s the scary bit about sociopaths. You can put them in a room with other people and nobody would be able to pick them out. Wolf in sheep’s clothing. Sorry, couldn’t help myself then 😉
Lyss, I understand a lot in what you are saying. One of your earlier posts struck a cord with me. You said that you haven’t taken any money from your partner. I take my hat off to you for that. A lot of sociopaths see the opportunity and take it. That is one thing that ruined me with my sociopath. Not only did he take my money but, if it wasn’t for my mums financial help, I wouldn’t have been able to get a home loan and I wouldn’t have had something to help me move forward. Lesson learnt and I will never lend money to a person again.
@Ex def an S
Thanks, you’re the first one to see anything in any of my words aside from ‘LALA I’M A SOCIOPATH LALA’ which is what apparently some of these other people are hearing >.>
(That’s a joke in case anyone gets offended. A mocking joke, but nonetheless a joke)
It all comes down to the good or the bad in a person. A bad empath might think about taking the money and not because he/she feels guilty, or might do it but feel bad afterwards. A bad sociopath will take it without feeling guilty.
A good empath won’t even think about it
And a good sociopath will neither.
Thanks for seeing some logic in my arguments.
Absolutely its about the ‘good’ and ‘bad’ in the person. For sure. People who think it isn’t are deluded. Sorry but I met a lot of heartless people after my daughter died. I had more help from the socio than anyone. this is true. there are good and bad in all.
I was reading about PTSD yesterday. The article that I read, was saying about labels and how they are really not useful. How labels are given for mental health, but not physical health. How stupid that is. It said, if someone breaks a bone, it wont say you ARE a broken bone…. Yet people say that someone is just a ‘sociopath’ yep they can turn worlds upside down, yep there is drama, but it does depend on the person, how they deal with that, just as it depends on the socio how they manage who they are.
@XDef,
I can pick them out in men. I had to do it to survive at one point. What has messed me up is that I hooked up with a female SOC. I’m telling you, it messes with your mind really bad when the traditionally more nurturing gender of our species is like that (if you’re a guy). this is not a sexist statement. I just never attributed these traits to female. Shit talk about cognitive dissonance!
I’ve come across female “players.” But never predators. She is a twisted animal that wants nothing other than to sadistically dominate.
@ Broken,
Yep, now you see & look up Sociopath mind control, fascinating.
The more you learn the more clarity you gain & slowly the ‘fog’ lifts & you see them in all their Glory or Gory as I prefer. 😃
The questions finally provide the answers that the Soc will never give or admit. You know her better than she does now so, be proud as you are on your way through & out into the ‘light’
Keep Going & remember, your Free of it! Free of her & free of BS.
@PR
days….weeks of silence then coming back as if nothing happened. then gaslighting..saying I’m too sensitive…or I had an anger problem…..then “forgiving me.” Yup she was a real bitch
Yep, my Soc loves ‘power’ & is a Commander in the Fire Brigade. Very level headed in a crises etc…. but, his nickname is ‘the scab’ as he sits in management & is a union rep so, plays one end against the other, villain interchange to hero etc… He creates a lot of problems within his own ‘brotherhood’. I have proof but, cannot use it as it could endanger me?
I found him fascinating in the end when i figured it out. I have an excellent post on covert narc’s that i will send you but, it’s on my work computer.
I think you’d be impressed with my Soc, really is the full blown delusional yet charismatic Soc/narc & he’s Italian so has that whole mafia thing happening. Yep, I got the horses arse in bed! Lol
“Being too sensitive”. That reminded me of something. Once my spaths friend, who is married with kids, kept hitting on me via messenger. When my Spath was “in love with me”, he would tell me to tell him to leave me alone and to delete him. When I was no longer his source, and his friend was trying to hit on me again, I complained to my Spath who responded with “why are you so sensitive?” Errrr cause your friend is married with kids…..now I know why he said that though….because he was about to become married with kids and yet still wanted me on the side.
Lyss, this is not a ‘I hate Soc site’ it’s a ‘ hate Soc’s who hurt me site’ please be clear & tread carefully.
We ‘hate our experience’ but, truthfully we once loved the person we thought they were. I don’t hate my Soc, i feel sorry for him that he conducts his life as he does. We support each other & it would be the same support i would give anyone that needs support regardless if a Soc caused it or not. The patterning & predictability is astounding , so we are amazed at the similarity of our experience. We share our journey & no we don’t understand why our Soc’s treat us like they do but, we do ‘get it’ & help each other to move on & heal.
A mother does tell a child how to behave everywhere & yes, smiling at funerals is not acceptable but, children do this. My son put a toy car onto a casket & drove it into the flower parking lot ! We all laughed as his Grandfather would have appreciated it 😃
You say sociopaths are predictable and they have patterning yet you say you do not understand why.
Then, I must ask, how do you assume when and what when you do not know why?
Is it some sort of cycle your experiences always have in common? Like some diagram can be drawn to say ‘they will pretend to love you then act out and do this this and that’?
It just makes no sense as to how others have said ‘oh we understand you more than you think’ (clearly bigheaded) and then do not understand why.
@Lyss,
There is infact a pattern. And that pattern is outlined like a road map in a book written under the pseudonym “Peace.” It’s called “Psychopath Free.”
@PR,
I hope I have your strength someday Phoenix. I really do
No. This is NOT a I hate socios who hurt me site. My god, I so hope this site hasn’t turned into that. As this was never my intention. The intention of the site was to write the truth. I didn’t hate the last socio in my life when I began writing. I don’t now. Which is why this site is called ‘dating a sociopath’ this site is about ‘dating a sociopath’
No, it’s not a I hate Soc’s site & my comment back said, I hate the experience one caused etc…I actually mentioned love as that was my intention. Lyss got picky with It Is Done & I did not like her perceived inference etc…
I was not attacking people with Bi Polar either as I have lived with this in my life & recognize how hard it is.
I think Lyss & I have established what’s fair & that’s the end of it.
NIM recognized it as well as others so, being deemed Sheep etc…became a ‘proud’ thing for us 🙂 we turned it around, thanks to AGPT.
It’s all okay so, don’t worry as it lit up the site for a night/day & reconnected us once again with love & strength.
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
If you look at it this way. If someone comes here and be’s honest. Perhaps I missed something but this is what I saw and then is attacked for that honesty or labelled. The person then reacts and everyone says see your a socio knew you would react like that. That isn’t fair and not something I advocate. I don’t or try not to judge anyone. I can have empathy for anyone including a sociopath. I am that way. I learned to be as my whole adult life was spent working with people who had issues. I tend not to judge. If a sociopath is going to be judged they will react and be the very person they are accused of. I know the last one in my life went to sociopath world. He knew he wasn’t like that. I can’t stand gang mentality or excluding people. It’s not right. The comment about bipolar people. It’s so wrong. So wrong and goes against everything this blog is about 😦
Hi Pos,
Point taken & I’m sorry if I offended you & no, I was not ‘attacking’ or creating a ‘gang’ mentality.
I’ve only ever come here to help & support.
I am really sad that you would think like that about me but, I am also mindful of your feelings & I apologized to Lyss & I thought we had sorted it out?
I guess the ‘triggers’ are having a Soc here & it always gets me into trouble so, I shall refrain from commenting unless it’s asked for?
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
Love you pr you know this. It is just the way that I am. I don’t really judge anyone. Or at least I try not to. Everyone has their story. I guess it hurts me to see anyone being ganged up on. I don’t know how a ‘sociopath’ would trigger you. She is a person she is female. She has done nothing to you, and couldn’t do. This blog from day one was about dating a sociopath. It was never about hating a sociopath. It was about understanding. I don’t want hating here. Its negative.
I guess I have empathy for everyone. I see others point of view. I really do see good in everyone. People are individuals. They are not just a label. This person isn’t a threat to you. Maybe I missed some comments. I didn’t see her being rude to anyone.
There are plenty of sociopath hating sites. This isn’t one of them. I hate actions that socios do. But she wasn’t doing that. Again maybe I missed some posts. As you know I have some things going personally.
I don’t think a sociopath posting would send people away. But in house fighting would.
Hi Pos,
All PR did was stand up for me when Lyss attacked me. Lyss and I were discussing sociopathic behaviour (completely theoretically and not personal). I said something that triggered Lyss and she came back with derogatory comments about me (my head was up my arse) and insulted my situation with my ex . I countered the argument (leaving the insults out of it) and she denied her comments were insulting. Possibly a communication break down, but then wouldnt let it go. There was never any mention of hating all sociopaths, infact, we both stated (PR and I) that this was not the case but Lyss appeared to take the position that we hated all sociopaths even though we denied it. PR was the perfect protector and did absolutely nothing wrong. I was in the wrong for trying to reason/debate with this particular sociopath (even after PR told me to let it be). My argument was never meant to anger Lyss, and she denies they did, but her reaction came across as such so i disengaged.
PR would never do anything but protect someone. And i thank her even though I was not upset at all, she still jumped to my defense and this sites defense to stop Lyss being so rude. Lyss complied.
I hope this helps clear things up. You just need to read the comments in order to understand.
I must say that i am slightly hurt that you would doubt PR and my intentions over a sociopath that attacked us.
Cheers
IID
Does anyone actually read the comments that lyss makes? Or do I see something nobody else does? I am also sorry if you were attacked. I haven’t seen that yet. But if so I am sure you are more than capable of saying your own words in reply. There is no need for ganging up. It’s between you and lyss. Surely? Or am I missing something? This is someone opening up? It hurts me that anyone would make themselves vulnerable by opening up and would be attacked here. It’s against everything I believe in. I hate people that gang up. You are more than capable of saying your own point of view. We both know this.
@ broken,
Yep, a Sociopeach, I got the Socio fruit basket!
I like fruit but, we throw out the rotten fruit or make jam!
She’s a loser paloser, you are a good guy, remember that there is better fruit out here. Pick wisely from here on in 😃❤️️💋
@PR,
One of the things I have read in my book “Psychopath Free” is in reference to the darkness that I feel I’m in because of this tragic experience. Our empathy allows us, compels us to try and understand the SOC without really knowing what we are in for. Its a world of darkness and predatory energy that hunts our minds and souls and seeks to devour them. When you are discarded you are left literally wondering what happened to your mind and the light in your soul. Its because you entered into a soulless world that only the rarest of people can walk into and out of without harm or trauma. (Jesus comes to mind…maybe Batman too)
Lyss,
I had no idea about the patterning etc…until after I realised I’d been dating a sociopath. I started reading the stages & it was like ‘wow’, that is my life etc….it was hidsight, after the event & we all started helping each other & comparing & that’s when others would literally think we’d dated the same guy.
Can i ask you, why does your partner stay knowingly? The OW in my saga has stayed on & I would never do this knowingly. Once i knew what his motives were etc…if the situation was reversed, i would have no hesitation in leaving. I see women stay with known pedaphiles & rapists & donn’t get that either, any ideas?
Oh, & don’t get condescending with the awww’s etc…or maturity crap, just try & answer & I’m happy to dobthe same. Don’t cintinue to ‘pick on’ IID, no-one needs the agro. Thanks
PR
See, and that’s where the whole ‘there are different kinds of sociopaths’ comes in.
Well, I assume it’s because he loves me, or that he knows he can trust me (I’m almost dog-like loyal to him). While I mess up, I look for trouble (and I don’t mean by condescending him that I cause trouble, I more get angry at myself and it causes trouble because he hates it), he knows we’re horribly perfect for each other, or something corny like that.
He is messed up in his own ways, he had a crap childhood as well, and we have helped each other through times where we’ve in all honesty both wanted to just end our lives and be done with it.
I cannot judge on the latter question however, although I do assume it has something to do with the fact that women tend to think they can change someone, that they have some power to persuade a ‘bad-boy’. They convince themselves they’ll be different, because they have the power of love! (whatever that’s supposed to do)
Although, some more complex cases, it could be the thrill of the danger, or something. Sorry I could not answer any better.
But c’mon, the aw’s were completely necessary, and I think I got my point across ;3 at least I hope so. I can’t deal with having to reply the same thing again >.> If he/she doesn’t reply, I’ll be more than happy to leave it alone. Sound fair?
@PR she only “picks” on me because I beat her hands down in a logical argument that she couldn’t keep up with and therefore had to resort in the typical sociopath way of “picking”. I have stopped playing because there is no more point. She is not countering anything or saying anything new because at the end of the day she can’t and never will understand. That’s not fair on her.
She’ll come back with something nasty or repetitive to this as well as it’s her only line of defence. It’s interesting how they think. Predictable, but interesting.
Now I really am going to turn this phone off and go to sleep. Night xx
It is my birthday in 2 days and I have been feeling anxious all day. I will be 32. Most times I am excited that it will be my birthday but this time I just feel like I have wasted a few years of my life waiting for someone. I thought I would be married or engaged. Instead I am single and looking at a life by myself because I am now too scared to be in a relationship. I feel like a loser and completely rejected. I know that I deserve better than the sociopath/loser that I was with but how can someone ever love me with all the hurt that I went through in the past? How did he end up with a wife and a kid and I am left with never trusting another human being again.
Bad relationships are easy to come by. You needn’t envy him, or her. There’s is not anything you are looking for. And, 32 is young with still plenty of time for baby making. 😉 Relax, enjoy your birthday. Really not worth stressing over a soc and missing out on your life marker.
This is tough, and can be hard, painful. But please (I know this advice won’t change how you feel) waste your life, thinking how he has a great life and a wife etc (and even worse, that this therefore has to be your fault). I did this, for years of my life (from around the same age that you are now). I threw my life away. It was many years later (possibly 10) that the truth came out, that the marriage had ended… he had done exactly the same that he did to me. People don’t change. I hope that you realise that this is no reflection on you. Your life might only just be beginning and the magic might not yet have happened. Thank god he is someone elses husband and not yours!! 🙂
@Ex def, happy birthday to you. That this new year bring to you all the “tools” to make your dreams true, that at last you feel free from the hollow heart of him.
Feliz cumpleaños
The site or my phone reception isn’t great but, keep writing & singing your way out as it’s therapeutic.
I will try & reply better tomorrow? Site seems to be slow?
Stay strong & I’m still here.
PR xoxo
I haven’t written a post for a bit Broken, not for a week or so?
@POS,
Hey hon…it may Yahoo….I realize that it has funky as hell today. It must be the thread thing (not your fault) I’m not a computer guy…I got nervous because I thought my ex-soc might have tapped into my email (with her highly intelligent 25 yr. old soc’s help)
But I just received your last thread. It must be a “cyber-full-moon for the kid! Sorry for trouble!
Aww sorry Broken. I think sometimes wordpress does make it out of synch. I sometimes have problems keeping up with comments. Or sometimes I don’t see them, until I go back through and have to find them (when people write to me and tell me that I haven’t let a comment through).
Let me know if you continue to have problems.
@POS & PR (I’m not sure if this posted so I’m posting it again)
I’m just having a “bright moment.” and seeing how pathetic they really are. I wrote this:
This is called Morning Prayer:
They, from the beginning, needed us to feed off.
I don’t know if I’ll feel this way tomorrow morning or not, but I’m not prey. You are not either.
You were only trying to love. they were trying to conquer. By the very fact that you are here proves that you won.
They tried to feed off us like vampires, and did for awhile, but in the end our own spiritual strength and intuition made us break free.
We feel. We love. Our pain is testimony to that. That is a victory for any human being who has come into contact with someone who is more predator than human.
We came into contact with a “person” who was born without a fully developed brain that leaves them in an animal state. And, we survived. With human mentality, they are the dog or snake that will bite you.
We have been bitten but survived the attack.
I must admit, I am a veteran long diagnosed with PTSD, and because of my SOC, now have PTSD of both the HEART & MIND!
You know what though, in this glimmer of light I can see how the fate of us, the survivors of this phenomena, is for us to be elevated spiritually. I can’t completely feel it in it’s whole yet, but I’m seeing the brightness that Phoenix talks about.
They are left in their empty world. You are not. You won because you still have feelings. All’s they care about is one-upmanship, which is a lonely place to live. They cannot ever let their guard down. You can.
We shook like wounded soldiers with the fevered numb awareness that, all’s we wanted to see happen is for it to win and leave us alone. We also went through the torture of knowing that our own desire was part of that horror. But, we endured the storm and saw them and saw ourselves.
We gained strength
You can walk like a gentle warrior that has light shining down and through you. This is my prayer for the morning and for all of us. I’m having a bright moment and feeling the light precious Lady Phoenix speaks of:)) Sorry for rambling….it just came out
Love Broken
@POS
Its happening again. The update- email-posts aren’t showing up on my account! They appear and then they are deleted. Its just making me nervous
@POS,
Hey hon…it may Yahoo….I realize that it has funky as hell today. It must be the thread thing (not your fault) I’m not a computer guy…I got nervous because I thought my ex-soc might have tapped into my email (with her highly intelligent 25 yr. old soc’s help)
But I just received your last thread. It must be a “cyber-full-moon for the kid! Sorry for trouble!
@POS..and sorry for the typos. I couldn’t find my glasses! Have a good night
Dating a Sociopath 
@ Broken 😃
Story about a heart ❤️️
One day my heart was just relaxing & minding its business when suddenly, a horrible, crazy, malevolent beast jumped up & tore heart from its safe place.
Safe place could not fight nor believe what had happened 😔
Safe place, picked heart up & said, ‘please hang on ‘, i will get help.
Ah, safe place went over to healings place & laid heart on a beautiful cushion filled with, love, light & power.
Heart looked awful, it was touch & go for a long time. Heart was on life support, poor heart so badly hurt.
One day, safe walked in & heart was sitting up 😃❤️️
‘My heart, you are looking better, your colors coming back!’
Next day, heart was practically dancing & beating like a child. Heart was recovering, no more bleeding, scars looking better, a light was shining wirhin heart.
Safe place said, Heart you look fabulous, wonderful, beautiful 😃
Safe place cranked open their rusty old rib cage & placed heart back inside ❤️️😃
Heart was so happy & started singing, safe & healing place got married & heart witnessed the ceremony ❤️️
Safe, healing heart lived happy ever after. Never the end, just the beginning 😘
Long live hearts ❤️️❤️️❤️️
PR xoxo
@PR,
This is very beautiful. Today I’m doing a little more than going through the motions. There’s a flicker of hope inside me. I spent the yesterday with one of best friends and workout partner. We got out of town and spent the day in a small city where I met some of his old buddies. I calmly explained to them what had happened, and described in detail the shit my ex pulled over the past year and a half.
After their jaws stopped dropping they all said the same things:
1. “You weren’t weak to stay with her. The fact that you could endure this abuse for a year and a half shows how resilient you are”
2. “Please understand, even though you can’t feel it but can probably see it, that you are lucky to be rid of that skank. After you are away from it for awhile you be grateful. You are far too good for her and you know it. You just thought you could fix her”
@PR,
I’m not that religious but recognize the spirituality in things. There is a story in the old testament called “The story of Job” that speaks of men that appear like angels to help Job sort out his loss and faith.
Even though it was just in really cool Mexican restaurant in Syracuse, NY, I realize that the discussion I was having with these other guys that I had just met held dimensions of angelic and spiritual dimensions. The way they were able to plug into my struggle with such wisdom and perfection was amazing.
I have to truly stop worrying about what she is doing. She is a dirtbag without a life. Her life has been propped up by her looks, charm and family money and public assistance. All these things are just illusions of a person that does not really exist. No soul. This person was abusive and dangerous.
I go to court this week to resolve my DWI of 2 years ago. Hopefully I’ll get my license back. I lost a lot over the past to years and made some very bad decisions in choice of a partner. She didn’t ruin my life but broke my heart.
My friend kept reminding me that I have a successful career, have many of the traits a good woman would be interested. AS I rebuild my life I may meet someone when the time is right. The tragic relationship I was in was a learning experience that was so aversive that atleast I was smart enough intellectually (not emotionally though) to not get myself sucked in too far financially. It was just one last sign the powers that be sent me to drive me away from making self-defeating decisions in the future.
I’m starting to pull away from the horror of the jealous emotions and obsession of who she is having casual sex with. IN the end, that is all she is capable of. She is 45, and yes still beautiful, but that will fade, and she is going to find herself very alone. I suspect that when she slows down enough to think about her life, she will realize that. SHe has said to me over and over again, “I know I’m going to end up alone.” Yes H.E. …..you will
I know I’ve left a few apparently harmful/hurtful comments, however I’ve cooled down a tad now, and have a few questions, if you’d like to answer; if you don’t, I guess I understand or something, I have been a bit blunt and it’s hard for me to remember that people can get offended easily >.>
So I’ve been extremely introspective as of late – most of my day is filled up finding out how other sociopaths work, how neurotypicals generally think when they hear the word ‘sociopath’ (usually disgusting, creep, and so on and so forth).
As a child, I was extremely cynical. I knew I was different as such, however I thought it was because I just didn’t care to pretend. I was truly convinced everyone in the world cared as little as I did, that all their tears were fake, that they all hated small talk with a passion and all had triggers. I just assumed they had more patience to pretend, and I always used to wonder how they managed to do it for so long when I found it difficult by the age of only nine. I was convinced everyone was horribly selfish, moreso than I (I’m less selfish than you may think).
It’s only been about a year since I’ve been aware of the term sociopath. What I am makes sense now, however questions of how empaths function still remain.
It feels as if there’s constantly a party and you’re never invited and you don’t understand why. As if you’re missing out on something big in the world, that your life is somewhat devalued because you’re not as ‘human’ as someone else (in some people’s definition).
I’m an alienated disempathetic/hostile type of sociopath, according to Lykken, some dude who does research on sociopaths >.>. because of my crappy childhood and my crappy mind and crappy everything else, inevitably I became quite angry with the world. I also have somewhat poor impulse control. I, understandably, am now extremely asocial.
I guess this site angers me at times because when people say they are currently in a fine relationship with a sociopath, everyone screams RUN.
I’m in a relationship and have been for 3 years now, and honestly, I don’t know how he deals with me. I get bored often, and stir shit up subconsciously, or get irritated. I apologise afterwards, and I mean it. I want the best for him. I’m still not sure if our relationship is selfish or not, but it doesn’t matter to me.
There is a system we find works, however. He’s completely aware what I am, what my triggers are, and how to help, whether that be just leaving me alone or just giving me a hug. He’s aware of what I do, how I get bored, when I lie and how to react.
I have never and will never cheat. and am extremely frustrated at people who do, because what are the chances you’ll find someone to deal with your crap? Why would you want to fuck that up?
Another thing about relationships, sociopaths do not fall in love. We walk into it. We can control how we feel very easily and our love isn’t ‘blind’. We see every single flaw in our partners, yet we love them regardless. Hope that answers a few questions.
I commented earlier that sociopaths come in bad, neutral, and good kinds, as well as many subtypes and blahblah.
There are many different kinds of sociopaths. My father is the only other family member that is one, and he’s the ‘bad’ kind. He used to rape his sister, abuse my sister and I, rape my mother, on and on. I need you to understand that most sociopaths are nothing like this. Half of my genes are him, and I’m exactly like him, yet nothing like him at the same time.
I do apologise for the long life story (half of me is still a child and honestly believes no one actually gives a crap and you’re all just lying ;3) however through this I do have a few questions.
Some of them I expect to be very difficult to answer.
1. What does it feel like to ‘fall’ in love, without being able to have any control? Is it frustrating, blissful, scary? Sorry for the bad wording.
2. Why are empaths so closed-minded? Does it not make sense to keep open minded about all of your opinions so if someone was to bring in a more logical argument against your opinion, you can end up being the wiser? I guess the question here is, why is ignorance equivalent to bliss?
3. Why do you care? This is a very open question, but I don’t know how to word it any better. When someone dies that didn’t benefit you in any way, why do you cry? When you lie, why do you feel guilty? What does guilt feel like? I’ve heard people say it makes your face feel like it’s on fire but I honestly cannot fathom what that feels like.
I apologise for the somewhat childish questions, but I hope you can understand these questions and many more have been on my mind for a long time.
Hi Lyss,
Firstly, thanks for your honesty.
I think most people when hurt by a ‘pathy’, react accordingly & wish to protect others form the same fate & empathize & sympathize also according to the experience.
1. Love is ‘Euphoric’ & does ‘blind’ us, even to lies as love also allows our vulnerability to be on full show. If it then gets violated then, naturally we are deeply hurt. We trust the person we give our love too.
If the trust is broken & we are betrayed then, hence our ‘stories’.
2.We aren’t closed minded, just mindful of your motivations & curiosity about us. We have all dealt with someone that has hurt us, you represent those people. I know that sounds harsh but, like racism, we are not haters of other races, just the individual bad ones.
3.I do not cry at funerals for evil people although, I respect others that do. If someone has hurt me, I will not cry for them. I will not cry for my Soc, never have & never will. I cry for myself & my misfortune is being used etc…
I go to a funeral to support the loved ones, not always the departed one.
If they have been a poor representation of a body/mind in this life, I am saddened that they did not leave a better impression as love never dies except if you are never loved.
So, continue to treat your partner with respect & truth & if you cannot love, then don’t deny his ability to grow & love with you & without you.
If when you die, you are loved, then you have succeeded in this life.
It’s not about you, it’s about how others ‘feel’ about you.
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
P.S. I hope that makes sense 😉
Great answer pr thank you!!
Aww. Well. This is my site. The clue is in the title dating a sociopath. It’s not called hating a sociopath. Socio in my life is still around and as you describe its quite similar. He still does his socio ways control winning snooping etc and the rages come sometimes too. But… On the whole we get on well. I have ptsd from a trauma before I met him. WhIle sometimes he is a problem esp (for me) when he is ranting. I refuse to engage with his psycho self. I know it will pass. He has since last summer changed a lot. Finally got a job, paid me back money he owed. He hasn’t totally changed. He never will. I don’t think. But what has changed is his understanding of himself and his ability to try to manage his behaviour. Like your partner I accept him for who he is. Don’t want to change him. The one in my life doesn’t cheat either not with the other sex. I think that helps. It’s hard enough without bringing in others to the equation. Yeah I think his thinking is the same, I cope with him and his behaviours I understand.
So do you think sociopaths can love? I see it more as ownership possession and control? They consume you which is why partners have a hard time moving on. You talk of your childhood. And I think that is quite often common. His childhood was not good.
In answer to your questions
1. I don’t see love as ownership or possession. I don’t want to control my partner or own them. And would prefer if they didnt own me. Love is unconditional, about loving someone for who they are. Feeling secure enough in that relationship to fall in love but most importantly allowing someone else to love you. When you control you don’t allow someone else to love you. Not naturally. So it is always staged. This caused a lot of fights with the socio in my life. How does it feel? It feels amazing. It feels free. It feels warm inside. Most importantly it’s about trust. The ability to trust. I think that this is something that sociopaths struggle with. It’s about letting go and trusting. Trusting someone with your heart that they will not hurt you. Not controlling and wanting the person to grow and shine and having the confidence that you are still good enough just as you are. I find the concept of control difficult with love as to me control is not love. It is forcing your will onto someone else. I know that socios struggle with trust. They need to control someone else. That isn’t something I ever need. Yeah it can be scary in the beginning. As you don’t want to get hurt. But we take risks with our heart because we can trust.
2. I don’t think I am closed minded. I worked for decades with homeless people. I try not to judge. If you see judgement here it is because people have been hurt. Betrayed let down. As you have acknowledged yourself. There are varying degrees of socios/psychos. The last one in my life had a good heart despite sometimes a bad mind. Not all are like that. You acknowledge some are bad. They are. Really bad, sick sadistic, cruel. I have dated one like that. This type, there is not much to be understood as it is so far away from who we are.
3. Why do we care? We care because we feel someone else’s pain. We are able to put ourselves In someone else’s shoes. To understand how they feel. To be them. It is a natural response to want to help someone even if there Is no benefit to me. Seeing someone smile is my reward. I dont really lie but if I had to tell a lie I would feel bad. Just the same as sometimes when you tell the truth you dont feel right (as the truth exposes you and leaves you vulnerable). Guilt is a horrible feeling. You feel it in your stomach. It eats you up inside. It is a knawing nagging feeling. And you have the overwhelming desire to put what you have done wrong, right. It feels bad to hurt someone else.
I appreciate your questions. And also your honesty.
Love you Pos 🙂 xoxo
I wrote this 🙂
Story about a heart ❤️️
One day my heart was just relaxing & minding its business when suddenly, a horrible, crazy, malevolent beast jumped up & tore heart from its safe place.
Safe place could not fight nor believe what had happened 😔
Safe place, picked heart up & said, ‘please hang on ‘, i will get help.
Ah, safe place went over to healings place & laid heart on a beautiful cushion filled with, love, light & power.
Heart looked awful, it was touch & go for a long time. Heart was on life support, poor heart so badly hurt.
One day, safe walked in & heart was sitting up 😃❤️️
‘My heart, you are looking better, your colors coming back!’
Next day, heart was practically dancing & beating like a child. Heart was recovering, no more bleeding, scars looking better, a light was shining wirhin heart.
Safe place said, Heart you look fabulous, wonderful, beautiful 😃
Safe place cranked open their rusty old rib cage & placed heart back inside ❤️️😃
Heart was so happy & started singing, safe & healing place got married & heart witnessed the ceremony ❤️️
Safe, healing heart lived happy ever after. Never the end, just the beginning 😘
Long live hearts ❤️️❤️️❤️️
Welcome back Lyss,
I also appreciate your honesty. I have also been honest in my response below. I found your last post quite interesting and find that it is in line with how I believe sociopaths think and feel. However, I also believe that you are in the minority of being good and like everything with sociopaths, it’s good on their terms – as long as they have control and as long as they aren’t bored. Anyway in response to your email…
You say that you control love. Real love is not controllable. Real (unconditional) love is given despite what the other person does or say. Real love is a feeling that comes from your soul. It makes the world glow but it also make you vulnerable. Although you “love him” in your way, it’s still conditional. By definintion, to control love means that it is conditional. Real love is unconditional. You say that your relationship may be selfish, but it doesn’t matter to you if it is or isn’t… but as a normal functioning human that your partner is, it would matter to him. But you don’t care because you need to control it. We say run because the relationship, as you stated yourself, is a roller coaster ride. When you get bored you stir it up. That is not a fulfilling loving relationship. That is a constant battle. We say run because no matter what happens, the relationship is one sided in that you control the relationship and he has to surrender to your needs – i.e. its not conditional. The love that you have for him is dependent on how he behaves. WE say run, because being lied to is betrayal and disrespect but for you it is a way of life. But mostly we say run because there are thousands of men and women on here that have been treat so incredibly horribly, and very very few have said differently, that we see that as the norm. You are not the norm. We might be able to get our head around that there may be a few “good” ones out there but the chances of that person being one is very very slim. Tell me, how many good sociopaths do you know? Youre the first that I have come across or heard of. Therefore the advice is much more likely (99%) to hit the mark if we say run. Lying to someone to get your own way, causing pain because you are bored, is not the normal way to live. There are people out there like us (24 out of 25) that can love and respect us equally and that is why we say run, because a caring empathetic person deserves to be treated with respect and to experience real love and to be loved unconditionally so we want them to go and find one of the other 25 – not the sociopath.
IN answer to your questions:
1. What does it feel like to ‘fall’ in love,
To fall in love is the most incredible human emotion there is. To trust and accept someone for who they are and to give yourself completely to that person is beyond articulation. It is amazing, wonderful, beautiful. It is better than anything else in the world. The warmth and fulfilment that comes with it is overwhelming. To love completely and unconditionally, you become vulnerable (and that is a little scary), but that very vulnerability, is what makes the love so complete. Unfortunately, that is also what makes it so painful when that trust is abused, betrayed, broken – whether through infidelity, lying, or abuse.
Why are empaths so closed-minded?
I don’t’ think that we are being ignorant/closed minded. You have to take this site into context… this is a healing website. The people that have come here have been hurt badly both mentally and physically by a certain type of sociopath… the dominant type of sociopath. These type all behave in very similar ways (you can see that by reading all the comments) so we give the advice that we know works. Almost all of us were cheated on. Most of us realise that there are some that do not do this. But we are discussing the masses here. I don’t’ think that is closed minded. Like you, I find your comment a very big generalisation and coming from a very closed minded point of view. You do not know us. You are reading only the bad that you want to see. You are possibly missing the part where we are comforting each other and supporting each other, because by your own admission, it is alien to you. Where has your opinion been logical? You have told us that we are wrong and then got angry at us. How was that disabusing our opinions? It was simply reinforcing it. Yet as you can see, when you come here with a set of non offending aggressive abusive questions, we answer. So who here is closed minded? Neither of us it would seem when taken into context.
3. Why do you care?. When someone dies that didn’t benefit you in any way, why do you cry? When you lie, why do you feel guilty? What does guilt feel like?
Wow, what a great question and one that really shows insight into how hard it must be for you. Especially when added to your earlier paragraph about feeling like you are the only one not invited to the party. We really do have empathy for you lot when we take away our own hurtful experiences (which is hard to do). How empty you must feel. To not have that part in you that cares. To not have compassion. That part that feels pain when someone else hurts themselves. We care because we are human. We feel pain even when someone dies that did not benefit us because we have empathy. We feel their loved ones pain. We feel sad that they no longer have a beautiful life ahead of them. We empathise with how hard it is to loose someone you love. We have compassion for their family. I see a dead cat or dog or bird on the side of the road and I feel sad for that animal. It hurts me for a few moments. I feel sad for their owner. I feel sad that the animal can no longer live, that life and running free is gone forever. I feel sad at the pain it must have felt at impact. I can imagine how that must have felt. You may wonder why this is worth feeling empathy and compassion – sadness is only one side of it, there is also so much joy and happiness that we get from other peoples happiness. And this is part of the unconditional love… love is amplified by knowing how the other person feels, it is holistic. Also, apart from that, without the sadness you can’t have the highs. it is because it makes you appreciate life. It makes you happy to be alive. It makes you appreciate what you have. Life is wonderful and beautiful and full of love and joy but also sadness. One without the other is only half a life. Half the feeling. Empty.
Guilt comes from knowing how that person would feel if I got caught. That person will feel betrayed and hurt and a little part of their love for me would die. I feel guilt because if they did it to me I would be hurt and angry and a little bit of my love for them would die. I feel guilt because I know what I did was wrong. How does that feel? Like a spasm of anxiety. Not overwhelming but when my thoughts go over the betrayal (big or small) I get a stab of anxiety as I know htat I have wronged that person. That if that person finds out that it would hurt them and that if that person finds out I may loose them.
I do feel sorry for you lot that you can never live a whole fulfilling life. That you will never know unconditional love. That you do not feel compassion. How empty and dull your life must be. I am not belittling you. I mean that sincerely. Because I know what it is like to feel and love and to be loved and feel their love holistically. I am extremely empathetic. This has made my life difficult because I care too much. I have too much emotion. But I would never ever swap it for what you have.
If you are truly good. If you really are looking out for your partner. If you really do not treat people as if they are animals because you don’t have compassion or understanding of the pain that you cause them with your behaviour, then I wish you luck. But realise that with the 1000’s of women and men on here that have had horrendous experiences, that you are by far the minority.
I will never go out with a sociopath again. Why would I when I can have the real deal? When I can have unconditional love. A real life. I think though, that this would be very hard for you to understand because you don’t know what the opposite is like. Because you can’t grasp how that feels. But I can imagine what it would be like without it. One, because I have empathy. But two because it is easier to imagine what it would be like if you remove a feeling an emotion than it is to make one up.
You know, it is possible for you to be healed. But you would have to really want too. Perhaps something to think about. Then you could join the party. And although the party does have pain, it has holistic unconditional love and compassion. Without pain, it is hard to learn and grow. Without love it is hard to live.
Peace.
Well said It Is Done 🙂
Love is endless & unconditional, if love is with conditions, that is not Love, that is control as you so eloquently said 🙂
When I ‘pass over’, I will do it knowing I am truly loved by those that I love.
I think the Soc’s will wander endlessly because, even spirits on the ‘other side’ only come back via the eternal connection of love.
Evil spirits are those that have no connection so, if you believe in that, then that is what ‘hell is’, destined to roam forever without a home of love.
Soc’s won’t have that conduit back, ever!
Even if others left behind love them, they don’t love in return so, therefore the ‘loving connection’,is severed by the Soc.
If you harm others by using their love for you against them, that will provoke bad ‘karma’, I can guarantee it. The evil stay lost forever & the good find ‘peace, love & harmony’ for loving in any way, even towards a fellow creature, love pure & simple is returned & rewarded.
Cruelty, selfishness etc…has no reward.
Heaven is not materialistic nor full of possessions, no-one owns anything, just love & love alone 🙂
Keep loving & growing & Soc FREE (yay us)….love but, never forget the lesson the Soc taught us, Love is reciprocal, love is peaceful, love is pure & love is the gift you give to the world.
Soc’s don’t & cannot give this gift, what a shame but, it is what it is.
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
Thank you for replying.
I must ask you however to not feel sorry for ‘us lot’ or anything. We do not feel empty. You can’t miss something you never had. It’s just confusing, is all.
It isn’t, however, possible to be ‘healed’. Telling a sociopath they can learn to feel empathy is like telling a cat to start barking. It can’t. It doesn’t have the capacity to.
@ lyss, I feel sorry for you because you will never know a fullfilling life, you will never know the true beauty of being human.It is sad not to be able to feel life to the fullest, to be connected to everyone and everything. That is why i feel sorry for you. Because I can empathise and I care about other people – even those I don’t know. Its called emapthy.
With regards to being healed, I have heard and read that it is possible. Not by teaching you empathy but by healing your past and the inner hurts. By a lot of therapy, bringing to the surface the real you, the human that you have hidden away and facing your true self and vulnerabilities, you can be “cured”. But you have to want to. YOu have to be ready to feel the pain. But that is the problem, you have hidden the pain so deeply that even you dont believe it is there. THat is what i have read anyway, and it was by a sociopath that was healed.
@It is done
I fail to see how I am any less human, though. I have the exact same amount of personality as everyone else, I laugh, cry, smile, yes it may be more shallow but it still happens. Regarding the life fulfillment, I feel I am very fulfilled. I’m happy where I am, I do not see how empathy allows one to ‘complete’ their life.
And unfortunately, that person was not a sociopath. It is entirely possible for someone to be traumatised and to act cold and isolated, to convince themselves they do not care, however that is merely a protective layer.
I think you fail to understand, there is no pain for me, I don’t care about what happened to me nor can anyone bring me to care.
My mother sent me to therapy for many years because she thought I was twisted, and no one helped. That’s another thing I do not understand, how talking seems to help people. A sociopath does not need nor want help, it’s an altered way of thinking, not a condition.
@ lyss,
You will always fail to see because you don’t know what unconditional love is. There is nothing that I will say that will enable me to show you that. Your life is half a life because you are missing the most amazing part of being human. It is good that you are happy the way you are, but that doesn’t stop me from feeling sad for you because I know what you are missing.
I read your comment written on MARCH 24, 2014 AT 8:08 AM last night and started to write the below response. I think that will go some way to explaining it but as you said, you cant’ teach a cat to bark. Or in this case a sociopath to understand empathy and what that means.
What stood out to me the most (about your comments written march 24), was that your comments were founded on your beliefs not on our reality. And that is because you don’t understand our reality. One thing that you were completely wrong about is that we do care about other people’s life stories, even complete strangers. We really do. We want to make their life better, even though they are complete strangers we empathise with them. We feel their pain. Most of the time there is a side effect of making us feel good as well which is nice. But we would still do it even if it didn’t BECAUSE WE CARE (as long as it doesn’t hurt us too much). We don’t do it to make us feel better. we do it to make them feel better for no other reason than we are human and we feel their pain and we want them to feel good and also as we know how nice it is when someone does that for us.
You also said that sociopaths don’t wake up and say we are going to be knob heads today we just wake up then just go by exactly what you are feeling. But that is the issue. You don’t feel compassion nor understand empathy so therefore everything that you do is self serving. It may seem illogical to you but what we do is not always self serving. We do it because we actually have a connection with every living being through our empathy. We don’t’ go and help someone because that is what is expected, we do it because we truly care. About them. We want to make them feel better. We have a connection with that person (called empathy) that makes us care about them – even complete strangers. Our empathy connects us to everyone. That you said there is not much difference, just our motivation is where you are getting it wrong, all though it is good that you do the right thing despite your lack of care, it is the motivation that separates us and that makes all the difference, that makes life so much more alive. That you have to force yourself to help someone, We don’t’ force. It comes naturally. We want to help. Our empathy which connects us to everyone is what separates us. Our compassion completely separates us.
My question to you is how many good sociopaths do you know? How many do you hang with and discuss their intentions? I assume You have gone to sociopath world at some stage and seen that there are many nasty egotistical bad sociopaths out there. You just have to read this site and read all the damage and destruction that sociopaths have caused these people to see how many bad ones there are. Some of those may have even been “good ones” but they decided to move on because they didn’t care anymore. They also didn’t care about the consequences of their actions nor the damage that they did to the people they once professed to love – because they don’t have compassion, they cant, they can pretend, but they cant mean it. Most don’t even bother to pretend. When my ex finally decided I was no longer fulfilling whatever need it was that I filled, he did not give one thought to me. He did not care that his actions hurt me. He did not care that he disrespected me. He did not care that our life of lies that came out destroyed everything dear to me. He may have cared before and pretended to feel things to please me but once he no longer cared, He was done. My feelings no longer mattered. He completely dismissed me because he no longer cared. That is betrayal. That is hurtful. That is incomprehensible to us because we have compassion and we would not treat anyone that we once cared about like that, not even someone we now disliked.
What makes a good sociopath? Someone who follows the rules? Yes that is true, but do you know the rules? All the rules? When you are done with your partner, you may not lash out and hurt him, but it’s pretty much a certainty that you will also not pretend to care because “you will go by exactly what you feel” This will break your ex partners heart, because even after a break up our feelings for you are still real. Because of that very connection that we all have for each other. Love does not just stop. It takes time to dwindle and go out. But the memory of that love is still in us. For you it is gone. It is done.
I am sorry that you have had a hard life. I am sorry that you are not complete. That you can’t feel empathy or compassion. That you are not connected. I am sorry that you are right, that we don’t want to be associated with sociopaths. But we don’t because of everything that you wrote on this day (March 24) , you don’t understand us and never can. You don’t have compassion. You don’t care about people except those that serve a purpose for you and that you can control. You live by different rules. I understand that this is not your choice. But that doesn’t change that you can’t do selfless acts from a place of compassion. That you can’t truly surrender yourself to love. That you lie all the time and maybe in your case it is because we have forced you into this position. But no one forced my ex to cheat on me and lie about it. No one forced him to pretend he was someone he wasn’t so that I would love him. When I really needed him he didn’t have compassion. He didn’t understand what I was going through and he didn’t want too because he couldn’t. Do I hate him? No. Do I feel sorry for him… I’m not at that stage yet, maybe one day. Can I feel compassion for you? Yes. But can I help you? No, no more than I can help the mentally retarded guy. You are missing something fundamental. But you only suspect it. You will never know what it is and you may be happy that way. But we know. And we feel sadness for you.
Again, I hope that my comments haven’t offended. I am not trying to do that. I am just trying to articulate something that is so hard to explain to someone that cant feel it. That your feelings are shallow show that your life is not as deep and fulfilling. We all have to live life to our best ability and if you are able to do that despite your “shallowness” then that is good as long as you are not hurting those around you. But you are by far in the minority.
@It is done
Thanks for your response.
I must say though, in defense, I do many things selflessly, but my motive is only one of yours; knowing that if I was in that situation I would like it if someone did that for me. That, I guess, shows selflessness, to hope that people see me donate and keep a reminder to do the same to everyone else in that position just in case one day I am.
Aside from my boyfriend and one family member, I have never told anyone I am a sociopath (obviously here I have, as I am basically anonymous), and most sociopaths do the same. Also counting in the point I am asocial. So, aside from my father, I am the only other sociopath I know fullstop.
I have been, and many of the people there are those people who believe it will make them cool to be cruel and cold. I do try to avoid that place, aside from reading M.E. Thomas’ articles.
I believe what makes a good sociopath is, yes. following the rules, but it takes a certain amount of intelligence and self control to be able to KNOW to follow the rules, when to follow them and how.
It’s difficult to do, and takes patience. I remember it was only last year I picked up on the fact that you’re supposed to apologise when someone says someone they knew died. Before then I would just be all ‘oh, no… um.’ and it would sort of put people off. Funny but true little story for you there ;3
You don’t need to worry about offending me, it’s extremely hard to get me offended.
I do believe I am living life to the fullest, however I think our definition of life is different. Yours may be to love, be loved, communicate, and so on and so forth, however mine is to gain knowledge, to be comfortable, and to be free (at least the most one can in today’s extremely restricting society).
@ Lyss,
Hats off to you. I liked your reply. If what you say is true (and excuse the bit of doubt but i do have a bit of experience dealing with sociopaths) then I wish you luck in your life.
I do want to point out one small thing that really defines this whole topic. Where you said:
“I do many things selflessly, but my motive is only one of yours; knowing that if I was in that situation I would like it if someone did that for me. That, I guess, shows selflessness, to hope that people see me donate and keep a reminder to do the same to everyone else in that position just in case one day I am”
The first part of it made me nod my head in approval, but then the part where you say “to hope that people see me donate… in case one day i am” That is not what motivates us at all. We dont’ care if anyone sees, we just know how nice it feels when someone does it for us. There is no pay off for it. THere is no “maybe someone will see and then do it for me”. Its just we know how nice it feels therefore we do it for them. This makes us feel nice. This is that whole connection thing, that holistic magnified feelings thing. When someone loves me and I love them it is magnified because i know they love me and they know i love them and that makes the whole thing even bigger and better. because I know that me loving them makes them feel good, this therefore magnifies my feeling and makes me feel great and makes me love them even more and visa versa…. It really is so hard to articulate.
I really do hope that you stay “good” and continue to get your fulfillment from it.
Peace
@Lyss
I have a question if you don’t mind, do you believe this was genetic make up, or learned behavior or both? Reason why I ask, I have 4 children, 2 raised by NS (ages 8, 10) and 2 fathered by NS (currently 10, 13). My younger son is exhibiting behavior, my daughter 13 does not. Just curious on your thoughts.
It’s extremely hard to tell, I do believe it may have been somewhat genetic makeup, because my sister is, while messed up because of what happened, not sociopathic. However, I did cop a lot more crap than my sister unfortunately.
I think it would most likely be a bit of both. I could have possibly been genetically predisposed to it but it may have become more severe because of what happened, but there’s no way to tell.
Sorry I couldn’t answer your question any better.
@Lyss
What you wrote to It Is Done,
“it is a altered way of thinking, not a condition”
This is what I was looking for. I just couldn’t find the right words? I don’t believe it’s necessarily a DNA thing, (could be) I think it’s a way of dealing with ones life out of circumstances, be it self learned, or taught. My son exhibit more traits when he spends more time with his father, (addict, alcoholic, neglect, etc). As opposed to when he’s with me, he doesn’t have to use NS defense in my household because he isn’t in those circumstances with me. It’s very upsetting for me, it’s like being around a miniature version of his father.
Thank you very much for your reply, it makes a lot more sense now.
@normalisboringsoIheard
It’s quite a problem with the stigma many people create, I think.
You must remember it is also possible for someone to show tendencies but not actually be one, due to it being a self-defense mechanism. In my opinion, sociopathy isn’t a way to deal with things, just a way we were born/brought up whatever it may be that caused our way of thinking.
Glad I could help in any way
@Lyss
I think the boy is on the border, especially since he feels unloved by he’s father and both (the boy and girl) will do anything to have his attention, (maybe love). Their father will do anything to torment me, he HAS to be the best and most loved, (really who cares)! So I just have to be neutral, explain to them please take responsibility for your actions, the easy way is not the best way, etc. Their father is one of those NS’s the ones who think they are God-like and us peasants are here for them, charismatic, life of the party. In reality, horrible, mean, abusive people when the mask is off. And when I say self “defense mechanism” it’s how my son has to deal with life at daddy’s house because it’s not safe. I am sorry let me correct my self, the parenting style is “Free Range” as opposed to my “Dictatorship”. I was going to say there is no parenting in the home, but in California, even no parenting is a style. Lol.
Thank you again, I am beginning to understand more the condition, (the why), not just the actions. Take care.
NIBSIH.
@normalisboringsoIheard
One more thing I must ask however, does your son like his father?
I say this because you said it’s upsetting for you to see how he is like his father.
My mother has said this to me, that I am just like my father many times, and personally I would recommend never saying that and trying to deter from thinking that.
For instance, recently my father called me, abused me over the phone (luckily I do not have the capacity to give a crap about what he says ;3) then literally ten minutes later texted me asking if we could forget that and move on, and that he wanted to spoil me with gifts for my upcoming birthday mark. Me being a sociopath just as he is, I could see right through his games.
My mother told me to not say yes because, in her words, it was ‘selling my soul to the devil’, however I replied with, ‘he can’t beat himself at his own game’. She got extremely upset, began to say I was just like the lying manipulative ass my father was and she would never trust anything I said again.
I wish I could get her to see I don’t want to play his game for the sake of the game (although it is exhilarating seeing his own game being played against him), but because I want to get him to see he can’t just keep fucking up people’s lives like he does without consequences.
My mother thinks I’m doing it for the same reason as my father, to benefit me and only me and to have fun, but she cannot come to terms with the fact that yes, I may have the same personality traits as my father somewhat, but I am definitely not him.
I apologise for the long rant, but my point is, you need to realise that while your son may show the same tendencies, he is not his father, he is still just as human as you and, if you raise him right, he will still be a good person, empathy or no empathy.
@Lyss
They both love their dad, it’s the excessive blaming others and manipulation and lying, especially my son. My daughter she SEES daddy, which makes me sad for her too, she wants to believe her daddy is the best, but she can’t. So she says nothing. I have told them both, daddy has his good qualities, focus on those things about him.
I do not say anything neg about daddy to my children, he does a good job making himself look stupid with out me having to help him. Plus it would hurt my children’s feelings talking bad about him. The only request I ever made of them is when their daddy talks bad about me to them, is to not defend me. I will not have a child defend me. It’s not their place.
I do understand the issue you have with your mother, I haven’t spoke to my mother since 7/2008, until this last 11/2013. I think when our parents get to be a certain age, they can’t change and don’t understand. I will be polite and courteous, I just don’t want her in my life. No games. Because I am me, I shut her out, because you are you, the game excites you. I am played out of the game. I think it makes sense? I don’t think your a liar either. I think your just keeping the game fair regarding your father. With mothers, (and most fathers), children are sacred territory, until the parents die, you just don’t cross that line. My ex tries to all the time. To him, it’s money, a tax write off, a possession, like a car, or shoes, another girlfriend, no seriously. The children are a commodity.
Ugh it’s late. I have to get up early, looking forward to conversation another day!!
Good night, and take care.
NIBSIH.
Hi NIBSIH,
I reas that having a Soc/Narc parent, there are two types.
1. The abusive parent, the child is never good enough, always trying to appease the parent & kept down, not valued, just an annoyance etc…the Soc/Nar can ignore their kids & like a complete strangers child, usually to procur a new target. They ignore their own flesh & blood to impress a new partner by winning over their childre. They set up rivalries etc…
2. The engulfing Soc/Nar will dominate & control their children to do their bidding etc….these children rarely make any independant decisions without consulting the dominating parent. These children become enablers & followers & like to basque in the Socs perceived supremacy etc…. They pander to the Soc for attention & rewards & sometimes emulate that parent. This is how it is perpetuated & those children can become the next in line to the Soc throne.
When the Soc is removed etc…these children flounder as they have always been controlled & manipulated.
@broken. They sound like very supportive people. During our recovery, we really do need to hear those types of things to help us move on. Positive words and Positive reinforcements.
Sadly, the person who I thought I could always lean on, my best friend, barely said two words to me about my relationship break up and our friendship has deteriorated since my break up. She didn’t congratulate me on my house or take any interest at all or wish me a great holiday. I told her that I was suffering from anxiety and depression and that was why I couldn’t go out all the time, once again, she didn’t say much and I felt like she didn’t believe me. She has turned to drinking even more while I have settled down and tried moving forward. I think that a huge part of this has been because of the situation with my Spath and my depression from being in an abusive relationship. In saying all of this, I found a huge supporter in a person I worked with. We laugh, talk about crap and give each other so much support. So thanks to my Spath, I kinda lost a friend but found a new one who has been my strength. This is the kind of people we need to be around. They pick us up when we are down and enjoy the ride when we are on our wave of happiness.
@EX DEF,
Thanks for your kind words. And I too have experienced distance from some good friends on the topic. Fact is they were tired of hearing about it and warned me over and over again to get rid of her.
I’m sorry for your depression. It is brutal after being in an abusive relationship. People outside of it sometimes can have a difficult time identifying with it unless they have been there.
Its been a weird trip for me to go through this as a guy. People tend to be confused when a guy like me gets burned so bad, and can’t understand the depth of my inner despair. “Come on man…you’re a dude, shake it off” is usually what I hear. I have a couple very close female friends that have been helping cope with this dilemma. But in the end, it appears that It’s the couple close guy friends I have that are similar to myself that are getting me through this. I realized yesterday there are just kind nice people in the world that can recognize and tune into someone else’s despair deeply enough to help you through it . These re the people I need to gravitate towards.
I was invited up to a lake party that is taking place when it warms up being hosted by a guy I met yesterday. HE said, “buddy, you just need to get out of that town and meet some new people. Relearn how to talk to women. You have been hanging out with a low life that entered you r life when you down, and she took you down further. She has nothing other than looks. She is a parasite that lives of her millionaire mother and the state. Her mother is forcing her out of the mansion. SInce she is a leach, she was trying to set you up to take care of her. Her mother even offered to buy you two a house. But you know what, you know you would have been paying all the bills. When she realized that you weren’t going to “fund her life or put up with fucked up kids..she moved on to do the only thing she knows how to do: manipulate another man into hopefully doing what she wants them to. Again, there will be a lot of really nice successful women at this party. Don’t try to hook up (which isn’t really my style anyway). Just practice talking to them. You have been a state of despair and need to starting caring about yourself again. THe punishment is over if you want it to be. The punishment is over. In a year when you have your life, a nice apartment (or house) and car back you will meet a women that is good for you. But you have got to love yourself enough to do that.”
Pretty amazing insightful words from someone I had just met. Maybe the punishment is over. I just need to listen to good advice
@ PR,
ANd by successful women, I mean successful in life, not wallet.
I refer to.the basics:
good values
kind
self-supporting
@ Broken & Ex 😃
I read this today & thought it timely so, here is a quote by George Sand (Amandine Dupin) 1804-1876
‘Guard within yourself that treasure, kindness. Know how to give without hesitation, how to lose without regret, how to acquire without meaness….
Know how to replace in your heart, by the happiness of those you love, the happiness that may be wanting in yourself.’
@Broken, your friends, new & old are the greatest allies so, go forth & re-engage with life 🙂
They sound like great guys so, enjoy the male bonding as the ‘brotherhood’ is just as vital as the ‘sisterhood’.
@ Ex Def, likewise, rally your supporters, old & new. If someone lets yoy down, forgive them, they don’t understand thats okay. If they find solace in drinking then they have their own demons 😦
Make new friends but, befriend yourself & keep nurturing your growth & repair. Be proud, you are growing at your own pace & independant of others, that’s a great way to be, self reliant & resilient.
Go out & enjoy life, keep it simple & take it at your pace. No-one has an agenda anymore.
Keep being authentic & true to yourself.
The rest is easy 🙂
Love PR xoxo
@Broken
I love the Story of Job, I googled it once – it was titled “why do the innocent suffer….” Sigh. Just proceed with life the best you can.
Also I love this song, when I am down in the dumps I go to gospel. Don’t ask me why? I just do. Hopefully my non techie self can put a link up here. 😡. And no my computer and lap top are not working.
@PR,
It is a great song! I just got done reading “Psychopath Free” written by a woman named “Peace.” Its helpful. I hurt a lot as I read through it knowing all that has happened. I’m praying for the day I can just accept it and move on.
Right now I’m just hanging onto the fact that she is a subhuman loser that isn’t fit to tie my shoes
@broken
I have been having problems with my yahoo and ymail accounts, I am soo done. I am slowly transitioning everything over to gmail, aol, and hotmail . – hackers grrr – destroyer of lives!! It’s yahoo which is the worst. – sorry yahoo people – but you are!!!!
Like right now, I can’t even get into the blog?? What the heck??
??? I don’t know why. I haven’t blocked anybody?
Ugh and they still aren’t seen on the site? Oh crud??
I am in the mist of changing everything
http://m.bbc.com/news/technology-26985818
Ugh!!!
@lyss…I also fond your posts interesting. It is always good to hear from your side how things are and you are not rude about it either. It is quite refreshing really.
Thanks, I admit I can come across extremely rude sometimes, but it’s difficult to remember that people can be so easily offended. I must say, a few people stay away from me merely because I do not get the point of ‘beating around the bush’.
When I was in my final years of school, and girls would cry about how they didn’t get a certain formula or their friend got a better mark than them, I’d tell them they were being ridiculous, not in a cold-hearted way, just blunt, and would tell them there was no use in crying over it because that wasn’t going to achieve anything.
So for the last 3 years of my schooling I forced myself to avoid everyone because I couldn’t understand their emotions and didn’t want to bring unintentional harm to them ;3
Hi Lyss,
A question, as your partner knows, does he get tired of the Jekyl & Hyde behavior? I still can’t fathom being with a Socio/Narc? Knowingly?
Is he co-dependant?
Thanks,
PR 😃
@Pheonix Rising
He does tire very often. However he is certainly not codependent. I make sure he’s aware at all times (to the point he gets quite pissed off when I say it over and over) that he can leave whenever he wants and I never want to make him feel forced to stay with me.
He is bipolar however, so I think he would understand the reasoning behind some of my tendencies as well, seeming as he knows what it’s like to have triggers and to not be able to control yourself sometimes, even though it’s not exactly the same.
@Lyss
Thank you for your message. It is very insightful into sociopathic thinking for both the elements you express directly and also your indirectly expressed thinking. In the latter category, your reasons for not cheating are very insightful. It shows a clearly calculated cost benefit analysis from a self-centered perspective. The reason something is not done has nothing to do with a perceived understanding (a form of empathy) of how it might hurt the other party. Rather, it is done because to do so might “fuck up” the currently beneficial situation and then force a hunt for replacement. It demonstrates that even in the closest of relationships there is inability to make calculations apart from how they impact self gain or loss.
The asking of questions regarding how “empaths” think or feel about things seems to imply a binary way of looking at humanity. There are only empaths and sociopaths in that construct. Many of the studies out there, however, seem to show humanity instead rather being spread across a spectrum. Individuals come out in all ranges between empathy and sociopathy, possessing both characteristics (See Pos’ recent blog post on “How much of a Sociopath are you?”). There will, however, be many individuals on each of the far sides of spectrum. Why people are where they are on the spectrum still seems to be a matter of debate between nature vs. nurture and seems unlikely to be sorted out anytime soon.
Regarding the vast middle part of the spectrum there have been numerous studies and writings on how the development of the limbic brain and its giving the human race the ability to be empathic, care and love has advanced our species from both the individual and group perspective. Without it, life is a singular, struggle for survival, not unlike the antelope out on the African savannah. With it, we can have society and the increased benefits that cooperating and sharing brings about through division of labor.
Why the individuals in the middle care, share and cooperate are diverse and can range from the subliminal feelings that come from belonging(more towards the empathic side of the spectrum) to the calculation of enhanced personal gain that can come from cooperating with another (more the sociopathic side). More information on such writings can be had in Margaret Stout’s work as well as writings from the Ludwig Von Mises Economic Institute.
Numerous studies have also been done with those very high on the sociopathic side of the spectrum that show how they bring about through their behaviors the very outcomes they fear the most. One of those being abandonment. Most of these studies revolve around Nash Equilibrium and the Prisoner’s Dilemma, where players can choose strategies of cooperation or sole benefit. Payoffs for sole benefits are high for single round wins. Cooperative strategies will bring higher mutual payoffs over time. Sole strategies chosen by one player, however, force other players into sole strategies if they are to get any payoff. The studies show that highly sociopathic individuals will always adopt a sole benefits strategy even though the payoff over time to them is less. They can not seem to adjust their thinking to getting less of a payoff on an individual round rather than a higher payoff over time.
Your comments about “your crappy thinking and your crappy life” triggered this in my mind. Perhaps your way of thinking(sole benefits strategy) and the subsequent life actions it brings about are responsible for the “crappy” outcomes you experience.
There are true incentives and benefits to approaching life from an empathic point of view. Whether a shift out of the wings of the spectrum is possible can be debated. However, the incentives to doing so are empirically backed and should be explored.
@agoodplantoday
I find your comment very fascinating.
It’s interesting to see the spectrum, and how there are even variations within the term sociopath itself. While generally they all suck at planning for the future, some are able to overcome this in different ways by applying other kinds of logic.
M.E. Thomas, creator or sociopathworld.com and a sociopath herself talks about how she managed to create a sustainable retirement fund by the age of 30 by countering her sociopathic traits. She knew she was bad at planning ahead, so what she dd was every time the thought would come to mind, she would transfer all her savings to an account that was difficult to withdraw from and made it her retirement account. It would make her feel bad for losing money at that time but the feeling would quickly fade, and because generally sociopaths get bored quite easily and do not have much motivation to go out of their way to do things, she made the process of withdrawing so long and difficult that she couldn’t even be bothered.
What I take out of this is that it is important, for neurotypicals and others alike, to discover all their weaknesses and built defenses against them. I was extremely impressed when I heard what she did, and think it could apply to almost everything, not just financially.
Whether is be poor future planning, poor commitment, over commitment, there are ways to put strategic defenses up to prevent the worst happening (which has happened to me, I am currently unable to pay even my mobile phone bill because I’m irresponsible with money).
@Lyss
Hello, I’ve read some of your posts and it has helped me confirm so many of the things I experienced while dating a sociopath. Many of your comments rang so true they hurt. It was like hearing a more intelligent version of my Soc articulate the very things that I saw during my down fall. She too (after the honey moon of 3 months and her love-bombing was over and I started getting annoyed at her bazaar insulting comments that would come out of nowhere and her periods of complete silence and going off the radar) she would say, “I know this is really hard for you. If you choose to break up with me I would understand.”
My mind would state the obvious of “why couldn’t she just pick up the phone when I call. And why doesn’t she try to change this if she cares.? Again, this is only after 3 months. I would foolishly ask her if she even cares about me or the relationship. She answer yes. At periods when her bizaar and often emasculating behavior would drive me over the edge, I would tell her I didn’t want to see her anymore. She would come over with tears in her eyes and somehow warm her way back into my heart. But in hindsight, she would never apologize or take responsibility for her behavior that made me break up with her. Her brazen laziness really amazed me as well. I’m talking about being too lazy to even see if I needed anything after I broke my leg and ankle. She choose that incident as a stage to tell me how bored she was.
She often would use her kids as an excuse for not being available, then show up out of the blue all manic and wanting to do “go out.” Of course, when I called her and tried to initiate a date, it was always a struggle for her to just say yes. Again, I realize in hind sight that this was her poor impulse control and selfishness. She would only want to go out when “she thought of it.”
Her mother offered to buy us a house. (which I of course would pay all the bills to maintain). Because of her behavior (for lack of better term), I passed on the offer and thought we needed to build a stronger relationship first. that never happened.
She would often accuse me of saying things that I know I didn’t do just to put me down, and basically create a crisis and power struggle. I know now that this was gaslighting.
Her final discard of me ended with her saying, “You can’t drive me anywhere cuz your leg is broke and you won’t take me on vacations and trips. You put no effort into this relationship.”
Any feedback you can give me on this I welcome. I’m not so worried about my heart..that will mend. But, I must admit, my mind is still in a confused state.
Thanks,
Broken
@Broken
I almost laughed at the whole silence part. I know you might think it’s on purpose and it’s t hurt you, if they suddenly go silent and their behaviour is very back and forth like that, but it’s not intended at all.
I get yelled at a lot by my boyfriend because I’ll randomly go silent and stay in my own head. I know I need to say something to stop the issue going on, and I try force words out of my mouth but for some reason it’s almost impossible. I’m unsure whether it’s to do with lack of deep emotion and therefore having too many objective thoughts in my head, but it feels like my head is spinning with facts, deep thinking, I can’t put it into words, but all of these thoughts sort of suck me in and I’m left in my head. I assume that’s a reason why we’re so good at lying, thinking objectively and quickly, and not so great at social skills; because we spend too much time in our own heads.
I can’t exactly comment on the fact that she used to whittle her way back into your life part, each time he’s broken up with me, I haven’t tried to get him back at all I’ve just let him go and he always comes back, I swear not on purpose! I guess that’s an individual thing, not specifically a socio thing.
I do assume however she always struggled to say yes to your dates is because of the sense of power. Most socio’s are terribly stubborn, and want it to be them starting something or no one.
Thanks for your comment though, interesting to see how some other types, clearly more social socio’s live.
i am in the process of getting a new job, we work together and NC is almost bloody impossible. i am so caught up in it all. countless times i have had to hear, “i am leaving her” i keep asking when and he keeps saying when he has settled his son and other issues. Why can i not bloody let go!
Yes, I have that problem but now that he has a new source, he isn’t contacting me as much. I think he thinks I will always be around because in the past I had that addiction to him. I have moved a long way from then but he doesn’t see that, he will always see that crazy person.
I think it is human nature to respond to someone. When he sends you a message, don’t respond to it immediately. What helped me was reminding myself how crappy it felt to be yelled at or get a response of hmmm or eye rolling or something negative towards me. Even when his response was nice to start with, towards the end it would make me feel like crap. That helped me to not want to contact him or respond to him.
They create an addiction towards them. You know how PTSD, anxiety and other mental illnesses have triggers. I believe when an Spath contacts you, it can also be a trigger for that addiction again.
Hi Ex D & Esperanza 😃
They have formed a betrayal bond with you, they betray, you stay addicted.
Why, it’s because if ‘cognitive dissonace’. That is you can’t reconcile in your brain the initail person you were ‘sold’, with the one behind the mask.
We all default back to the ‘good’ times & block the ‘bad’, until the final penny drops & the reality of who they are & how they conduct themselves sinks in.
Stay NC & get healthy & healed. Life is about balance so, you must focus on you 😃
If you have contact, stay in your power of knowing who you are & who they are. Tell them that you know what they are & are not interested in being a ‘game piece’. Forgive them their inability to be the person that they ‘sold’ you etc….they hate it when they know you know 😃
It shut mine down, game over & we all move on. Up escalator for us, they stay on the Merry-go-round forever!
Love & Light 😃
PR xoxo
wow thanks so much everyone for your support. its been a rough time for me 😦 but at least were helping one another through our experiences with these depraved individuals. Even though were all different people our stories are so similar you’d think Sociopaths were created in a factory somewhere on a remote island! lol, but on a serious note, more people seem to be coming out with their stories, and thats a good thing, at least.
love and hugs to all of you
Esperanza
🙂
Sorry but that’s definitely not what cognitive dissonance is >.>
wow thanks. and I have to remember that. whenever he didn’t get his way he went from sweet talking me to yelling in my face and cursing at me. that’s certainly something that won’t be forgotten
Esperanza, resisting temptation is a daily struggle. Resisting the urge to believe them again is hard, really hard. They know we love them (or are addicted to them) and to them that is the key to keep control over us. That’s why no contact it’s so important at least until you are strong enough to realize that every “I’m sorry…I still love you…Why we don’t meet again…” it’s really a “what else you have that I can take?” And when you are strong enough you will not have any desire for anymore contact.
Keep your hope, your esperanza…everything will be better
thanks so much 🙂 hugs
This site is great. I was struggling a bit before I found this place and now I have made quite a bit of progress since. Just being able to vent or come on for support has been great. It is very scary that many of our stories are quite similar or the things they all say or do are similar as well. Also our reactions and thoughts are very similar as well. I have days where I wonder if my Spath is actually an Spath. It is sad that I have to remind myself what he did to me wasn’t normal at all and he is a sick individual for expecting me to forgive and forget that it ever happened or that it happened in the first place. They taint love for us and make us question everything we believe in.
Hi Ex D 🙂
Don’t worry whether he is a Spath or narc or whatever, just know he has a disordered mind & has hurt you 😦
You keep focusing on you & your healing & remember that whilst we have all been hurt, we are rising & healing to a greater awareness.
I found this verse today so, I’d like to share it with you 🙂
‘Be patient toward all that is unresolved in your heart….
Try to love the questions themselves….
Do not now seek the answers,
which cannot be given because you would not be able to live them,
And the point is,
To live everything.
Live the questions now.
Perhaps you will then gradually,
without noticing it,
Live along some distant day into the answers.’
Rainier Maria Rilke.
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
P.S. we are all the same empaths, being hurt by the unempathic, that’s why we are all here supporting each other 🙂
@ Lyss,
Re cognitive dissonance, tell us what you think it is.
That was my take on it from a clinical psychologist. It was simplified somewhat as I hope people will look it up themselves.
Cognitive dissonance is a phenomenon where a person’s attitude and behavior do not match, and one feels internal anxiety from it.
To reduce this anxiety, the person will change their attitude to fit in with their behavior.
For example. Someone who is strictly against smoking but has recently become stressed and took it up will experience cognitive dissonance. They will change their attitude from something like, ‘smoking kills and doing so is a death wish’ to something more like ‘everyone dies some way’ or ‘it doesn’t do that much damage’.
@Lyss,
can’t find the thread, but thanks for the feedback. Its very insightful
Broken
@Broken
It’s all on the next page if you’re wondering.
@PR
Good morning. I just read the whole chapter Identity destruction and the manufacturing of codependency the soc creates through cognitive dissonance after the initial assessment stage and love-bombing. Once they have assessed you & gauge your insecurities and things precious to you, they start saying and doing very hurtful things that are directed to deconstruct your identity and replace it by an addictive cycle created by the emotional confusion they cause with the hot and cold act. You end up looking to them for mediocre crumbs which they are happy to dish out to string you along before they attempt to discard you. I realize now because I’m intuitive and started recognizing her traits, I probably wasn’t of a “source” for her anymore…..not much fun.
I more or less explained this process to my SOC last time there was contact before her discard. This more or less made her fly into a rage to say things like, “I’m tired of being with an old man who can’t even walk. I need a young hard D*&K.. I need someone who is going to show me a good time and take me places.” Yup a real sweety
Cognitive – thought process
Dissonance – Confusion
I posted about 6 months ago my story and I’ve followed along since then to others. I have a question now though. It’s been getting close to 3 years since I finally got out of things with my soc ex. I am now actually married. My ex, as I mentioned way back when, even tried to have me commited when I tried to leave him! But now, almost 3 years later, he’s still emailing me and either something nice, or he’ll tell me he thinks that -I- lied about things despite everything he was caught doing and his last tactic is to threaten me. It happens every two weeks like clock work. I almost feel like he is writing to an audience. I don’t reply, yet they still keep coming. He’ll say things like how I clearly misunderstood things (like being cheated on?) and I should be more understanding of people. Or threaten to try and steal my dogs, things like this. Now, I live literally across the world now so the threats are starting to just bounce off. But to be honest he still scares me, and the fact that after 3 years he won’t stop…. I am scared it’ll continue forever. How do I make it stop forever? No contact isn’t working, a restraining order isn’t working… What do I do? It’s such a trigger when I get these emails…
Can you use the restraining order against him? Or is this not possible?
@Lyss,
On a more humorous note, these are some of her ideas of dates:
1. Asking me to go for the long 2 hour drive to keep her while she took her 11 yr old home. She said I had to ride in the back.
2. Inviting me over for dinner & then trying to goad her psycho 25 yr old son into “fighting me”
3. Driving with an open can of beer and casually handing it to me when the cops pulled her over for speeding.
4. Taking me to her old house she had lived in when she was married and proceeded to tell me how many guys she f*&$%d there while her husband was at work.
*I grew up taking care of an alcoholic mother so I was pre-conditioned to try and fix her which is why I stayed so long. I must admit though, I do feel like a chump.
nice girl
@Broken
Well.
Clearly sociopathy isn’t the only thing in her brain ;3 I think a site more along the lines of ‘datingacompleteweirdo.com’ would do her more justice
@Lyss,
That’s funny and thanks again. I remember I made the mistake of letting her “escape” to my apartment a year ago. Her mother, who she lives with, was mad at her. I let her hangout there while I was at work. She made a point of announcing got me that she “brought me art supplies” (a couple markers) and put them in my bottom desk drawer That drawer is where I keep my most personal information.: Financial, education, and military records, etc.
When she got drunk she would, describe in a very round about way. certain items I had. She would do this by saying “I wish I had…..”. She is at heart a coward, and really has the focus of a 3 yr old. She is only dangerous emotionally. And she knows from my own background that I don’t play around with people that try to rip me off. So I don’t think she is capable of doing me any real harm by having my information. And she knows that I’m astute enough to figure it out quickly and would take immediate action. The damage she caused with me was my health and emotional wellbeing, which for me, was enough.
Yes, she is a freaking weirdo. And maybe when I’m feeling better I’ll write a book of her antics, and it would probably be funny and very sad at the same time considering she is the one who is left with her own mind. Not me.
*One more thing she did was ask her own son (one of her sons) to hop in the trunk to save admission fee when the three of us were passing the ticket gate to go t an event.
A real peach that girl
Hi Lyss,
I don’t think your a monster at all as I do not know you & you have not done or offended me in any way whatsoever.
I would call anyone who hurts another individual a monster, they could be an empath, a homosexual, a person with autism.
If their intent was to harm another etc…
I would call myself a monster if I hurt someone badly enough to make them become depressed or take their own life or if I murdered them by my own hand.
Unfortunately some people here have been driven to the point of no return purely because the person they thought loved them & had their best interests at heart, betrayed them.
I don’t think my Soc/Narc or whatever is a monster either.
I do however find it appalling to be ‘targeted’ as a possession, (his words) & pathologically lied to & had my life ‘put on hold’ until he found another source of supple etc…this was my individual experience & my individuality, like yours was not a consideration to him. He wanted to control & manipulate & therefore I did not ‘grow’ independently from him, rather I was his object (I deplore objectification of anyone, including you).
I am sure, you ‘feel’ emotions but, loving is unconditional & not a ‘means to an end’.
If someone else to take advantage of your feelings I am sure you will agree. If someone used your vulnerabilities & weaknesses to manipulate you, I think you would have a different opinion.
If the people you ‘love’ use you purely for a supply source, then that is a monstrous act & I would never do that to anyone else.
I had an abusive background as a child but, fortunately I did not let that change my mind to, hurting others on my quest to have ‘power’ or play games etc….
I’m a mother & I want to nurture my children into ‘free willed’ & ‘free thinking’ independent people & I protect them as best I can from abuse.
I teach them to never accept the unacceptable, from others as no-one deserves to be treated without compassion & love& humanity.
If an action is designed to hurt or abuse or strip someone of their humanity, then that is not worthy of who you are, you deserve the best, everyone does.
I wish you love & light & I truly do 🙂
As long as you are not harming another by your actions, I have nothing against you or anyone really.
PR xoxo
@Pheonix Rising
I must say, I found your most recent comment extremely contradictory to your previous one.
“If someone used your vulnerabilities & weaknesses to manipulate you, I think you would have a different opinion.”
I cannot really comment much more on this one, as I assumed you would have been able to acknowledge the fact that, as a sociopath, I would not get absorbed enough to allow them to get to that point. That is not to say I would not let them in, however I do believe sociopaths are a lot more emotionally intelligent in that way, as to be able to shove aside their emotions to be able to look at everything objectively, and when I were to see what they were attempting to do, I would easily leave, no emotions there as I can take them at will.
I guess that causes much frustration between empaths and sociopaths; the fact that sociopaths basically think, ‘why not just not be stupid and use your brain and leave’, meanwhile empaths are thinking, ‘if you think it’s that easy you’re the stupid one’. From what I gather, anyway.
You mentioned “a means to an end”, when referring to love. I don’t think you quite understand what I mean. There is no end to the love, it’s still love, the only conditions put on it are, ‘if you become a complete dickhead, I’ll just take my emotions elsewhere without a second thought’. I don’t steal money from him, I don’t do any of that, it’s basically normal relationship terms aside from the lack of residual feelings after the termination of the relationship.
It’s hard to think how the majority of the people here manage to pick such bad people, mainly because I do look at all flaws in everyone and don’t ‘fall’ in love. For a very long time my thoughts to everyone who dated someone like that was, ‘you’re the idiot for going into a relationship like that, not them.’ There are signs. I’m not talking about sociopathic signs, as I said before, the majority of the women here on this site pick dickheads, but dickhead is not equivalent to sociopath. People like the people I’ve read women rant about on this site WOULD HAVE basically screamed ‘HEY I’m going to ruin your life’, and somehow they go ‘that’s ok I’ll let you anyway, for some strange reason, then I’ll cry about it later and say it was your fault’
^Veeeery blunt. But think about it.
If you have any more questions, feel free to ask.
Hi Lyss,
I wasn’t being contradictory & I relate to each person here individually & my response to Broken about his relationship, not everyone else.
My Soc was a charismatic one/covert narcissist & appeared for some time as the hero, not the villain in my life so, I did not run screaming & probably never would have as it was only another woman that alerted me to his behavior. I was none the wiser & was being kept in his ‘collection’ but, I had no clue of his activities until after I was informed via email…it’s a long story.
My Soc used the ‘mind-gaming’, hypnotic influence & was very charming & normally stayed in the seduction persona with me & I rarely saw the mask slip until after the ‘fog’ lifted.
He worked 2 jobs, & we did not live together as we both had our own homes etc…
As you said & I reiterated, each person is different & so is everyone here’s journey.
We are not ‘Soc’ haters, just haters of the experience that our own Soc/Narc etc…created in our lives.
I would have run screaming if I had been given a heads up earlier & the fact that mine has duped a Dr of Sociology (she now sees this) , he is very clever & crafty & involves enablers & followers as he does it withing his family, at work & in his private life etc…he used to call himself my ‘Master’, I thought it was a joke but, he is supremely delusional & full blown, like Richard Fuld, Lehman Brothers type….mine is covert though & not overt.
I didn’t run screaming until I realized what I was dealing with & I am still running & he has tried to triangulate me back in! I am forever in NC.
@ lyss, your last comment To PR just shows how little you understand. You will never understand because you don’t have the level of emotions that we do. It made me laugh out loud when you said that sociopaths in this case have a higher emotional intelligence. That is not what emotions are about. You probably have a higher rational intelligence because you can devoid yourself of emotions at a blink. That is not a higher emotional intelligence, that is the opposite. It is removing the emotions. Which is completely the opposite to understanding them. Which is what emotional intelligence is. You have already shown in our previous conversations that you do not understand what motivates us. You can not comprehend it. even when you thought you had, you got it wrong. That comes from not understanding our emotions.
As well, you have said yourself that there are different sociopaths. All your comments have been based on your experience and how you feel and act which is basically good (in a weird sociopathic way) There are sociopaths out there that want to hurt people. That don’t believe that they should live by the rules. That want to squash empaths for whatever reason. When someone slights them, they want to hurt that person because they believe that they are better than us and how dare we do that to them. Where is the proof… all over this site and the others like it. There is even proof on sociopath world from the sociopaths own mouths.
You say that you don’t understand how we picked bad people. We didn’t, we picked a wonderful, caring, loving guy (or girl) that had the same values as us, as that is what they showed us they were. They pretended to us so convincingly that they were these amazing people. They lied on purpose to get us to love them. Just because you are a “good” sociopath does not mean that all the others are. Just the same as not all empaths are good. Our mistake is not realising that sociopaths existed. That Bad sociopaths existed. That people could pretend to love someone. I am sure in some of their cases, and even probably mine, they thought that they were doing us a favour by being everything we wanted and in their own way they “loved” us. But they couldn’t keep up the appearance. They couldn’t’ pretend for long. and when we slighted them, they got angry. And when we weren’t as perfect as they thought – they got mean, and when we showed signs that we may leave, they punished us for their perceived abandonment. Or even, when they started to care to much they left us. We did not choose bad people. we were lied to and manipulated and we stayed because of the cognitive dissonance because we wanted to believe that they were who they said they were so much that our brains convinced us they were and it was us not them.
As you have said, there are many different types of sociopaths. In our experience, mostly bad. I think that everyone here should be aware that you speak from one point of view of a certain type of sociopath. And although it can give us insight, by your own admission , you are not all the same.
I am glad that you have managed to use your sociopathness for good. But people here need to be aware, that you are the minority and the proof of that is from the terrible things that these people ahve done. Most of the sociopaths talked about here have not jsut walked away, they have tried to destroy that persons reputation, life, friends, family – everything. These actions are not the consequences of someone who has just switched off and walked away, they are of people that are trying to purposfully and maliciously destroy the one that they once “loved”. I am glad that is not you. but read the stories here and you will see that you are the minority.
@Pheonix Rising
Psychologists, psychiatrists, people who study sociology – the majority of them are fools. They’re trained to listen to people’s problems and no more. They think they’re intelligent, that they could detect almost anything, but honestly they’re even easier to fool than most people.
@It Is Done
You say you understand your emotions and I do not. Yet, it must take some level of comprehension to be able to control them, and it also implies a very little understanding to not be able to control them. Knowledge is power, after all.
There are different sociopaths, I have said that many times indeed. And that’s not to say the ‘good’ ones want to live by the rules. They don’t. they just do it, with spite. There is one reason for the existence of rules and one only; to govern those who do not have the intelligence to make their own. You may read that as ‘fuck the rules do bad things’ but that’s not what I mean at all. Sociopaths create their own rules, whether that be anywhere near your standards or not. For example (and example only) some of mine are don’t fuck with something unless it’s broken, always look when you cross the road, and don’t be a sheep. Others create other rules. It depends on the personality f the person as to which rules they create.
As I said, the majority of people here whine about dickheads that THEY chose, not sociopaths.
If you honestly think ‘good’ sociopaths are the minority, look around you. Approximately 1% of people are sociopaths, heck your best friend may be. They don’t have a site for people who date ‘nice’ sociopaths. By saying we’re a minority, is like saying you’ve never seen a giraffe in your life therefore they don’t exist, or saying you’ve seen one giraffe and therefore coming to the conclusion they must be severely endangered. It’s ignorance, and I guess to you, that’s bliss.
There ARE signs to everyone’s personality and who they are. It’s easy to tell, within a minute, even, who that person is, why they are like they are, what issues they face and what issues you will face because of them. It’s called analysing someone, reading into their words, their actions, their appearance. I assumed you knew how to do it from the get go. My bad. Learn. It helps.
@ lyss,
No, i didn’t say that you didn’t understand YOUR emotions, I said you didn’t understand OUR emotions. Being able to control someone doesnt’ mean you understand their emotions, it just means that you can rationally deduce that if I do this, then that person will do that. As my ex very quickly learned, I did not react the same way as his ex wife did, yet he expected me too. Infact, i believe that he left me because he couldnt figure me out as i did not react the way he expected. This is because you can understand the symptom but not understand the problem. Sociopths read the reaction and can logically deduce how to “shepard” that person but still don’t understand the emotional reason why.
With regards to your comments about the giraffe and 1% of the population, rather than a giraffe, why dont we use the term devil. I only have your word saying that these people exist and are good. I have no more proof than god exists – just your belief, because if they do exist and are good, how are you going to prove it? You yourself are asocial, so you don’t insert yourself into society normally so how do you know? Those that are “good” may appear that way but we dont’ know what damage they are doing at home, to their family, to their children through their own self serving lives. Therefore, You can also tie that in to your comments about rules. Again, you talk about (and i may have misunderstood here as your communication is a bit confusing here) good sociopaths living by the rules and yet now you are saying that sociopaths make their own rules, and as already discussed, sociopaths are self serving because they are not connected to the living by empathy as the rest of us are. Therefore your rules may be good to you, and how you perceive them to be good to everyone else but they will still be based on what is self serving to you and what you perceive as good, which undoubtedly misses the mark on occasion no matter how good because you dont’ understand our motivation or empathy or compassion which (coming full circle) connects us to everyone else.
Again, your last comment made me laugh. You will never get it. You may be able to get insight into who you think we are but you dont’. You just get the symptoms. I find it amusing that you sociopaths call us sheep. Your own ego’s just think that you do. We believe the same about you sociopaths, we just don’t use the derogatory term. You all act the same in the end. You react the same way to certain triggers. You behave the same way in situations. I understand and read people on a level you never can. I just choose not to control them by that understanding because my empathy knows how wrong that is.
Now I am aware that sociopaths exist, you can be sure that I will spot the next one a mile away. It’s quite easy to do. Because of those triggers and behaviours i just talked about.
@It Is Done
“No, i didn’t say that you didn’t understand YOUR emotions, I said you didn’t understand OUR emotions.”
You’re again referring to sociopaths as if they are not human. We all have the same emotions, just to different extents. JUST like the variety in ‘normal’ people. What may make you overjoyed might make some other empathy slightly happy and it might make a sociopath somewhere in between. It’s the ability to control those emotions that separate us.
So, in accordance to your ex, if you think he broke up with you because he couldn’t figure you out compared to his ex-wife then man, get your head out of your ass. He broke up with you for other reasons, I can guarantee.
“Why don’t we use the term devil.” That comment has absolutely no value in this discussion whatsoever. Please, elaborate. And please, explain why you completely disregarded the actual purpose of my comment.
We do create our own rules, however we are smart enough to realise it’s not the most appropriate move to break society’s rules at certain points in time. The fact that we have to abide by some of these stupid rules, is what annoys us.
“You will never get it”
How many times do I have to hear that before you realise you get way less than you think you do, too?
“I understand and read people on a level you never can.”
Lol.
So you talk about how you were fooled by some guy so badly, then al the sudden that one experience turned EVERYTHING around and now you’re a psychologist?
I repeat. Get your head out of your ass. I’m clearly not the egotistical one here.
You couldn’t spot one for the life of you. Not if they have any smart to them.
I do not wish to reply to someone who is so unbelievably hypocritical anymore, if you have anything of value to say then sure, I’ll read and reply, if not, I tire with your idiocies and your contradictories and your naivety and ignorance and your bad attempts at hiding how emotional you are.
@Lyss,
I read your post to POS about there not being any therapy out there for people with AsPd. Actually I believe there are some options. Behavioral therapy points directly to cost/risk assessment. aka “If I do this, then that is going to happen.” IF you could identify those areas/behaviors that you would like to harness and point in a more positive direction, it might work. Impulse control, rage control, and decision making would be key. There would not be a spiritual element that would relieve your boredom or emptiness.
I’m currently working a twelve step program and you might want to look into that as well. Just google 12-steps. There is a protocol to following them (you have a sponsor or mentor), but the payoff for many people is remarkable. Its not holy roller stuff, its about developing a connection with a power greater than ourselves. Again, its a personal process that needs other people at the same time. It is a very non-judgemental environment that may well provide you with a spiritual element that would relieve your boredom or emptiness.
I hope I didn’t offend you as I am only trying to help
@Broken
Not meant to be rude but, isn’t that just learning how to have a better mask? You can lead a horse to water but you can’t force it to drink.
Impulse control training I could use (although unsure of how on earth that would go down) but I really don’t believe any of the others would help. I hardly have a sense of spirituality and personally find it an unnecessary concept.
Plus, I don’t think I’d be able to work with people >.>
Glad it’s helping you, however ^^
@ PR, thanks lovely. You are spot on as always. Yet, I have a desire to respond, even though i know I am wasting my breath, I feel the need. I know it’s not wise and I am aware that she will never understand, so yes, I am now banging my head on a wall. But i want to try a logical discussion and see if she can be as logical and unemotional as she claims she can be (and yet just disproved).
@ lyss, first off, I was not trying to offend you, but obviously I hit a nerve. If you cared that I felt bad for doing that, I would feel bad for doing that, but as you don’t, I wont waste my emotions. So let me respond to your last comments logically, paragraph by paragraph.
You say we all have the same emotions just different levels, but you are wrong, and you know it, as by the very definition of a sociopath you lack empathy and compassion. They are massive emotions to miss. But as you don’t have them you don’t’ understand that nor the massive difference that this makes. Again, these emotions are what connects us all. You are human obviously, but you are different because you are not connected to us as we are too each other through empathy and compassion. But also because of this, you don’t understand the rules, but you will never understand that, no matter what I say. It is so much more than the ability to control emotions that differentiate us, and that my friend is what you can never understand. That you don’t feel nor understand empathy and compassion you don’t realise how big these emotions are and how they motivate everything we do and how they magnify all the other emotions. Yes, different levels of emotions are amongst us all. Yet let me reiterate: the definition of a sociopath is (amongst other traits) they do not have empathy and compassion. That is not a different level. That is none!
Your attempt to upset me with comments about my ex only serve to add to my arguments. Furthermore, how can you guarantee why my ex broke up with me? Do you know him? Do you know what type of sociopath he is? You have no idea. According to you he is probably not even a sociopath, so how would you know why he broke up with me? I see that comment as having no context to our discussion other than an attempt to rattle me. Either that or you are assuming that you know all sociopaths and how they behave. If the latter is the case, then It is ok for you to assume that you know everything about all sociopaths and me and my ex but it is not ok for me to do that about the sociopaths that I know or have heard of… hmmm that sounds hypercritical to me. Except I at least know a multiple of sociopaths and my ex and how he behaved which is more than what you do. Unless I completely missed the point of that comment which is possible as you were not clear.
Next para: My context of the term devil refers to your giraffe analogy. Your analogy of the giraffe in my opinion was flawed as we only have your word that good sociopaths exist. So I suggested that rather than a giraffe in the analogy, substitute the devil (or god if that makes you happier). Because we have no proof that the devil (or god) exists either. The same as nothing htat you have said is proving that good sociopaths exist. I’m not saying they don’t, but you are just saying I am good Believe me! Why should we? We have more proof that they are all bad. You say that sociopaths are good but there is multiple examples of extremely bad behaviour by sociopaths and yet, I haven’t seen any good ones (but as you said, they may be hidden in society therefore I wouldn’t).
Furthermore you say “this is how sociopaths think and behave” on one hand yet then on the other you say “not all sociopaths are the same” which is it? You then went on to say that you (as a sociopath) make your own rules. You try to stick to societies rules but as you do not understand the motivation behind our rules this ensures that eventually you will break our rules, even if it was accidental. You say you are smart enough not to break society’s rules yet you are “annoyed by these stupid rules”, how long till you slip and break one because it didn’t suit you because you make your own rules? You see what I mean? You are not making sense. Maybe you will abide by all the rules, maybe you wont. Anyway, At this point you are the only good sociopath that I have heard of. I am sure if there is one giraffe there must be more, but again, I only have your word that you are a giraffe.
Funnily enough, I actually believe that you are what you say you are and logically it makes sense that there are different sociopaths that have different motivations and different levels of good and bad, But your good is different to ours because you don’t and can’t relate (because of no empathy and compassion). But how do I really know you are a giraffe? By your own admission, you lie – already you are breaking the rules. By your own admission you cause problems in your relationship because you get bored or are triggered – but you are right, non sociopaths do that too but we are not talking about them.
But ok, I accept and believe that you are really trying to be good and on the whole you are. And if there is one, then there has to be others. I get that. But just because you are good, certainly doesn’t prove that all the others are too. You talk as if speaking for all sociopaths and know all sociopaths and it appears from your comments that anyone whose ex hasn’t reacted the way you would have, therefore he couldn’t be a sociopath just a dickhead. Now who is generalising? even though there is proof all over this site? I think that most of these people would have been able to deduce if their ex has empathy or not. Once the rose coloured glasses are lifted and the cognitive dissonance is removed, we know. Suddenly all those red flags that we ignored because we wanted to believe in the good in people scream to us the truth. That you think you are so much smarter than all of us is one of the sociopaths biggest weaknesses.
So on to the next paragraph, With the “you will never get it comment” haha, lets agree to disagree. I think if you could think like we did for one day, you would be blown away with how much we really understand of your disorder and how little you really get us. Remember we can put ourselves in your shoes (as we have empathy) but you can’t in ours! If you could you would have empathy and then you wouldn’t be a sociopath. But I call stalemate as its “he said she said”. But I know (sorry, couldn’t help myself)
Your next para, Again, your attempt to insult me by bringing up my ex and telling me my head is up my arse… Very logical and great debating intelligence there. Impressive. And assuming that I now think I am a psychologist…. Sorry but two things to say to that… firstly, who is the hypocrite? You who knows everything about all the sociopaths in the world and how many good ones have you met? Yourself and your father and by your own admission your father is a bad one. Secondly, you don’t know my experience, nor what or how I have learnt from the experience. I could go into it but you wouldn’t understand. You can’t. If you can, you are not a sociopath. Since learning about sociopathy I have actually spotted 4 others that I know. Without a doubt. Believe me or not. Don’t care. But according to you, they cant be smart then or are not socipaths at all. Even though 2 of them are in extremely high positions in billion dollar companies. But they must be dumb. Once you know what a sociopath is and you learn to trust yourself, you can spot them a mile off. But you wont believe me because it goes against your thoughts and what you need to believe so that you are right – or that is how it appears from your reaction to my comments.
Your last paragraph, again is not doing your argument that sociopaths are intelligent and in control of themselves and their emotions any good. You insult me because you disagree with what I have said. This is a discussion and I have not purposefully insulted you. If you perceive that i have then know that this was not my intention, yet you automatically assumed it was and attacked with personal insults. How do you know I can not spot one? I didn’t realise that you knew me that well? . This is good behaviour? I was merely putting forward my opinion, which may have been off the mark, but nothing that you have just said has disabused that notion. I am proud of how emotional I am and have no desire to hide my emotions at all. They are a strength. You seem to imply they are a weakness and that is another thing that you will never understand. Once we reach a level of spiritual awareness, our emotions actually make us stronger and more alive. I have actually enjoyed my debate with you. It has actually made me look logically at feelings and emotions and empathy and humanity in a new light. I have found it fascinating. Just because my comments somehow insulted you though you have got nasty with personal insults. Again – a bit hypercritical and none to logical or smart.
Lastly, let me just say, I agree with you that it is not fair that we tar all sociopaths with the same brush. I agree with you that there are different levels of sociopaths. But unlike a homosexual or another minority group, those sociopaths that are bad are really really really bad and destructive and abusive because of their disorder. And those that are really good, are not able to love us how we need/deserve to be loved and treated. But i personally try to judge each person and each sociopath on their own merits. As I said in one of my previous comments, I really do feel bad for all of you but particularly for those like you that try to live with in “rules” that they don’t’ understand. It is not fair that it is like this. I can even understand why it makes you angry, however, it doesn’t change that you don’t and can never understand. I realise after the last comments that this annoys you, but this is the truth as I see it. I agree with you that it is unfair. Life is unfair. . If I knew you and believed that you were trying to be good regardless of your disorder then of course I would treat you with respect and friendship. But I would need to know the rules. Your rules as well ( I already know mine) so that it was a fair playing ground. But you would only get one chance.
Again, if you have misread read my comments as an attack, this was not my intention. But just because I don’t completely agree with your comments does not mean that my head is up my arse. It just means that I have an opinion and that the type of sociopath that I have dealt with and those hundreds of empaths that I have talked with and listened to that have dealt with them realise that 1) you are not the norm and 2) that as they don’t follow the rules (which by the way are based on morality and understanding other’s feelings and compassion) that they make their own and that will always be based on self serving motives, which is dangerous and 3) that you have to tread very carefully, otherwise they very quickly put your head up your own arse.
Happy for you not to respond. as i realise that you will not agree with most i have said. And unless you have anything of value to add then please don’t. If you do, try not to revert to personal insults, it doesnt do any justice to your argument. Furthermore, this is a healing website, lets stick to that shall we? I just want everyone to remember that you are not the norm and all soc’s don’t behave and act like you do. It will not help with their healing if they believe that the guy who broke their ribs and keyed their car because they lost control of them is really a good person or not a sociopath.
@It Is Done
Oh look another thing you don’t understand. You hit no nerve, you didn’t get me to back up and want to fight. I have the exact same expression right now as I did writing my first comment. It’s me being blunt. Not angry. Make the distinction.
Empathy is not an emotion, empathy is connecting to other people’s emotions. It has nothing to do with the person itself, only those around them.
And again, I do not attempt to insult you at all. I’m just being extremely blunt. I get tired of putting pleasantries in every paragraph I write, and I figure over time people would understand it’s just me becoming more comfortable and not wanting to beat around the bush.
I’ll reword “get your head out of your ass” for you. “Um, sorry but, I find it slightly hypocritical to call sociopaths egocentric and yet you’re boasting about how you can spot any sociopath anywhere, and that it was your ex’s fault he broke up with you, because you’re apparently mysterious, and it couldn’t be because he maybe didn’t like you? I’m terribly sorry to be so blunt about it, I just thought it would be good to think about. Didn’t mean to insult anyone!!”
See how much easier it was to just say it bluntly.
About the giraffes, it has nothing to do with whether they exist or not, it was you claiming they are the minority. So that point of yours is invalid.
All sociopaths have some traits in common, that’s what makes it able to be labelled. The only thing sociopaths all have in common is the fact that they lack empathy, HOWEVER this lack of empathy causes a few things, some extremely prominent and some much less (for example, sociopaths WILL think a different way because of their lack of empathy. However, pathological lying, is a trait caused by lack of empathy only over half have).
“By your own admission you cause problems in your relationship because you get bored or are triggered – but you are right, non sociopaths do that too but we are not talking about them.”
Well why aren’t we talking about them? Why label someone as something and add these traits in yet other people do it too? It’s not a sociopath thing! It’s a HUMAN thing!
You say it appears from your comments blahblah.. and then ask who’s generalising now. You can’t do that. You can’t assume, then ask a question about the assumption before I even verify your assumption was correct. Sorry, no. You SHOULDN’T. Because you just wasted your breath asking me a question when your assumption was incorrect. Well done.
You can’t put yourself in our shoes, nor can we put ourselves in yours. You do not know what it is like being void of empathy and you cannot possibly fathom it. Nor can we fathom what having empathy must be like. Again. “Pretty please so sorry stop being so high and mighty like we’re not equal”.
Ohmygosh. Four? That’s so many! There’s only approximately 69,999,996 more left in the world for you to discover! Your powers are truly limitless!
(Now that was plain mockery.)
Next paragraph, I do not really need to go over seeming as you didn’t insult me, I didn’t purposely insult you, was just being extremely blunt, heck take it as constructive criticism 😀
Woo you agree with something.
Again, didn’t take it as an attack but ok
You do not have the place to judge what the norm is when you’re on a site specifically dedicated to the rotten ones. Of course no one is going to write an article here about how good their best friend sociopath was, it’s basically a sociopath hate site, masked as a healing site.
Then again, bitching does seem to ‘heal’ many people.
@It Is Done
And again, pretty please stop using cognitive dissonance when you don’t know what it means.
Bored now lyss.
You added nothing new. So typical.
Cheers
@It Is Done
Awh, yet you say sociopaths are the ones who get bored and can’t see things through.
The only reason I repeat is because you make the same mistakes over and over. OH LOOK another sociopathic trait, not learning from experience.
Maybe you’re the messed up one 😉
Whelp, bye.
@PR
I just thought of something…….If I was showering or using the toilet she would come into the bathroom. I felt like she was doing it to make me uncomfortable.
mine does that to me even when we firrst met! … they think ur on ur phone or smthing
Hi Under Construction aka Broken 😉
Yes, they like to over step the boundaries 😦
I had 10 years of ‘grooming’ so, it was gradual & subtle & not so subtle especially if I annoyed him!
Years ago, he tried to make me have sex with him at my office!
I literally had to fight him off & became quite distressed & told him to leave & I said to him, ‘I can’t believe you did that!’.
For years, he mimicked what I said back to me & I just shook my head in disbelief. He told me I was being silly & over reacted!
No, I was silly to have even bothered with him!
I hope your still on your road to recovery 🙂
Stay focused on you & remember to separate this world from your ‘real’ world & get back to the land of the living, not the living dead that these disordered minds are! 🙂
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
P.S. apologies Lyss if that sounds offensive but, I truly don’t believe you are fully ‘alive’, without feelings of conscience or empathy.
@Pheonix Rising
Again, no need for apologies in case of me taking offense – I won’t.
I am starting to see how ‘life’ and being ‘alive’ can be defined subjectively or objectively.
I love, I cry, I laugh, I have a personality and I must say you’re not the first person to say I’m any less alive or human.
In fact, monster has seemed more fitting for many people.
But if you’re so good at empathising, tell me this, how would you feel is someone said because you grew up differently, and therefore think of the world differently, you are less of a person? That you are not truly alive merely because you are not another clone in the world?
While I do not care whether you pity me, hate me, or what, it angers me that you’re selectively empathetic and you don’t realise it. There’s a neurodiversity movement in the world but sociopaths are categorically excluded. Homosexuality, femininity, autism, hell, a broken leg, that’s all ok to you lot, yet for some reason sociopathy isn’t. They’re a minority just like sociopaths.
Tell me, what if empaths were the ones who were left out of this movement, if they were told they were less human, would that make sense to you? No, because you’re part of that group. Because *you’re* the selfish ones, you’re the ones who can’t take blame, and there could never be anything ‘wrong’ with you, because you’re perfection, right?
What angers me possibly even more is that most people would get offended by my comment and take it as an attack. There are only a few people intelligent enough to realise there’s a goddamn good point in what I say, and I’m not trying to attack anyone, just get people to open their minds for once and listen to something other than the sound of their own bloody voice.
If you prove intelligent enough to comprehend what I’m saying and actually absorb it rather than refute it like everyone else, your reply will be valued and I thank you.
However, if you choose to block your ears with your fingers and scream LALALALA then go ahead, but don’t then turn around and scream MONSTER when I rightfully get angry.
the soc has left me again this time taking my money and some of my jewellery then had the upmost fun in mind games and lied he hadnt …. he was then ironing his clothes and said he was going clubbing … his code word for out on the pull …. let him ive had enough …. i so want to call the police on him for all the things hes done inc everything else but i have no proof ….. why do these ppl always come out smelling of roses its just not fair …. ive been violated in everyway possible
Hi It Is Done,
Trying to convince a Sociopath/Narc or whatever they are is like ‘screaming under water’, they cannot hear but, they drown in their own dribble eventually as the predictability & patterning as you mentioned gives them away. They love a debate but, soon change it up if it’s not to their liking & yes, the ‘sheep’ analogy appears.
We are not sheep but, live in a society that makes us queue & Soc’s also have to wait in line like ‘sheep’ 😉
As we know the signs now & are more aware, we will look beyond the facade & we will still love but, with healthy boundaries. 🙂
If a Soc remains controlled & contains their emotions & channels them constructively, that would be great but, they cannot as they get bored & need to ‘stir’ etc…& the games begin. Regardless of whether they are monogamous or not, life is in a constant state of flux!
I could not be bothered with the ‘roller coaster ride’ or the ‘Mad Mouse’,
I prefer the ‘Ferris wheel’, look at the view from all aspects & smell the roses type life 🙂
I hope your well 🙂
PR xoxox
HI PR,
You just put the biggest smile on my face 🙂 still laughing! You are spot on and i know you are, i was just interested to see what her response would be. I have a feeling that I have reached the point of banging my head on the wall, but still, as you know, I do find it interesting debating with these guy’s.
I am doing really well. I have reached a new level. I feel like the soc is so far in my past now. I recently had a falling out with my best friend. She treated me abominably and i have cut her off. This, along side my last embryo not taking, put me into a massive depression however, it was short lived as I put into practice all that I have learnt. I came out of it with realising that the drama of the ex Soc was truly behind me. I have finally (4 months on) started looking for a job and am looking after myself properly for the first time in years, and all this spiritual learning really is starting to be put into practice and i am starting to believe in myself like never before. I have started dating again but if nothing comes of it then i am great with that too. I am now looking at the next steps in getting that family i so badly want and that has included a complete overhaul of why my perfect little embryos are not taking. Turns out I probably have PCOS which no one picked up on (GRRRR). Anyway, life is good and if i coudl just get the right job, it would really be fantastic.
How are you going? What’s been happening with you?
Cheers
It is Done.
Oh and this week it was 10 months since we broke up… i feel like it was lifetime ago.
The problem with “making one’s own rules” is exactly why I can’t spend time with the sociopath. He changes th arbitrarily (can we just say makes $hit up?) to suit his whims, desires and mood. Completely disrespects my time w the last-min change ups, and this just isn’t The Soc Show!
Exactly Jusa,
Most of them are like children playing a game that they made the rules too and when they start to “loose” they change the rules to suit them. Or they have a tantrum and quit the game. If we are really unlucky, they will throw the board at us too and hit us in the eye.
@PR,
I want to jump in on the sheep thing! When my SOC tried to throw that dominance weirdness at me, I politely would compare our own lives.
I’m self-supporting financially. She’s a parasite and lives off her mothers purse strings. I served our country. She lives off the state.
I take care of my own problems and don’t wait to get conveniently bailed out by someone else. She does.
I have a severe learning disability but earned a masters degree. Her parents paid for 3 false starts in college which she did nothing with.
I try to look past my own needs in order to see what the needs are of those around me. I will do my best and not make excuses to meet those needs She is only concerned with her own needs and uses her kids as an excuse to shield her from taking responsibility for anything.
I take care of my aging parents. She mooches of her aging parent. Her family, including her kids think she is a loser. My family, including my kids, think I’m a hero.
I’m thinking to myself….”Sure babe…you’re a real hard charger:)”
@Broken
I was referring to more in the personality, not lifestyle. However it is interesting you brought that up.
A lot of sociopaths do have extreme poor future planning and can’t see anything through. But a lot also teach themselves to be better or at least more intelligent about their impatience. Self awareness, I do believe, is a big part of this; if you’re aware of what you’re doing it’s obviously going to be much easier to stop. Not easy, but not impossible.
For example, I, as I previously mentioned, have never taken money from anyone (aside from my father, but lets be honest now that’s justified), I’m in university/college/whatever people around the world call it, about to get my first degree, wish to get another, have have a strict plan to stick to afterwards (I have to or else I lose my mind panicking that I won’t have anything to do). I was, however, absolutely horrible in school assignments if they spanned over too long a time period, I’d start really well but I’d get bored so easily. I still did them, and the way I learned to counter this behaviour is to (yes you might laugh) do it the night before. The sense of ‘ok lyss, it reaaaally needs to be done now or else bitch teacher no.4 is going to crack it’ actually made me produce some of the best work, while it taking a short enough time for me to only get marginally bored with it, so the level stayed consistent.
Obviously, every person is different, and experiences lend a hand in this.
Another thing I strongly believe; sociopaths should not have kids. I don’t care what kind of sociopath you are, if you do not have empathy, you’re never going to feel for them as much as a parent should/would, unless you fake, and that’s either going to make you very very depressed or your child depressed. Especially from a woman’s point of view, as we’re supposed to be the caring nurturing ones. People are disgusted when they hear a mother who doesn’t *completely* care for her child. At least not the way they should.
There are some exceptions, obviously, as there has to be to accommodate extraneous factors. But on a basis, unless you’re an exception for some damn good reason, a sociopath having a child leads to disaster.
On another point, who wants to bring someone into this world? This world is unfair and going downhill, everything is messed up, bringing a person into this that doesn’t need to be is cruel, at least to me.
The family thing related a lot to the child thing, slightly different obviously as there is no preset giver-taker relationship as they are all adults. But the same concept. I’ve always struggled with family, I don’t see the point, and they’re quite honestly disgusting people in my family. I’m talking about triggers galore, and so I stay away. But some people use their family, obviously because the family sets off no triggers. But eh, each to their own.
@Lyss. I wish I could say that my Spath was just a dickhead. It would have been easier to move on I think 😦 What kind of man is in a relationship with me, takes my money, promises me the world and secretly marries someone else. For me, this came out of nowhere. Yes, my instincts were screaming at me but in my wildest dreams I would never have thought a man would be capable of such a betrayal. He Then tells me I am the crazy one and I should be over his betrayal. He has everything with this women that I was waiting for with him. He took my heart, ripped it apart and can’t even say sorry for what he did.
Btw, I find what you say very insightful and I like how you are blunt.
@ Jusa,
If it’s their idea, they are happy as they call the shots. Mine would ask me out & if I said, i will see etc…then say okay, he would then say, sorry Darl, i forgot & somethings come up at work etc…
If i asked him to accompany me i knew to ask months in advance & then have to remind him. He would wait until the day before to say yes or no, this was a ploy in case something better came along. They are opportunists so, it’s always in their control. They love to say ‘sorry’ darling but, sorry to them is like, ‘pass the salt’ 😱😜😁
Sorry is hollow, like comittment, like them. I used to ask & if he wouldn’t commit etc…i’d say, don’t worry then, i am happy to go in my own anyway & was. He would often change tack then & come! A lot if times, i didn’t even ask him as I couldn’t be bothered with the maybe baby so, got on with my life & went & had a great time 😃
It was nice to go & no cater to Mr, never leave my side!
Lul,
PR xoxo off to gym 😁😱
@ Lyss,
Please don’t start name calling & games etc… We are emotional, we are empaths, you are not.
Don’t make this a battle of intelligence etc…we don’t need to compete or strain our ‘new found PhD in disordered minds’.
We have nothing to prove to you, or defend but, we will defend each other & I don’t appreciate your tone!
Besides, it’s Arse, not Ass! An Ass is a donkey 😁
So don’t act like one as we are not vets!
Desiderata,
PR
@Pheonix Rising
Arse
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Look up arse in Wiktionary, the free dictionary.
Arse or ARSE may refer to:
British English Anglo-Saxon word for the buttocks, usually replaced by “ass” by US and some Canadian English speakers.
Kcool.
The trotting out (no pun intended) of the word “sheep” whenever a highly sociopathic person disagrees with one possessing more empathy is a tiresome tactic. It reflects an undeserved innate sense of superiority on the Sociopath’s part. However, what is so superior about seeing the rules society operates by and then choosing to not obey any of them? Most people can see society’s rules, sociopathic or not, and can choose whether to obey them or not. There is no specialness in that. It is not unique or noteworthy.
However, people lower on the sociopathic scale have the capacity for introspection and sometimes realize that maybe not all their self-produced rules are better than society’s. As mentioned before, our limbic brain and the empathy it empowers, is what allows society to even exist in the first place. Its existence benefits all of humanity, even those sociopaths that rue its existence and despise how it hems them in. It is difficult to imagine what our world would look like if everyone set his own rules and there was no reciprocal understanding of what certain actions or behaviors would likely produce from others. The TV show “The Walking Dead” comes to mind, but even there the survivors show a great deal of empathy, so I don’t know. It probably wouldn’t be a pretty place.
The fact that the “sheep” are now aware that the self-professed “superior wolves” exist and have developed tactics to ward them off or “defang them” seems to anger the wolves to a high degree. One of sheeps’ effective tactics is “herding” together on sites like these to share what works against the wolves and what does not. It is easy to see why the anger develops. After all the pool of prey is made smaller and their “jobs” harder.
I may even change my name to “Proud to be a Sheep” or “Baaah”
Or we could create the group called SHEEP. Society for Helping Empaths Escape Predators. 🙂
Wow. Great comment!
@ Agoodplan 🐑
From one sheep to another, Baa 😃
Sometimes I say Baa-stard! Lol
Great answer & thanks for you great posts.
On a side note,
A programe on TV last night re Physchpaths & assorted other nuts aired. A self professed physco/soc?
was an expert opinion etc…he seemed harmless until he said, the human race cannot survive without physcho’s that lack empathy etc…& war as an example, who better to battle the enemy (perceived enemy) than a person that lacks conscience & empathy!
He actually sounded convincing but, no one countered him with, wars probably would never start if it wasn’t about greed & power & domination so, me thinks I’d rather live in a Soc/Narc or Pathy free world. Baa Baa
PR xoxo
Thanks PR. Your comments have often provided a very welcome dose of spirituality or humor when I needed it. Keep it up!
I am a businessman and realize it would be a quicker and easier way to wealth to just rob my customers each time they came in. However, I think it would be hard to get any repeat business out of them. ;). Being able to think a few steps ahead and see the impacts that changing the “rules” to robbery from customer service would have on business and society provide enough of a reason not to do so. The law on the books isn’t what makes me not do it.
I think I have figured out what the world might look like if everyone made and obeyed his own rules. It would be the TV show The Walking Dead. Only there would be no survivors only Zombies walking around gnawing on each other’s necks. Not sure what that would do to ratings because it isn’t much of a plot line.
Lots of love AGPT. Or in sheep talk. Baa Ba Baah BBBB 🙂
See empathy even makes for good TV haha
@ AGPT 😃
I have the same business values & good customer service is ‘paramount’ to repeat business.
Keep up the great work in all aspects of your life & within yourself.
Integrity & good values, trust etc…all the things I once admired in my Soc but, silly old sheepish me, I was seeing myself reflected back & no wonder I was impressed! Lol, I should have just brought a Mirror!
‘Ah, what lovely eye’s you have my dear’ , yep, one of his favourite lines!
Biggest Red Flag, plus his collection of Royal Doulton Ladies, his oxy-moron behavior etc….
Still, you could have wrapped me in Red Flags & I would have stood in a bull ring saying, ‘I hate animal cruelty’, let the Bull Shit artist go free!
Lol
Love PR xoxo
You did it again. The ending to that post gave me the best laugh of the day! 🙂
A business friend of mine used to say ” You can give a man haircut a hundred times. You can only scalp him once!”
I was thinking about what this so called military expert said. It is not true. I have military training and experience and am an avid military history fan. Military effectiveness,in large,part stems from unit training,organization and cohesiveness. Cohesiveness comes from knowing and trusting what your squad mates and chain of command will do when the stuff hits the fan. You will probably be pretty unmotivated if you can’t trust the person beside you or behind you. These elements are what allowed the Roman Legions to defeat Germanic armies ten times their size and ten times as individually vicious. I do think that many sociopaths gravitate towards the military as it seemingly presents an acceptable outlet for their antisocial behaviors. They don’t make the best soldiers or leaders.
AGPT. One in an Army of SHEEP.
@AgoodPlan,
Ditto..I was in the military as well. I served on Submarines and then as a Navy Diver. The most these “tough guys” might do is “watch what you are dong” and then try to out do you after you are done and have earned a rest. They would wash out in any form of military training. I do, however, think that hyper-confident types (because they have to be) are prevalent in the special forces.
@GoodPlan,
PS. But even those in Specs have the ability to function individually as well as within a cohesive group. They are normal
@ Agoodplan 😃
I want to belong to that herd & eat grass, not ass! Lol
Sheep unite, Baa Baa & black sheep & rainbow sheep welcome.
I bet we spot the ‘wolves’ in our clothes, they’ll be the ones prowling their asses in the green green grasses! Lol
Love & light 😃🐑
PR baa xoxo
Hiya It Is Done 😃
You have the kindest heart so, don’t let Lyss, mind game you for her amusement. Probably just bored so, came here to play!
She said her partner has Bi -Polar so, that’s a match made in hell!
My ex was Bi-Polar & that’s like driving a manual car always out of gear!
Anyway, we are not here to concern ourselves with Soc’s etc….
I am doing well & reading all my self help books & applying everything I’ve learnt to myself & helping others.
I am actually meeting alot of people generally in turmoil or ‘crossroads’ & battling their own demons 😔
I am just listening & empathizing & giving them love & support.
I pay it forward as this while experience has made me grateful of others & the impact we have on each other.
I am mindful & appreciate having ‘got it’ as I’m sure many others here are.
My daughter suffers PCOD & I hope that her future fertility is not jeopardized? She is only 21 & I am not ready to be a Nanna just yet 😁
She has a lovely partner though & i may end up being the Nanna of a gorgeous Eurasian child? I love babies & children & I hope one way or another you have your much wanted & already loved child❤️️😃
Just keep your options open, have you ever worked in child care? Your great nurturing would be very valuable. I have a friend who does not have children but, works for World Vision as has thousands 😃
Love & Light 😃
PR xoxo SHEEP United! Lol
You are amazing PR, How wonderful that you are using what you have learnt to help all those people. It’s great to have your support on line but in person must be very comforting to those people. If i had someone like you on my journey in person, it would have helped so much.
I am also appreciative to have “got it” although, now I am going back out into the world and life, sometimes i have fear that the theory wont flow into practice, but every day in some small way i realise i am doing just this. That I have done this. I still struggle with loving myself but I am really getting there and the love is flowing from within to without, it really is beautiful.
With regards to PCOS and your daughter, it is treatable. They can’t remove it forever but they can treat it quite easily. If you stop the medication it comes back pretty quickly. It’s all about balancing hormones and insulin resistance. I know some people that swear by Traditional Chinese Medicine in treating it as well, but i dont’ have the luxury of time, so i have gone western medicine as well as some diet adjustments. So you will be a grandmother when the time is ready! My friend has a Eurasian baby. OMG he is the cutest little boy EVER! I have a long way to go before i come close to it not happening. But it will happen. I am sure of this now.
In regards to the SHEEP. I’m on board Baaa Ba 🙂
Where do I get the T-Shirt?
Peace and light and lots of love your way.
xxxxxx
Hiya bella 😃 IID
I think we could get a heap of T-shirts from NZ lol 😁
I will bear that Chinese Medicine route in mind. One day I was shopping recently & a fair skinned blonde lady was holding her Eurasian grandchild & I thought I was seeing my future before my eyes! The woman looked like me & the baby was gorgeous, I melted 😃
As long as it’s healthy, I will be happy 😃
You must look for your Angels, ask for their help. Just ask& always say thank-you.
Ask for help finding a job, ask it daily as an affirmation, trust the universe, I ask everyday & everyday I ‘see’ more gifts.
Fear is such a bugger but, that is Ego & self doubt so, work hard at shutting that down. Before bed, think positive, read affirmations, love your whole self, your body, your arms for wrapping around you, your legs for carrying you daily etc.. Louise Hay, ‘You Can Heal Your Life’, Stephanie Dowrick, Choosing Happiness, really good books/ bibles.
You are not alone & I walk with you daily, you are my ‘other realm’ online friend. 😃👼🙏
I am a SHEEP, baa & you are in my flock & I am in yours 🐑😃
Love Always,
PR xoxo
Wow, can we stop with the personal attacks. My daughter has bipolar that is really offensive 😦
@Phoenix, don’t stop to give “food” to the “beast”…remember they don’t define us, and no contact is the best weapon also with the viruses on the blog. ! The best of mondays for you!
@Broken,
It’s just time that is needed & your at the stage of grieving & beating yourself up for being taken for a ride.
Well your in great company here, I often catch myself thinking WTF or What were you thinking & then I remember, I wasn’t!
My brain was being subjected to immence ‘love bombing’ & smoke & mirrors so, as I just tried to survive a marriage trauma, I was being preyed upon & my vulnerability was very raw!
So, they chose you, your a target, not a victim. They decide the game rules & if you don’t play then, ‘game on’ & the stakes get higher. You are the stakes, you are the object they desire to conquer & keep or discard at will.
It’s never been about us but, always them.
The game is over so, stay NC.
You are a person, not a game piece & life is not a game.
It gets easier but, this is the path you must follow until your head & heart come together & your spirit is restored.
Love PR xoxo
@IID, AGPT,NMI 😃
‘Meet the Flockers’….LOL, maybe I should be a ‘stand up’ comedian?
Bet I know who the hecklers will be!
‘I see a little silhoetta of a man, Socamouche can you do the fandango?
Oops, Revenge is on, more Soc’s!
The Other Woman movie is out next week, guess who’s going 😁
I am Cameron Diaz you know, i am talk & blonde & funny 😁😘
PR x
@ Lyss,
Oh, i know that & thought you’d have a witty comeback but, I am Australian & we call bums Arse’s & Asses are donkeys. Besides, you missed the point, no insults thanks & we will give you the same courtesy.
Cooler 😁
@Pheonix Rising
And copying and pasting Wikipedia isn’t smartass-ish enough for you? >.>
Also if you read my second last comment you’d see I wasn’t insulting anyone, more being blunt.
Thanks for the entertainment today. I was having one of those “poor me” days but reading all of your insights and arguing kept me a bit entertained 😉 😛
@Lyss,
Your not blunt, your sharp! Who cares & stop analizing & changing tack etc…time to take your Ass or Arse & play elsewhere unless you have something nice to say or mature.
Your no a Rhode Scholar so, cut the crap jargon it’s a dead give away. As for Cognitive Dissonance, how about trying to fathom real from bullshit, that keeps it simplfied for us Sheep!
We have troble reconciling the BS that’s all, as there is so much verbal diarrhea with a Soc!
You were so spot on as always PR. ITs like arguing with a child underwater. The rules change according to them and as you said, so does the debate when things aren’t going their way.
I love shrek. Making waffles indeed 🙂
I have had so many laughs tonight. Thank you 🙂
@Pheonix Rising
There’s no difference between blunt and sharp, only what side you’re looking at the blade from. It’s the same blade none the less.
By being closed minded you’re showing how immature you can be. Or is that mature, I can never tell with people nowadays.
On a completely unrelated note, you know what would be funny, if we were all placed in a room to chat for an hour and then play a game of spot the sociopath and see everyone get it wrong ;3
😁 happy to hear you laugh 😃
Lyss & ‘Donkey’ are probably about to trot out a responce 😃
Like in Shrek, ‘I’m makin waffles’ 😃🐑
@ IID,
Your welcome bella, just stay focused on You & your recovery, it’s really all that matters.
A friend of mine said I was Princess Fiona (before the change) & my Soc looked like Shrek! Wish he’d gad the good heart instead of Lord Farkquar!
I should have sung really high & made him explode! Lol
‘ not the dew drop buttons’.
Pr x
hahaha. Mine was probably rumpelstiltskin, so full of himself and egotisitical and thought he was smarter than everyone else. He wasn’t.
I’m signing off now, so night night my dear.
Peace and happiness to you too.
IID
xxxx
Mmwah IID sweet dreams only! X
@lyss,
You got mean towards It Is Done & that was not acceptable.
I think that it’s ‘game over’ or ‘copy & paste’ but, as I said, ‘if you have nothing nice to say, don’t’.
If you can refrain from your so called ‘bluntness’ re your responces then I am happy to ‘talk’ but, start games & forget it.
Thanking you in anticipation that you will behave.
PR
@Pheonix Rising
She perceived it as mean, clearly you did too. I did not intend it that way.
“Behave” cute I love being shoved in a box it’s so much fun ^^
@It Is Done
If what I said was taken as an insult, I apologise, however when it came out of my mouth it was not intended as such.
I clearly don’t belong here, among hundreds of women who hate some kind of person for something they didn’t do. Guess it sucks to be me huh ;3 unless someone actually wants to ask me something or approach me for a valuable reason, I do not wish to reply, it’s extremely tiring hearing the same excuses over and over.
@ Lyss, You didn’t insult me at all. I expect that kind of thought and argument from a sociopath. All you did was prove my point from your reactions. You don’t realise it but you are predictable, PR said how you would respond before you did and you did.
Yes Poor hard done by you. As PR said, it can be tiring arguing with a sociopath. for two reasons: 1) The game always changes to suit them but then that is all our fault according to them and 2) you will never understand.
And for that i feel sorry for you.
@It Is Done
I had no reactions, again, my emotions did not alter in any of the points of the argument.
Naw thanks, you’re pretty predictable yourself ;3
I changed my argument at no point, and each time you tried to say I did I proved why it is that I was being consistent.
Again, predictable, being so closed minded aww look at you ❤
@ Lyss,
I would never voluntarily jump into a shark tank so, partying with Soc’s & playing charades is not going to happen.
If you came without the mask then at least we’d be aware of your agenda etc…you see Lyss, Soc’s come in disguise whereas , we come as we are!
If you feel so superior etc…& want equal acceptance like homosexuals so rightly deserve then come as you are & we would be able to ‘see’ you & decide for ourselves whether we want to befriend you. Play fair, that’s all we ask.
PR
@Pheonix Rising
You say this and yet this is basically a hate site against sociopaths.
You say sociopath to almost anyone and they think things along the lines of manipulative, liar, inhuman, monster, scary.
It’s a given we come with a mask, if we didn’t no one would ever approach us.
We’re taught to have a mask on at such a young age. My mother, before she realised she just shouldn’t take me at all, used to take me to the funerals she went to and when I was happy or neutral, she’d tell me “Lyss, at least try to look sad” or “Put your head down a bit so you look more upset”.
We’re sociopaths in an empath’s world. We don’t belong. Of course we put on masks. We don’t have a choice. We’d be cast out if we didn’t. Oh wait, so many of us already have been.
I don’t think inhuman monster or scary
But I do think manipulative, controlling, tells lies.
But – what interests me, is why the need for the mask? There are plenty of assholes out there in the world anyway. Of all descriptions, so why do you feel the need to fake the perfect persona? Is this about childhood and not feeling good enough?
This isn’t fair. (I am working backwards through these comments) …. the last comment I read from lyss I thought that she was being open and honest about who she was.
She wasn’t faking to be a victim. That would be coming here with a mask, she out and out said that she is a sociopath.
@positivagirl
Glad you can see I’m not lying or masking here.
It kinda sucks being honest with people for once and it backfiring massively. Then they wonder why >.>
I guess so, my father was a corporate man, and I mean CEO level. I used to be taken to corporate dinners all the time and was taught to be the perfect angel or else I’d cop it later.
I remember one time I had to go to someone’s house that was a boss of my father’s and I couldn’t eat or drink for 8 hours because I wasn’t allowed to ask for a drink unless they offered; they never offered ;3
At the age of 6 my father told me I was too old for the playground, that I should grow up already. Kind of funny when you think about it. Never allowed to be a child, may as well be one now on the internet where I’m anonymous >.>
I get you lyss.
Do you feel the need for ‘perfection’ or to be ‘perfect’ or at least give that persona to the outside world?
Do you think a lot of it comes down to inner insecurity?
@positivagirl
I guess so, but at the same time I’m extremely bad at going at things til the end, so I tend to strive for perfection, give up half way, then get angry at myself or something like that >.> I guess I’m my own worst enemy 😀
Well, I’d definitely say insecure. I can’t be in a room with more than about 6 people without shaking from social anxiety. I guess that’s because I know I don’t fit there and so I’d rather be alone.
Yes, this is what I have observed too Lyss.
I understand a lot about Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, as I have had that following the death of my daughter. This is in the mind too, and triggered by what happened during that time.
What i observed, with the socio in my life, was a trigger that was similar to PTSD triggering, but it was about past events, likely events in childhood. Every time the reaction was the same. It was identical to a PTSD trigger.
I know it is triggering as it is repeated. I think that this is what causes the repeated patterns of behaviour with many sociopaths, the triggers related to childhood trauma.
The need to control, because at one time in their life (often in childhood) they were out of control, had no control, no say. So they ensure that they will never be in that situation or so vulnerable ever again.
I worked with homeless people for decades. I learned, that almost always with people. There is a reason ‘why’. I think I have always managed to see ‘good’ in pretty much everyone I have met. Even those who have hurt me.
What is empathy? Isn’t it learned behaviour? If someone grows in an environment with no love, with disdain. This is what they learn. So that when they see other people being loving and caring it seems like an outside world. That can sometimes cause resentment.
You say that you work well with your partner, its not perfect but it works in its own way. This is good.
I don’t believe that all ‘non sociopaths’ are good. Neither do I believe that all sociopaths are wholly bad. I do believe that there is a reason why everyone is the way that they are.
With the last socio in my life – I wouldn’t say that he has changed, but he has I guess. He learned to manage his behaviour. The psycho cycle does happen periodically, but not too often these days.
I don’t know if I see people without judgement (even those who have hurt me) as I worked all my life with homeless people. Or – because I am not perfect. I don’t think anybody is. Everybody has their issues.
I think that there really isn’t anywhere to go, for people who are sociopaths who try to manage their behaviour.
There is a lot of misunderstanding and judgement. I think what is important sometimes, is not what is in the mind – but what is in the heart.
@positivagirl
I was once diagnosed with PTSD by an idiot psychologist. I had to laugh. She said this because I told her about my past. Apparently having a shitty childhood makes you have PTSD without a doubt >.> but I do understand what you mean by they’re similar when it comes to triggers. I just think they react differently to those triggers. One may cry, one may rage.
Was also diagnosed with OCD once because the need to control became so bad it was as specific as having to have every piece of paper on a desk arranged a very specific way.
What I don’t understand is how some other people can say ‘without empathy, you’re less human/alive/whatever’. You’re not born with empathy, as you said yourself. So, no one is born fully alive/human according to their logic.
I recently wrote a short story, for amusement, attempting to see if I could conjure up empathy in my writing. If it’s not too much to ask, would you like to read it? I want to see if I succeeded in mimicking empathy, so sort of an experiment.
Yes go ahead you can send it to my email if you don’t want to send it here datingasociopagh@Hotmail.co.uk
Unfortunately I’m unable to access email where I am right now, so here will have to do.
Written from the point of view of a dog, seeming as I suck at human relationships and the such.
He lazily yawned, his eyes drooping and shoulders slouching further into the leather brown armchair, with the same numb expression he wears every day. It had been a while since Master had come home. More than a while.
The rattling of a key in the front door broke the old hound from his trance-like state. Could it be? Jumping off the battered armchair, he mustered all of his energy to run to the source of the sound. The door slowly widened, the cold, harsh winter air rushing through with a purpose. Time seemed to slow down, almost stop, in suspense. A human foot entered, encased in freshly-polished black leather shoes.
No. Of course not.
Two more pairs of feet arrived, slamming the door behind them in an attempt to warm the house up again. He tilted his head up, getting a full view of these strangers. The first had a slightly-too-tight business suit on, under which he was sweating quite intensely from nervousness. The smell of his perspiration, cologne, and the abundance of hair wax smothered onto his short deep black hair poured into the canine’s sensitive nose. The second human was a female with shoulder-length, grey-yellow hair, holding a small, sleeping child in a harness-like contraption connected to her front. She smelled of baby powder, and a hint of burning coming from her hair. The third was a male, hovering protectively over the second in some strange human way of showing affection.
The one in the monkey suit began, “This house… built in nineteen… owner past away last month… leukemia… asking price… one hundred and…” Old age had not bid the poor hound’s hearing well.
The third human – the strange male – caught a glimpse of the old dog, and began to stare in hostility. The dog, now growling in a deep, hoarse voice, wasn’t pleased with this intrusion of his Master’s home.
“Oh, God… so sorry… dog… keeps coming back… hole under the gate…” The nervous man’s voice rose and he approached the dog with a livid expression, “GET OUT… DUMB MUTT… DON’T BELONG…”
The old dog barked twice in his rough voice before sprinting out the door that the man had opened – a big mistake. The door slammed behind him, with the force of a tornado. The pooch found himself in the freezing cold, 5 inches of snow under his oversized paws, with a short, patchy coat to add insult to injury. Getting warm wasn’t on the top of his priority list, however. Finding his Master was. And that was exactly what he was going to do, whether it killed him or not. Lifting one paw after another, out of the snow, then back in, leaving distinct prints with every step, the hound began on his way.
The street was deserted, too full with the bite of winter for anyone to dare to walk out. Trees had frost-covered branches, sharp ice where autumn leaves were only months ago. It was ironic, really, how about the same time the colourful leaves fell off the trees, the dog’s Master had disappeared.
The old pup climbed through a barbed-wire fence, grazing his entire side with a painful wound, the cold wind lashing out against it every second. No sound came out of the dog’s mouth. He had eyes of determination – or desperation. The cold had made the poor pup’s once wet nose hard, biting at his face with frozen anguish.
Long he walked, and it became harder and harder as the bitter and angry blizzard raged on. It was more than difficult to see, the hound’s vision filled with fast-moving white flurry. The harsh wind was trying its best to bowl over the beast. This was not a task for such an old mutt. He was unsure of how much longer his aching legs could hold his own weight up. It had seemed like forever that he had been walking through the icy untamed forest, until in the short distance, he spotted a clearing. It was more than hard for the senior to keep his eyes open; he was tired, bleeding, and the cold had left him tender and vulnerable.
The clearing came after an eternity, and it seemed as if hope had come with it. The dog came to large black gates, vines crawling and wrapping themselves around the thick metal bars. He began to walk. In this small open area past the gates, the trees surrounded from all directions, protecting the space from the blizzard. It definitely was not warm, but the dog’s nose began to defrost a small amount; enough to allow him to take in the smells of this sacred area. It had the scents of many people, yet no one was to be seen. Perfume, flowers – of all different sorts – overpowering smells rushed into the dog’s nose. He paced through the yard, walking past strange concrete slabs he did not recognise. Inscriptions in the shapely stones were not comprehensible for a dog. His ears perked up into the air as he smelled a familiar smell that, if he were human, would have brought tears to his eyes. The aroma of his Master’s favourite English tea and shortbread biscuits, his cheap shampoo and the seat of his favourite rocking chair.
He followed his nose along the patches of grass and snow, to the source of the scent. A great slab of concrete rose from that very spot. He spun around a few times, before lying down, curling around the gravestone, his wound still red and his legs still aching, but he didn’t care. Time seemed to slow down just for the two, and the sly old hound gave a sort of smile, before his tiredness got the best of him, slipping into a long sleep next to his partner.
@positivagirl
Sorry, forgot to tag you in the comment with the story. If you ctrl+f this sentence, “Unfortunately I’m unable to access email where I am right now, so here will have to do.” you should find it. Terribly sorry.
Thanks for seeing my point of view, though. Not many people do. Maybe that’s my fault. I am, however, not going to reply to them anymore. Not in a mean way, but it does tire you out trying to say something when no one listens. Tiring, and quite saddening. Maybe that’s just because I’m really not in the mood to waste my breath, I don’t know. Thanks anyway.
I think your writing is really good. Do you mind if I ask you a few questions?
1. How old are you?
2. You said you learned you were a sociopath a year ago. Was this a self diagnosis or a formal assessment?
3. You talk of abuse as a child and also that you feel not much. Do you know that people with ptsd can also struggle with empathy ? Can feel emotionally disconnected? They can often feel nothing and what you describe as an outsider looking in is also common in ptsd. It can feel like you are viewing the world from behind a glass wall, you on one side everyone else on another.
4. The thing that makes me ask these questions is because you say that you suffer with social anxiety, sociopaths generally don’t. (How could they feel social anxiety? This is something they don’t really experience).
The type of abuse you describe in childhood particularly If it went on for a long time, your symptoms could also be trauma based rather than sociopathy. Have you been formerly diagnosed as a sociopath?
@positivagirl
Thanks, although I was more looking for creating a sense of empathy towards the dog. Did I succeed/to what extent?
Sure, ask away.
I’m 18 currently
At the time, it was a self-diagnosis, however I was forced to see a professional and he did do sort of a quick, not specifically a diagnosis but more a ‘yes, I’d say you are most probably a sociopath’.
I definitely do not have PTSD, however. Yes, bad things happen but I’ve gotten over it. I have had no empathy since I was extremely young. Not sure if you would want to know this, or if you’d think of me any less because of it, but I would torture my various pets as a child, and only ever felt bad the one time I got caught. I continued, though. I think that proves a fair bit there, sadly enough. A few other things I would do when I was a child, before I even realised what was happening or defined it as even slightly ‘traumatic’. I’d hardly define it as traumatic now, because aside from the permanent physical injuries I have sustained, everything feels normal.
A thought for you, a year ago (just after I came to my realisation) my mother came to me, telling me about how someone did a study somewhere (too long ago to recall) and found out that the vast majority of sociopaths tested had a head injury at some point in their lives. Interesting, isn’t it. Correlation does not imply causation, however speculation is fascinating.
I’m extremely confident and relaxed around 1 or 2 people, scarily so. For some reason, numbers frighten me. I’ve had a few experiences there that you probably don’t care to listen to.
I think you should go careful of labels. Someone cannot be diagnosed a socio/psychopath until age 18. That is for good reason. I have known plenty of really screwed up teens who turned into good people. Children rarely have empathy (sociopathy is very like being a child). Empathy kicks In In later teenage years and sometimes that can be delayed for a child who has been abused. I am not saying you will, but you might find that side of yourself kicks in later years.
You seem to have insight. Many of the words you use to describe yourself appear to be words that you are told you are (sometimes when people are told it enough they become it).
Remember you were talking about good and bad sociopaths? Maybe you aren’t one. You just have issues to work through from a damaged childhood.
At 18 I wouldn’t say I was hugely empathetic. Yet I was to go on to spend my working life working with homeless people. I could always see the person behind the behaviour.
Hurting animals in childhood is a indicator of psychopathy. That isn’t normal to do. How do you feel about doing that now? Aside from this, everything else you describe sounds typical for someone of your age who has had an abusive childhood. You don’t feel empathy as your brain went has always been on the defensive to protect yourself. Your social anxiety furthers my thinking this might be the case, but again, hurting animals isn’t normal. Try not to put a label on yourself so early in life. You never know in 10 years you could be a totally different person. I have seen the most screwed up teens repair damage from their parents, and turn out to live successful life’s. Often all they ever needed was unconditional love and someone to believe in them. Strive to be who you want to be, in spite of your childhood. let your experiences make you, not break you. Don’t worry about lack of empathy right now, that’s normal for someone your age with your background. It’s not your past that is important, but who you choose to be today.
What brought you to this site? How do you feel when you read about sociopathic behaviour does it sound like you? Remember socios are like children. That might be normal to still be that way at 18 with an abnormal background. Not normal at 38 when your still behaving this way.
You say you have been in same relationship and faithful for 3 years that is since you were 15. Don’t become what someone tells you you are. Your only 18 and I don’t mean that in a condescending way. You might find in 10/15 years you are a different person as you find yourself.
@positivagirl
I’m not an extreme fan of labels, however I use the term sociopath because it’s much easier than saying ‘a person without empathy’. It’s why I always laughed when psychologists tried to diagnose me; what’s the point, it can’t be fixed anyway.
Which words are you referring to in particular may I ask?
I must say that next comment made me chuckle slightly, sorry. I dealt with my issues long ago, and I got these issues after I was how I am now. Talking didn’t help, learning to suck it up did though.
How do I feel about hurting animals now? I don’t particularly care. I still have many urges to, and I still have pets, and it takes everything I have to not endanger them at many points in time.
There are two separate reasons I have urges to hurt animals, I think.
The first being when I’m angry, or want to be left alone, and they look at you and expect something from you and man it angers me so much and it’s so easy to hit them or something (sorry, was in one of these moods a few minutes ago, feeling is still fresh) to get them out of your way.
The second is more child-like, and tends to be more common, at least for me. And that’s curiosity. Every child is curious, but I was extreme in this. I wouldn’t be mad, sad, or happy, I’d be completely neutral in emotions, and if they were in the vicinity I would get curious and I’d see how hard I could hug them before a sound comes out, how long they could be choked for, how hard I have to sit on them or twist their tails. It was like a child playing with a toy. Those urges happen still quite often now as I still have many pets.
Although my boyfriend has learned when to get them away from me, and if he doesn’t realise I tell him in a stern voice ‘Get. Them. Away. Now.’ and he understands immediately.
If I lived alone and there were no consequences for hurting them, in all honesty I probably would. I’ve had to teach myself to take it out on something else, unfortunately this has turned into me hurting myself (not cutting or anything, more punching something hard purposely to hurt my hand or bashing my head or some crap). Still working on that though.
I’d say unconditional love/someone to believe in me isn’t the case, as I have that and I’m no different aside from me having the motivation to learn a tiny bit more self-control >.>
What brought me to this site? It’s kind of funny actually. Along with purposely messing with my relationship, as I get bored with having a neutral emotion all the time I tend to look for a bit of trouble. Subconsciously, of course, and I realise after it was a stupid idea and change my approach. And it’s not really trouble, just a trigger. My main trigger is just ‘people without logic’ and that sort of encompasses many things. Raging doesn’t make me feel good as such but it’s not boring. It breaks the fast, if you will.
I’ve been taking measures to stop this lately, although sometimes it’s impossible, without being completely and utterly asocial and isolated, which, in all honesty, is what I’ve been thinking of doing as of late. I’m always going to find triggers somewhere, Someone is going to tell me something that makes no sense, and I’m going to attempt to explain why it makes no sense or how they’re contradicting themselves, they’ll get all NO NO YOU’RE WRONG I DON’T WANNA LISTEN and I’ll get angry. If people don’t make sense, and I explain it to them and they go ‘oh wait you have a point’ it’s fine, I don’t get angry, but when people clearly use the same incorrect logic and refuse to keep their minds open about anything, that’s when I get angry.
That’s the reason I commented. The reason I found this site is because I was looking up ‘ways to cope as a sociopath’ to find ways people handle their impulses, but instead I found ‘ways to cope WITH a sociopath’. It irritated me no one wrote anything about how to deal as one >.>
Your right your urge to hurt animals is not normal teen behaviour. Have you tried sociopath world forum? http://www.sociopathworld.com/p/forum.html?m=1 (if the link doesn’t come up type in sociopath world into Google. They might rip you apart at first. But as a socio this might not concern you. When I have read there there is a lot of in house competition of who should be top dog. Also there are quite good posts written by M e Thomas. I have seen a lot of socios write about how they manage to live to a code of conduct (most of the time) so they don’t get into as much trouble. It might be a good site If you are looking for input from a socio perspective?
You might get more balanced views by reading comments to posts. That seems to be a mixture of comments from socios and non socios. I have had emails from socios who say they live to a code of conduct. It works for them. The forum you might find has degenerated into who is bigger and badder than the other 🙂 like a clash of egos. Do a search on the site you might come across some articles of use.
@positivagirl
I have been reading a few of M.E Thomas’ articles lately, although many of her articles are very, well. Shrouded. It’s clear she’s attempting to make it a much more intriguing read for non-sociopaths to learn about sociopaths.
I need more instructions or a variety of coping mechanisms. She obviously does not write like this, as she herself has said the purpose of her blogs is to inform the world about sociopaths, not sociopaths about themselves.
I have no interest in a sociopathic community, at least not one that is full of big-headed idiots. Again, I’d probably just get angry from their unnecessary attempts at establishing dominance online. It’s pointless and ridiculous. All the people who comment there are aggressive or narcissistic sociopaths – the exact kind I do not get along with.
However, if you ever happen to find a community of sociopaths that are actually willing to say worthy content instead of boosting their egos (doubt that would happen, and if it did the party would get crashed pretty quickly) let me know, it’d be handy ;3
Unfortunately that is the problem, you can never find asocial sociopaths like me because they’re, well, asocial.
So basically I’m screwed >.> ahwell, there’s always complete isolation. 😉
Thanks for this conversation though, and sorry for getting people angry and causing trouble >.>
Ditto Lyss, you put yourself in the box i believe so, sorry you couldn’t behave!
You came here voluntarily, we didn’t seek you or your advice originally.
It is tiring, my Soc was always tired especially when he was behaving badly!
That’s the scary bit about sociopaths. You can put them in a room with other people and nobody would be able to pick them out. Wolf in sheep’s clothing. Sorry, couldn’t help myself then 😉
Lyss, I understand a lot in what you are saying. One of your earlier posts struck a cord with me. You said that you haven’t taken any money from your partner. I take my hat off to you for that. A lot of sociopaths see the opportunity and take it. That is one thing that ruined me with my sociopath. Not only did he take my money but, if it wasn’t for my mums financial help, I wouldn’t have been able to get a home loan and I wouldn’t have had something to help me move forward. Lesson learnt and I will never lend money to a person again.
@Ex def an S
Thanks, you’re the first one to see anything in any of my words aside from ‘LALA I’M A SOCIOPATH LALA’ which is what apparently some of these other people are hearing >.>
(That’s a joke in case anyone gets offended. A mocking joke, but nonetheless a joke)
It all comes down to the good or the bad in a person. A bad empath might think about taking the money and not because he/she feels guilty, or might do it but feel bad afterwards. A bad sociopath will take it without feeling guilty.
A good empath won’t even think about it
And a good sociopath will neither.
Thanks for seeing some logic in my arguments.
Absolutely its about the ‘good’ and ‘bad’ in the person. For sure. People who think it isn’t are deluded. Sorry but I met a lot of heartless people after my daughter died. I had more help from the socio than anyone. this is true. there are good and bad in all.
I was reading about PTSD yesterday. The article that I read, was saying about labels and how they are really not useful. How labels are given for mental health, but not physical health. How stupid that is. It said, if someone breaks a bone, it wont say you ARE a broken bone…. Yet people say that someone is just a ‘sociopath’ yep they can turn worlds upside down, yep there is drama, but it does depend on the person, how they deal with that, just as it depends on the socio how they manage who they are.
@XDef,
I can pick them out in men. I had to do it to survive at one point. What has messed me up is that I hooked up with a female SOC. I’m telling you, it messes with your mind really bad when the traditionally more nurturing gender of our species is like that (if you’re a guy). this is not a sexist statement. I just never attributed these traits to female. Shit talk about cognitive dissonance!
I’ve come across female “players.” But never predators. She is a twisted animal that wants nothing other than to sadistically dominate.
@Phoenix, he/she/it already says goodbye, so let it part, no more “food” to it
@ Broken,
Yep, now you see & look up Sociopath mind control, fascinating.
The more you learn the more clarity you gain & slowly the ‘fog’ lifts & you see them in all their Glory or Gory as I prefer. 😃
The questions finally provide the answers that the Soc will never give or admit. You know her better than she does now so, be proud as you are on your way through & out into the ‘light’
Keep Going & remember, your Free of it! Free of her & free of BS.
PR x
@PR
days….weeks of silence then coming back as if nothing happened. then gaslighting..saying I’m too sensitive…or I had an anger problem…..then “forgiving me.” Yup she was a real bitch
@Lyss…yep, that actually makes a lot of sense about money.
@AGPT,
Yep, my Soc loves ‘power’ & is a Commander in the Fire Brigade. Very level headed in a crises etc…. but, his nickname is ‘the scab’ as he sits in management & is a union rep so, plays one end against the other, villain interchange to hero etc… He creates a lot of problems within his own ‘brotherhood’. I have proof but, cannot use it as it could endanger me?
I found him fascinating in the end when i figured it out. I have an excellent post on covert narc’s that i will send you but, it’s on my work computer.
I think you’d be impressed with my Soc, really is the full blown delusional yet charismatic Soc/narc & he’s Italian so has that whole mafia thing happening. Yep, I got the horses arse in bed! Lol
“Being too sensitive”. That reminded me of something. Once my spaths friend, who is married with kids, kept hitting on me via messenger. When my Spath was “in love with me”, he would tell me to tell him to leave me alone and to delete him. When I was no longer his source, and his friend was trying to hit on me again, I complained to my Spath who responded with “why are you so sensitive?” Errrr cause your friend is married with kids…..now I know why he said that though….because he was about to become married with kids and yet still wanted me on the side.
Lyss, this is not a ‘I hate Soc site’ it’s a ‘ hate Soc’s who hurt me site’ please be clear & tread carefully.
We ‘hate our experience’ but, truthfully we once loved the person we thought they were. I don’t hate my Soc, i feel sorry for him that he conducts his life as he does. We support each other & it would be the same support i would give anyone that needs support regardless if a Soc caused it or not. The patterning & predictability is astounding , so we are amazed at the similarity of our experience. We share our journey & no we don’t understand why our Soc’s treat us like they do but, we do ‘get it’ & help each other to move on & heal.
A mother does tell a child how to behave everywhere & yes, smiling at funerals is not acceptable but, children do this. My son put a toy car onto a casket & drove it into the flower parking lot ! We all laughed as his Grandfather would have appreciated it 😃
@Pheonix Rising
You say sociopaths are predictable and they have patterning yet you say you do not understand why.
Then, I must ask, how do you assume when and what when you do not know why?
Is it some sort of cycle your experiences always have in common? Like some diagram can be drawn to say ‘they will pretend to love you then act out and do this this and that’?
It just makes no sense as to how others have said ‘oh we understand you more than you think’ (clearly bigheaded) and then do not understand why.
@Lyss,
There is infact a pattern. And that pattern is outlined like a road map in a book written under the pseudonym “Peace.” It’s called “Psychopath Free.”
@PR,
I hope I have your strength someday Phoenix. I really do
No. This is NOT a I hate socios who hurt me site. My god, I so hope this site hasn’t turned into that. As this was never my intention. The intention of the site was to write the truth. I didn’t hate the last socio in my life when I began writing. I don’t now. Which is why this site is called ‘dating a sociopath’ this site is about ‘dating a sociopath’
Hi Pos,
No, it’s not a I hate Soc’s site & my comment back said, I hate the experience one caused etc…I actually mentioned love as that was my intention. Lyss got picky with It Is Done & I did not like her perceived inference etc…
I was not attacking people with Bi Polar either as I have lived with this in my life & recognize how hard it is.
I think Lyss & I have established what’s fair & that’s the end of it.
NIM recognized it as well as others so, being deemed Sheep etc…became a ‘proud’ thing for us 🙂 we turned it around, thanks to AGPT.
It’s all okay so, don’t worry as it lit up the site for a night/day & reconnected us once again with love & strength.
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
If you look at it this way. If someone comes here and be’s honest. Perhaps I missed something but this is what I saw and then is attacked for that honesty or labelled. The person then reacts and everyone says see your a socio knew you would react like that. That isn’t fair and not something I advocate. I don’t or try not to judge anyone. I can have empathy for anyone including a sociopath. I am that way. I learned to be as my whole adult life was spent working with people who had issues. I tend not to judge. If a sociopath is going to be judged they will react and be the very person they are accused of. I know the last one in my life went to sociopath world. He knew he wasn’t like that. I can’t stand gang mentality or excluding people. It’s not right. The comment about bipolar people. It’s so wrong. So wrong and goes against everything this blog is about 😦
Hi Pos,
Point taken & I’m sorry if I offended you & no, I was not ‘attacking’ or creating a ‘gang’ mentality.
I’ve only ever come here to help & support.
I am really sad that you would think like that about me but, I am also mindful of your feelings & I apologized to Lyss & I thought we had sorted it out?
I guess the ‘triggers’ are having a Soc here & it always gets me into trouble so, I shall refrain from commenting unless it’s asked for?
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
Love you pr you know this. It is just the way that I am. I don’t really judge anyone. Or at least I try not to. Everyone has their story. I guess it hurts me to see anyone being ganged up on. I don’t know how a ‘sociopath’ would trigger you. She is a person she is female. She has done nothing to you, and couldn’t do. This blog from day one was about dating a sociopath. It was never about hating a sociopath. It was about understanding. I don’t want hating here. Its negative.
I guess I have empathy for everyone. I see others point of view. I really do see good in everyone. People are individuals. They are not just a label. This person isn’t a threat to you. Maybe I missed some comments. I didn’t see her being rude to anyone.
There are plenty of sociopath hating sites. This isn’t one of them. I hate actions that socios do. But she wasn’t doing that. Again maybe I missed some posts. As you know I have some things going personally.
I don’t think a sociopath posting would send people away. But in house fighting would.
Hi Pos,
All PR did was stand up for me when Lyss attacked me. Lyss and I were discussing sociopathic behaviour (completely theoretically and not personal). I said something that triggered Lyss and she came back with derogatory comments about me (my head was up my arse) and insulted my situation with my ex . I countered the argument (leaving the insults out of it) and she denied her comments were insulting. Possibly a communication break down, but then wouldnt let it go. There was never any mention of hating all sociopaths, infact, we both stated (PR and I) that this was not the case but Lyss appeared to take the position that we hated all sociopaths even though we denied it. PR was the perfect protector and did absolutely nothing wrong. I was in the wrong for trying to reason/debate with this particular sociopath (even after PR told me to let it be). My argument was never meant to anger Lyss, and she denies they did, but her reaction came across as such so i disengaged.
PR would never do anything but protect someone. And i thank her even though I was not upset at all, she still jumped to my defense and this sites defense to stop Lyss being so rude. Lyss complied.
I hope this helps clear things up. You just need to read the comments in order to understand.
I must say that i am slightly hurt that you would doubt PR and my intentions over a sociopath that attacked us.
Cheers
IID
Does anyone actually read the comments that lyss makes? Or do I see something nobody else does? I am also sorry if you were attacked. I haven’t seen that yet. But if so I am sure you are more than capable of saying your own words in reply. There is no need for ganging up. It’s between you and lyss. Surely? Or am I missing something? This is someone opening up? It hurts me that anyone would make themselves vulnerable by opening up and would be attacked here. It’s against everything I believe in. I hate people that gang up. You are more than capable of saying your own point of view. We both know this.
@ broken,
Yep, a Sociopeach, I got the Socio fruit basket!
I like fruit but, we throw out the rotten fruit or make jam!
She’s a loser paloser, you are a good guy, remember that there is better fruit out here. Pick wisely from here on in 😃❤️️💋
@PR..I don’t know why these posts aren’t showing up on my email-notifications!
@PR,
One of the things I have read in my book “Psychopath Free” is in reference to the darkness that I feel I’m in because of this tragic experience. Our empathy allows us, compels us to try and understand the SOC without really knowing what we are in for. Its a world of darkness and predatory energy that hunts our minds and souls and seeks to devour them. When you are discarded you are left literally wondering what happened to your mind and the light in your soul. Its because you entered into a soulless world that only the rarest of people can walk into and out of without harm or trauma. (Jesus comes to mind…maybe Batman too)
Lyss,
I had no idea about the patterning etc…until after I realised I’d been dating a sociopath. I started reading the stages & it was like ‘wow’, that is my life etc….it was hidsight, after the event & we all started helping each other & comparing & that’s when others would literally think we’d dated the same guy.
Can i ask you, why does your partner stay knowingly? The OW in my saga has stayed on & I would never do this knowingly. Once i knew what his motives were etc…if the situation was reversed, i would have no hesitation in leaving. I see women stay with known pedaphiles & rapists & donn’t get that either, any ideas?
Oh, & don’t get condescending with the awww’s etc…or maturity crap, just try & answer & I’m happy to dobthe same. Don’t cintinue to ‘pick on’ IID, no-one needs the agro. Thanks
PR
See, and that’s where the whole ‘there are different kinds of sociopaths’ comes in.
Well, I assume it’s because he loves me, or that he knows he can trust me (I’m almost dog-like loyal to him). While I mess up, I look for trouble (and I don’t mean by condescending him that I cause trouble, I more get angry at myself and it causes trouble because he hates it), he knows we’re horribly perfect for each other, or something corny like that.
He is messed up in his own ways, he had a crap childhood as well, and we have helped each other through times where we’ve in all honesty both wanted to just end our lives and be done with it.
I cannot judge on the latter question however, although I do assume it has something to do with the fact that women tend to think they can change someone, that they have some power to persuade a ‘bad-boy’. They convince themselves they’ll be different, because they have the power of love! (whatever that’s supposed to do)
Although, some more complex cases, it could be the thrill of the danger, or something. Sorry I could not answer any better.
But c’mon, the aw’s were completely necessary, and I think I got my point across ;3 at least I hope so. I can’t deal with having to reply the same thing again >.> If he/she doesn’t reply, I’ll be more than happy to leave it alone. Sound fair?
I often wonder that about OW as well. In my case, my Spath claimed his wife knew about me. I didn’t believe that.
@PR she only “picks” on me because I beat her hands down in a logical argument that she couldn’t keep up with and therefore had to resort in the typical sociopath way of “picking”. I have stopped playing because there is no more point. She is not countering anything or saying anything new because at the end of the day she can’t and never will understand. That’s not fair on her.
She’ll come back with something nasty or repetitive to this as well as it’s her only line of defence. It’s interesting how they think. Predictable, but interesting.
Now I really am going to turn this phone off and go to sleep. Night xx
@kadeed
Just thinking you said this would be the toughest few days for you. Hope you are doing well and are staying strong. Lots of love. AGPT
It is my birthday in 2 days and I have been feeling anxious all day. I will be 32. Most times I am excited that it will be my birthday but this time I just feel like I have wasted a few years of my life waiting for someone. I thought I would be married or engaged. Instead I am single and looking at a life by myself because I am now too scared to be in a relationship. I feel like a loser and completely rejected. I know that I deserve better than the sociopath/loser that I was with but how can someone ever love me with all the hurt that I went through in the past? How did he end up with a wife and a kid and I am left with never trusting another human being again.
Bad relationships are easy to come by. You needn’t envy him, or her. There’s is not anything you are looking for. And, 32 is young with still plenty of time for baby making. 😉 Relax, enjoy your birthday. Really not worth stressing over a soc and missing out on your life marker.
This is tough, and can be hard, painful. But please (I know this advice won’t change how you feel) waste your life, thinking how he has a great life and a wife etc (and even worse, that this therefore has to be your fault). I did this, for years of my life (from around the same age that you are now). I threw my life away. It was many years later (possibly 10) that the truth came out, that the marriage had ended… he had done exactly the same that he did to me. People don’t change. I hope that you realise that this is no reflection on you. Your life might only just be beginning and the magic might not yet have happened. Thank god he is someone elses husband and not yours!! 🙂
@Ex def, happy birthday to you. That this new year bring to you all the “tools” to make your dreams true, that at last you feel free from the hollow heart of him.
Feliz cumpleaños
There is an article called Rules of Relationships at outofthefog that speaks to your exact questions.
@POS,
Do you know the reason the post-updates aren’t showing up on my email? Thanks for checking if you do:)
@POS,
Never mind. They are now
Hi UC aka Broken,
The site or my phone reception isn’t great but, keep writing & singing your way out as it’s therapeutic.
I will try & reply better tomorrow? Site seems to be slow?
Stay strong & I’m still here.
PR xoxo
I haven’t written a post for a bit Broken, not for a week or so?
@POS,
Hey hon…it may Yahoo….I realize that it has funky as hell today. It must be the thread thing (not your fault) I’m not a computer guy…I got nervous because I thought my ex-soc might have tapped into my email (with her highly intelligent 25 yr. old soc’s help)
But I just received your last thread. It must be a “cyber-full-moon for the kid! Sorry for trouble!
Aww sorry Broken. I think sometimes wordpress does make it out of synch. I sometimes have problems keeping up with comments. Or sometimes I don’t see them, until I go back through and have to find them (when people write to me and tell me that I haven’t let a comment through).
Let me know if you continue to have problems.
@POS & PR (I’m not sure if this posted so I’m posting it again)
I’m just having a “bright moment.” and seeing how pathetic they really are. I wrote this:
This is called Morning Prayer:
They, from the beginning, needed us to feed off.
I don’t know if I’ll feel this way tomorrow morning or not, but I’m not prey. You are not either.
You were only trying to love. they were trying to conquer. By the very fact that you are here proves that you won.
They tried to feed off us like vampires, and did for awhile, but in the end our own spiritual strength and intuition made us break free.
We feel. We love. Our pain is testimony to that. That is a victory for any human being who has come into contact with someone who is more predator than human.
We came into contact with a “person” who was born without a fully developed brain that leaves them in an animal state. And, we survived. With human mentality, they are the dog or snake that will bite you.
We have been bitten but survived the attack.
I must admit, I am a veteran long diagnosed with PTSD, and because of my SOC, now have PTSD of both the HEART & MIND!
You know what though, in this glimmer of light I can see how the fate of us, the survivors of this phenomena, is for us to be elevated spiritually. I can’t completely feel it in it’s whole yet, but I’m seeing the brightness that Phoenix talks about.
They are left in their empty world. You are not. You won because you still have feelings. All’s they care about is one-upmanship, which is a lonely place to live. They cannot ever let their guard down. You can.
We shook like wounded soldiers with the fevered numb awareness that, all’s we wanted to see happen is for it to win and leave us alone. We also went through the torture of knowing that our own desire was part of that horror. But, we endured the storm and saw them and saw ourselves.
We gained strength
You can walk like a gentle warrior that has light shining down and through you. This is my prayer for the morning and for all of us. I’m having a bright moment and feeling the light precious Lady Phoenix speaks of:)) Sorry for rambling….it just came out
Love Broken
@POS
Its happening again. The update- email-posts aren’t showing up on my account! They appear and then they are deleted. Its just making me nervous
Hi Broken,
What do you mean? I am not deleting posts?
@POS,
Hey hon…it may Yahoo….I realize that it has funky as hell today. It must be the thread thing (not your fault) I’m not a computer guy…I got nervous because I thought my ex-soc might have tapped into my email (with her highly intelligent 25 yr. old soc’s help)
But I just received your last thread. It must be a “cyber-full-moon for the kid! Sorry for trouble!
@POS..and sorry for the typos. I couldn’t find my glasses! Have a good night