@Tay…..yep, I always question if he was an spath. This is necause we saw a different side of them at the beginning. They built our trust with them. Victims of abuse usually do think that it was something that they did rather than the abuser. They r masters of manipulation. Even if they are not an Spath, our ex’s were not very nice people and not people we want to be in a relationship with. We deserve to be treated with respect, honesty and love but we should be able to be ourselves as well and that person love us for that and make us feel secure in who we are and in our relationship.
The divorce was final yesterday. I know I’m supposed to feel great about this, but I am surprisingly sad. I still have little emotional bouts that overwhelm me throughout the day and night. I sob and mourn, albeit briefly, the loss of what I thought I had. I feel incredibly stupid and vulnerable at times. How could I have fallen for all of his lies. No one sees your soul like an SP. No one throws your soul in your face like an SP. Know one knows you like an SP. Know one haunts you like an SP.
That’s why they are so good at hurting you when they want to… they know exactly where to place the knife… exactly how deep and for how long to do just enough damage… to make you question your very sanity… then they dress your wounds and care for like it wasn’t them that caused them and expect you (and you do) to love them for it.
My counselor asked me today… what it was that I needed, that he gave me… that I got from him that I allowed this relationship to happen… and it wasn’t anything. I wasn’t abused as a child, I have always been smarter than your average bear, I have never been a ‘needy’ person. The simple answer is I don’t know. Maybe over the next weeks and months, I will find that answer… but I am scared too.. is there some hole in my soul, something I didn’t realize… something that ugly, that I felt I needed, or deserved to be treated like that??? That’s almost too horrible to contemplate.
Sometimes it not something inside that you are looking for but, perhaps you thought he was ‘good looking & complimented you?’ or perhaps your a ‘fixer’ or ‘rescuer’ so, with you he will be ‘greater’….it’s hard work but, when you really dig deep, it’s amazing what you find.
I was attracted to ‘power’ as mine is a Commander in the Fire-Brigade but, I mistook that he uses this position to ‘appear’ like a ‘good guy’ with integrity & trust & good values but, boy was I wrong.
I often found myself thinking ‘gee, if people knew what you were like in private, they’d be shocked’…Outside Angel, inside Devil.
I also realized that I liked being with someone that appeared powerful as it made me ‘look better’…..now, I know there were many reasons for that. I was seduced by the power & control etc…when I met him my life was a mess & I thought he was my knight in shinning armor!
Just the type he liked!
After much therapy & self reflection, I am now aware of my own strengths & weaknesses & am working on my weakness & using my strength’s to create the life I want & need 🙂
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
Yeah, I knew when I met him, I wasn’t at my strongest as I had recently lost my father… but as I stated – he in no was was EVER a replacement for my father…
I think – maybe – and maybe since I’ve had half of today to think on it – maybe I was still depressed from that – and possibly that’s where I’m heading… that not necessarily he was the “bad boy” I never had ever considered – as he is, comparatively – but that maybe I even had something of a self destructive wish… that maybe why I’m so lost now… is that I was this lost 5 years ago – and I just put it on hold while I let him destroy me as well…
I really hope not… I’m not sure anyone can fix that… that sort of sounds like it is all my fault on some level doesn’t it….???? Or am I playing his games in my own head???
I can’t even trust myself right now… I’m still making excuses for the jerk. And ~I~ am not even trying to! Just like with his phone calls and texts… I have him fully blocked now… but I have this feeling, a tingle, that I would get if he’d tried to call and I was out of cell range or in a meeting or whatever and he hadn’t been able to reach me and he’d get so mad. Course, when he wouldn’t answer my calls or texts for hours and hours.. it wasn’t supposed to be a big deal. Yet, STILL I dread the next time I see him – as I know he’ll have some spiteful comment about having his number blocked.
I just want to find a big rock and hide. I don’t want to know what’s in my head. I want it to go away. I want to be happy again. But I guess the only way to happy is through my head isn’t it?
PR… thanks… I probably won’t be able to write after tonight untill Tuesday… and I’m sure I’ll have lots to write about.
*hugs and love*
Raven
Raven 🙂
Just remember, self reflection is part of the healing process so, don’t be afraid of it & just let it come naturally. You will keep doubting & questioning yourself but, be careful & try to observe the thought rather than buy into it…stop & pause before you let the mind run away with the thought.
If your were grieving 😦 when you met him then, you were extremely vulnerable to this type of person as that is when they strike, when your normal barrier of resistance in down.
I am sorry for the loss of your Dad as, he was a pivotal person in your life & I am truly sorry, he isn’t there to protect you but, maybe he was & is.
He has set his beautiful daughter free of a man he would not approve of. I think you will be okay so, focus on yourself & what your Dad would say 🙂 he will answer & send messages so, be aware of them. You will see feathers or something to remind you of him & it will be amazing so, stay tuned up & open to it.
Have a great weekend & stay here to heal as it’s cheap therapy & reassuring that you are most definitely among friends & not alone 🙂
Love PR xoxox
There are no accidents.. and you know I am Christian. It’s awesome you mention feathers… I was/am a falconer – haven’t had my own bird since before I met – him – this not because of him though – birds of prey don’t do well in apartments… – still one of the last birds I had before my husband and I had moved north – we release a pair here at my parents. They have stayed here and raised their young for years. And I believe their kids come back as well.
Just today – mom and I found a single perfect red-tailed hawk feather…
Thank you Phoenix. It’s so hard- even when talking to the few friends I am able to talk to… I feel like a broken record and I know they all think I should just get over it… and I can’t explain something I don’t even understand and frankly I don’t want to.
It is so good to have you all… I found you when I was completely floundering as to where to turn.
Have a very safe weekend!
*hugs and love*
Raven
Keep an eye out for more messages from above 🙂
I wondered why I had been obsessing over Eagles lately & knew it was a message as your name “Raven” implied a connection 🙂
I see ‘Raven’s’ all the time…they are messengers as well 🙂
Take care & focus on the feather, it will bring you great comfort…it’s from a loved one 🙂
(((hugs))) to you….I love birds too 🙂
PR xoxox
I’m heading to bed.. have an early morning tomorrow… but my next birds will be two ravens – of course named Hugin and Munin – not orginal – but when I got my first hawk, my master falconer had a clutch of raven chicks… and they were soooo smart!! I have wanted to work with a pair ever since!!
I will let you know how it goes as soon as I can. I don’t expect it to be perfect… but I’m not going to let him get to me… if he tries to start anything – or really even comes near me, I plan to just walk away. I may have to go straight to my tent or the closest portapotta and bawl my eyes out… but I will not let him see me fall apart.
I have everyone on this board with me!!!
PR… thank you – so much!!
*hugs and love*
Raven
Congratulations on the divorce & commiserations to you on feeling so down 😦 You will however rise again as you are very resilient & you just need this time to process & put it behind you once & for all.
Yesterday is just that, yesterday & you have closed that door & now you must open another as that was the ‘sign’ to move forward.
It’s always hard letting go but, you know deep down that it’s for the best.
That is why it happened as, it was not good for you to stay involved with a person that reflected you back at yourself.
Up until their mask slipped & the real person behind it emerged, you were being ‘gamed’ & once he had you, he could stop pretending.
They get you to share & over share everything so, they can use it against you. They know your motivations as they study you so intently & know how you think, feel & act.
Remember the person that was there after the ‘honeymoon’, don’t focus on the ‘seducer’, but, the player & gamer & then you will feel relieved that you are no longer being lied to & manipulated.
Do everything you can to heal as, it’s a constant struggle so, treat yourself like a job & get up everyday & work on you…you are wonderful & beautiful & worthy…you are a soul & you need to remember who you truly are & what makes you the truly unique individual you are.
We all have something ‘special’ that no-one else has so, find the ‘greatness’ within yourself & own it!
You are not your divorce, the divorce is an event so, have an event to celebrate your freedom 🙂
On my way to live again…
I can so relate to how you feel…I’m in the process of divorcing my SP after a roller coaster marriage of 12 years. Some days it takes all my strength to cope with emotions…
@Raven……Yep, I believe they pray on the strong ones. I was very much like that as well. Strong, independent woman. It is like a game. See how far they can push you until you break and than take pride in themselves for being able to do it to the strong-willed.
@Ex def an S
Doesn’t that mean that those people aren’t strong at all? If they were, they’d be unbreakable, but clearly they were not.
This isn’t meant to be an insult or attack, I’m merely stating what I see.
I personally believe people pretend to be strong, but when they’re confronted with someone (such as a sociopath) their true strength (or weakness) is shown.
@Lyss….I think the majority of people have a breaking point, no matter how strong or weak that person is. Perhaps I have misunderstood strong with patience LOL. I am always told that I am a strong person as I always seem to put up with a lot of crap and been through a lot and come out with a positive attitude. What doesn’t kill you, just makes you stronger.
@Raven
“but since I’ve found ya’ll, I feel more and more angry and I really do understand more. ” This shows progress through the stages of grieving.
At first I was shell shocked and bewildered when I discovered her duplicity. Once I had more knowledge of cluster B’s and their modus operandi and examined past events in this new light I grew angrier also. Eventually, I drew my lessons out of those examinations and decided to move on. This finally led to the acceptance phase. I had my understanding and lessons learned and realized I can’t change the past but I can influence my present and future. Now if I catch myself thinking about that time I can honestly say to myself “Screw that, I’ve got better things to think and do. ” and it feels good. 🙂
Wow! Falconry and Harleys. You have some really interesting pursuits. I always wanted to try falconry when I was younger. I am going to add taking some lessons in that to my to do list. Stay strong at your camp out. Lots of love. AGPT
I left some of my things at Mr. X’s home (where we both used to live). My emails to him were straight and to the point. His were flirtatious, and it was obvious he wanted a booty call. It’s been 3 weeks since I left, and he deleting me from virtual existence. I had to tell him that I thought those moves were childish. From reading here, I understood right away that he was transferring the blame to me, projecting. It wasn’t an argument, but a discussion. He was complimentary (something he hadn’t been in months). He made me dinner.
And then it began…the flirting, the continued compliments, the touching, hugging, kissing. He thinks of me every day, he misses our closeness at night (but admittedly likes the silence of being on his own – remember…I brought a bag in the house with vitamins and when going thru it, he asked me to leave the room). I’m his drug, I’m his porn, I’m his everything…and we went “there”.
I left and all I could think of when driving home was why? Why couldn’t he have treated me that way the past few years. Why couldn’t he compliment me, profess his love to me, caress my face like he did tonight, and kiss me so tenderly that my heart literally skipped a beat.
It’s the game….he wants control over me, without me physically being there.
And then the self-doubt…from his perspective tonite, I’m the princess but there isn’t a fairy tale happy ever after now that we’re older; I live in my own psychotic reality, it’s my fault he pushes me away (this all said during a pleasant conversation believe it or not). I do agree with him that at this stage of the game, we (being married before, grown kids) should just be “us”…he has his family, I have my family, but it’s about “us”, yet he was the one that pushed me out the door with his isolation. But I question myself, is it me? (I know it’s totally the soc but he sure knows how to get me to question myself).
No, this is NOT you. Why would you make yourself feel bad? Why would you do something to hurt you? Why would you not look out for your own best interests? He is bad news. To know whether he is good or bad for you, ask the question, how do I feel about me? How does he make me feel about me? If it’s bad you know he is bad for you. If it’s really bad you know he is really bad for you.
Oh Dear LA,
Back to the ‘naughty corner’ with you!
Don’t worry as you’ll have plenty of company as quite a few ‘go there’ before they finally break that incessant bond.
Just know that you are not alone & if I could I’d give you a big hug & say, ‘it’s really hard to let go someone you love but, love is not a person that breaks your heart over & over’. 😦
(((o))) an internet hug for you bella,
Only you can break the cycle so, just focus back on yourself & back to support & therapy etc…day one begins again of NC, let’s try & stop you hurting yourself anymore, what do you say?
The heart that loves you wouldn’t hurt you, ever!….Trent Shelton 🙂
Because he was playing the game la that is what they do, pull you in, then push you away when it is no longer convenient for them. It’s all about control. He pulls you in when he feels he is losing control. This is about his ego, not your self worth.
So true Pos, the game of cat & mouse.
Love hurts but, it only hurts us & not them as they cannot relate to love.
Sad but true & once we finally accept that fact, we start to accept that our love is best served towards ourselves & others that feel love for real 😃
Sometimes we lie more to ourselves than the Soc does & think we didn’t love them enough otherwise they would’nt abandon us etc…but, thats the biggest lie of all.
We love ‘big’ & they don’t love at all.
Therein lies our mistake if them then using our loving intentions against us.
Their intentions all all ego & self motivation, its easy to leave if you never arrive & they never arrive with loving intentions.
The nature of the beast is what it is & our time is precious & so is our love.
Letting go of someone that hurts you is not a loss, its a recognition to your soul that you are valuable & know your worth 😃
PR xoxo
i was so devastated the first time she suggested to me that something i did was stupid, but it was actually what she did that was stupid. i knew something was wrong . hey Guys realize that these people cant feel anything, they know somethings wrong with them but they are too far gone to change, they.re heading for a train wreck. my ex is back on her social media dating sites EVERYDAY like an obsession looking for her perfect situation. but doesn;t realize without true emotional love its FUTILE. BUT SHE;S GOING AT IT FULL THROTTLE. thank God for this site . cause i have closure and solice and know what im worth. she even has potential but it.s gonna take something pretty dramatic to win this SOUL bless you guys keep posting ps i’ll let you guys know if i hear anything from her on fathersday. she never calls on special days birthdays holidays, new years christmas, life or death OH YES IT REALLY HAPPENED SO LETS JUST SEE
I would like to share my story. Today is Wednesday, May 28th. As of May 25, I had been involved with a sociopath I met on twitter for fifteen months. Initially, there were no red flags. He was EXACTLY. Ex. Zact. Ly. What I wanted in a mate, to a T. Passionate, creative, good career, ambitious, charismatic, charming, well spoken, intellectual and super. fucking. attractive. God he is fine.. at only 22. Amazing right? After only a week of texting, we Skype’d and telling me he wanted me to quit my job and move to his state and work for the company he works for. (it was then I was like okay, this dude is really into me. This might be it. The serious relationship I’ve been feinding for.) I was currently working at McDonalds, a job I loathed for obvious reasons and I constantly complained about my work when we talked. But soon, he began to get annoyed with me. Tell me how I lacked depth and ambition, I guess because I wasn’t as ambitious as he. He would make remarks about how naive he could tell I was. I took these comments in stride, I’ve already fallen. It’s just constructive. NO one wants to see a pretty girl waste their life at a fast food joint making minimum wage. He wants me on his level. Then came the flip flopping. One day, he was all over me another day he couldn’t stand me. wouldn’t text, call, nada. I couldn’t figure him out, it intrigued me even more. The more we talked I yearned to find out more about him, his family, his background. That’s where the inconsistencies started. One day he called me and the name that came on the caller ID was not the name I knew him by. I questioned him about it. “Who the fuck is ____?!” Response: some vague answer I can’t remember. So, I google searched his real name. The entire ____ family popped up. (apparently he’s from an affluent family) I found the brother on Facebook and befriended him and started looking for answers to my questions. Everything. EVERYTHING A was almost always a lie. “He was NOT a bachelor. He never graduated college. He never studied abroad. He wasted our parents money again, and again we do not even deal with him. And he has SEVERAL lady friends” I was devasted. Why so many lies about your family? Then when I confront him about this: He offered NO explanation, no apology, nothing. Just “I’ll contact you again when YOU apologize for calling me a liar” and because I was in love, I gave in. I wanted the full family story tell me the truth. He still didn’t. I let it go, maybe some things are better left unsaid. I don’t need their blessing to be with him. We moved passed the “lying about his identity, education and family” obstacle. I just spent the memorial weekend in his state. That’s when he showed me in real CST that he did not care about me or my feelings. Picked me up from the station, no hug no kiss, no kind of engagement, I fell asleep in his bed and tried to cuddle on him he pushed me off. Ditched me in the middle of the night to go party, then when I confronted him about the way he was acting toward me he flipped it all on me. I was being standoffish. According to him. I left his parents home broken hearted and devastated. “I am in love with you, I did a lot to come see you this weekend why are acting so mean toward me?” Literal tears, right in front of him. He. Did. Not. Care. Dropped me off at the station HOURS before I was supposed to depart. I spent the long ride home crying my eyes out. I had my suspicions about being broken, being sociopathic. It’s all mental, I thought. I would support him through therapy..that’s how much I love him. Right now, I’m on no contact and it hurts me sooo much. He had everything I wanted in a guy but.. I just can’t. Sigh. I’m still not over it.
You say that he had everything that you wanted in a guy….. but…..
Did he really? He put you down, he lied to you, he disrespected you. He had to fake things about himself to pretend to be good enough for you… then put you down to make himself believe he was good enough for you.
Was he REALLY everything that you wanted in a man?
Write down a list of ALL that you want in a man.
Then write another list all that he WAS (not what he faked to be)
Then write all that he FAKED to be….. and draw a LINE through it…..
There is another post, I need to find it, that I want to share with you, its about how they steal our dreams and this makes us think that they have stolen a part of us> You then think that the answer to the missing piece lies within him – but actually NO it lies within YOU.
I think I might be a bit odd LOL.1 and a half years later and I find myself still muting, changing the channel or turning the tv off whenever there is a love scene or talking about relationships or sex. It triggers my anxiety. Some days I can watch but the majority of time I do everything. Is anybody else the same?
Welcome to the ‘odd’ club, gee we have so many clubs here now 😃
My trigger is songs but, not as bad as it once was. Depends on my mood & how things are going in general. If I’m having a bad day & a love song comes on like John Legend ‘All of me’.
I am like ‘get real you perfectly happy gorgeous looking freak’ play ‘Tainted Love’ or some other song I can relate to 😁 then they play ‘Happy’ & I get real & apologise to John & Buble & dance & sing myself clear. I am a little obsessed with Paloma Faiths ‘I can’t rely on you’ but, singing in the car with gusto, means I get a clear run as other drivers think I’m nuts 😉
Just kidding about being nuts, it’s the squirrel in me 😁
It gets better so, its up to you when you control the triggers & not vice versa.
Try making yourself sit through some like a test, you must stop avoiding & face it, then go out & live it 😃
Bring back your Mojo.
My dogs nickname us Mojo & somedays I call out, ‘here Mojo, has anyone seen my Mojo!’
I first found this site a year ago, you must have been new, but I didn’t know that then. Thank God for you…….I realized that my guy was a sociopath at that time, but I was dealing with another one in my life who had married my Dad, isolated him, through his sickness and death and taken everything. She then came for for the bit my Mom had left us…….Women are socio’s too…….I was in a bad shape from my Dad’s death, the betrayal, not being able to see him in the last 2 years of his life and having to fight back……There was no time to just grieve my Dad……….During these years my Guy ( socio) had established him self in my life as part of my support system. I also changed my job and moved!!! Too many big events all at one time…….
I did break up with my guy for a couple of months after reading this site, but he came back and got back in…….Hardly surprising with everything else I have been dealing with.
This year we had the best relationship we have ever had……I thought we were settling into ‘Us’….Little did I know…….
So here I am to tell you that I have won my case against Dad’s wife. In winning I mean that I managed to hang on to what was left to us after Mom died, she made off with everything my Dad had, but I didn’t fight that……She is having to leave the house and we can sell it, she gets half but so what……..In the legal settlement I have a clause of NO CONTACT……..I want her to go away. I want to legally make sure that she can never come back for us ( my brothers and I ) again……..She already has a new source.
I just want to tell you that she is in her early 70′s now, they never stop!!!
So to the guy…….
Just as this was all ending, the red flags began to appear again with the guy…….I had a phone call from his girlfriend!!! (New source)
I exposed him…….It is the only way for me to get him out of my life. His new source is another one!!!!
She immediately exposed 3 other girlfriends and gave them all my phone number, said I was a stalker. She then sent out an email to us all saying that He was now hers…..And we should all just move on…..
No problem, she hadn’t stopped to notice that we had all stepped back….
I immediately blocked all contact, phone, text and email. I gave the other girls this site and told them to read. One immediately shut him out, one didn’t, not my concern.
I am getting friend requests from her friends, ( the new source) and she is infiltrating my life to keep tabs on me……I have blocked them all…….We have a lot of common circles.
Healing is the only way forward……I can not heal if I hear about him, people want to gossip about them, or tell me more horrifying stories…..
I am begging my friends to not talk about it to anyone other than to say we broke up, he moved on……
The amazing gift from all of this is forgiveness for my Dad. I have spent the last years going How could you?…….Well now I know exactly how my Darling Dad got duped, and treated, because I fell in love with a socio at the same time….The forgiveness for Dad is the gift, I can now grieve him and miss him………
If there is anyone reading this who thinks that they can manage these people with kindness and love, please believe me when I say that you can’t……I tried everything with my Dad’s wife so that I could see my Dad.
I live in the states, My family is in the UK……So I didn’t see why I would be a threat, but I was…….
The other thing I have realized is that it is NOT personal……Its so not about YOU……They have no attachment to you at all, just what they want from You……
NO CONTACT……….It is the only way to heal and move on.
I am 3 weeks into no contact with my Guy, and although I would love closure, I know I can not have it.
Tomorrow I sign the legal document in the UK and the NO CONTACT clause goes into effect with Dad’s wife……
Please if you are reading this, know that the only revenge is happiness.
They live in a perpetual ground hog day. You do not……They are not happy, they are sad, and they do not change…….
I will keep my circle small and strong, I will not hear or listen to the smear tactics of the new source and him, I will keep myself safe…..For the alternative is unacceptable to me…….
Thank you so much for this site.
PLEASE do not stop…..
You have no idea how many lives you are helping and they don’t always come in the form of a relationship, and sometimes they come in packs….
THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU.
Keep it up, It is the best……
Hi Paula, yes I started just over a year ago, end of Feb 2013. I am so sorry that this happened to your dad after losing your mum, that must have been so painful. Wow about your ex that he ended up with one too. Thank you so much for your kind words. You know, the biggest gift of this is that you understand your father what he has been through. . And in turn, he will understand you. This, is a gift of life more precious than anything.
THESE PEOPLE ARE SICK GUYS…. YOU GOTTA LIMIT YOU CONNECTION WITH THEM…. I KNOW HOW LONELY IT CAN BE BUT REMEMBER GOD SEE.S EVERYTHING, SO IF YOU REALLY LOVED THEM PRAY FOR THEM GOD JUST MIGHT SUPRISE YOU !!! HE;S ALREADY ANSWERED PRAYERS FOR ME
Hmm it seems like your site ate my first comment (it was extremely long)
so I guess I’ll just sum it up what I had written and say, I’m thoroughly enjoying your
blog. I too am an aspiring blog writer but I’m still new to the whole thing.
Do you have any tips for novice blog writers? I’d really appreciate
it.
Hi everyone….I have been with some one for 32 years an its been hell on earth. I now see he is a sociopath and I don’t see a way out of this I wouldn’t even know where to begin..I have started to go to a therapist and she also referred me to a psychiatrist because I have started to physically hurt myself. My therapist actually treated him in the past and after about 6 visits with him she requested to meet me only to find out that everything he had said to her was a lie. Thank God she saw through his lies within 2 minutes of meeting me. She says he has delusional disorder but I think it is a lot deeper than that. I don’t know what to do anymore.
I always new there was something off with him. I was 15 (32 years ago) when we met and he lied about his age even his name. I discovered that, about a year after we were together. I knew about the insane jealousy and his excuse was that he loved me. The lies, the cheating, never stopped. He reverses everything he does and or acts as if I’m just like him. We have grown children and he has approached them about my perceived infidelities to the point that they just tell him STOP you are making this up (they have caught him in his lies) and they call him on it, then he becomes angry and then he is the victim. That’s were the therapist said he has delusional disorder but I firmly believe he is a Sociopath. I will tell her this when I see her this week. But as I’m writing this I feel that there is probably a lot more going on with him, This website has been a fountain of information or should I say confirmation. At least I know I am not crazy just traumatized.
My ex has just divorced his wife after 10 years separation? & 25 years married so, 35 yrs for her. He still controls her via their adult children & has implanted his nearly 30 yr old son who had lived with her for last 10 years to make sure she doesn’t move on.
I remember him telling me she had a younger boyfriend & he was livid. He made sure his children destroyed that relationship etc…
This is what they do & continue to do especially if they have children with you.
They don’t want you to move on or be happy, they will but, won’t allow you.
My advice is have little or no contact ever & tell your children they must not discuss what you do etc….
The children are used as proxy’s & even when they try & protect you, he is loving it. Your children should not have to defend you under normal circumstances & if they see him games & call him on it, that is good. Unfortunately though, having to live with him accusing you is torture for them & once again, he loves the game.
Tell your children you want your freedom from his game & work together to stop his game.
Break the cycle of dysfunction he causes by breaking the conduit between him, you & your children.
I wish you well & hope you & your children break free of him one day.
This broken-underconstruction. Its been awehile so I wanted to check in. Things are going well. I went to court, the charges were dropped to a non-criminal misdemeanor, my abstinence from booze remains good, and I am in good standing with my employers. It will still be a year before I am able to drive, but that will come in time.
I’m taking a huge time out from the romantic scene, and have remained no contact. My plans for th esummmer are to keep getting my ankle and leg back up to speed and maintain a good level of fitness. I just wanted to say hi to the beautiful funny lady & wish everyone peace.
Things are going well an dI think it does me justice to now say refer to myself as unbroken
I am so glad you are okay & have been rebuilding etc…
Like you I am also off the market romantically.
I figure my chances after two disasters are quite low so, I look at what I do have & I am good 🙂
Its necessary to pack up, pick up & push on & that’s what makes us all survivors.
Whats the alternative? Unpack, drop our bundle & push off? Nah, not for us 🙂
I wish you continued strength & support & most of all the best of what remains of this lifetime 🙂
I will see you on the other side eventually, hopefully???
I will be the one with the name tag on upside down or on the wrong cloud. Maybe I will be off complaining that my wings aren’t what I ordered 😉
Rest assured we will know each other well 🙂
That’s right realniceguy. When you come out the other end, you realise how messed up that person you were with really was. It is a really hard lesson to have learnt but let’s hope that we grow from it. Even all the stuff they say about their ex’s, it all makes perfect sense when you walk away. Sure, the spaths ex’s probably didn’t behave in a “normal” manner, perhaps crazy, but their lives were spiralling out of control and being manipulated by a sociopath. I understood the spaths ex better after this experience and I have comfort in knowing that I wasn’t the his only victim.
hey ex def an s its hard but it gets better everytime i think about how harsh she was with her mouth, it now reminds me of how sick she is . i recently talked to her about the desease of SOCIOPATHY and she seemed interested , i told her about the research that im doing regarding sociopathic behavior in relationships. one day im gonna sit her down with me and have her read some post maybe it will jar a positive reaction but , KEEP IT MOVIN IS THE POLICY. im gonna have to stop having sex with her because im sure she.s sleeping around …… im not going out that way HIV is very nasty i know somebody who.s dying from it now
hey guys this is realnice guy wishing all the fathers a happy fathers day. im going to spend the day at the beach the waterway to my soul. bless you guys, we need each other
I have been with mine 32 years and as I have said before its hell on earth. We are still together, he wont go, I am working on getting everything together to politely ask him to leave once again if not I will take legal action. One thing I have noticed is they are all the same. Last summer we were all having a normal day and when everyone left he accused me of having an affair (not true) it was him trying to have an affair with the wife of the person he was accusing me of having an affair. I checked phone records, she didn’t go for him and he heard her and I make plans to go somewhere that following Friday..(it was wishful thinking on my part because I have never even been shopping without him) not allowed. EVER. when they left we got into an argument and he was accusing me of all types of things he pushed me (first time) and I fell against butcher block hurt my hand, arm and back of head. Long story short he says he is getting me an apartment with our son the only still living at home (hes 24) and that he is going to rent himself a room. My middle child says he will take my apt where I was living. My husband gets happy decides he will stay in basement and live with our middle child. Well when my middle child sent him a text with rules and regulations of living in the dame house he was not happy. He ends up worming his way back into my life saying he is sorry and that he will get help. Understand at this point I didn’t realize he was a Sociopath. He starts going for therapy and about after 6 sessions the therapist says she wants to meet me. I go …with in 2 minutes she realized everything he had said to her was a lie. He said we were separated, that I fooled around badmouthed me to no end she called him on it and let him have it. He never went back…he was calm for a bit but has started again if its not a kid across the street staring at me when I sit on the front porch its I stop traffic. so I stopped going out front. I sit be kitchen window and feed cardinals and have a cigarette now he claims theres a naked man in the window 2 back yards away. Me therapist says he is Sociopath and suffers from delusional disorder. I keep coming back here to read and see so many similarities. Just a few more weeks and hopefully I will be able to move forward. He just wont go away..
Your amazing & I hope you realize that!
Staying with a disordered mind for 32 years is a huge battle & I know how hard it is when you have made a life & created a home & have children etc…to get away from the insidious nature of the beast!
Please know that you are not a loser or that your battle has gone unnoticed as you have done your best to overcome a very controlling & manipulative & engulfing man.
Staying is much harder than going as I can attest & the fact that you are contemplating freeing yourself is wonderful.
It’s not easy, never was but, it does get better.
You are worth the peace of mind you will rightfully receive once out of his clutches.
Life doesn’t suddenly drop a better option in your lap, you do.
The peace I have away from the disordered mind is actually amazing & terribly freeing & liberating.
People think having someone is better than no-one at all but, not having a disordered mind game you senseless is the ‘gift’you give yourself.
I am much happier inside & free to think & take responsibility for me &, whilst that hasn’t been a walk in the park, I find that peaceful place & I sit & feast on the picnic that is life!
Focus on you & your life without his delusions, now that’s paradise 🙂
Thank you for your words of wisdom. Staying is definitely harder, as to not allowing him to use the boys as a tool is a moot point as I discovered a digital voice recorder taped under our dining room table yesterday. Which means every conversation I have had with my sons when they visit or any conversation with friends on phone have been recorded. I did not confront him but I did play a song that is on I believe facebook (I am a liar ,an Ozzy Osbourne song) so I think he knows I know about recorder. I cant even look at him, I got home from work yesterday and went straight to bed at 630 pm and pretended to be asleep. I am Furious, that he feels he has the right to do something like that and think it is ok. These are our children I am having conversations with. I don’t interfere in his relationship with our children. Today the recorder is not there, I have a feeling its in my car and will search before I go home. Should I confront him? onto the recorder I also read the article from this blog about sociopaths wanting people to believe that there partner is doing to them what they are indeed themselves doing, so I think he must have got the hint, but his mind is so warped it probably went over his head and wondered who I was talking about. I guess im just venting..thank you
Hi All,
It has been a month since I ended my on, off 5 year relationship. I can’t thank you enough for being here. You are amazing.
I am reading comments of so many of us in such similar pain. It breaks my heart for us all.
Today I had an encounter with one of his other girls and I noticed that my heart didn’t beat faster, my stomach didn’t turn over, the voice was there in my head, but quieter…..I know that even though he is now in a relationship with his new source, he is still cheating with his other girls….
I know how that feels, that used to be me!!
But today it isn’t, thanks to you guys.You are amazing……
3 years ago, I first broke up with him, when I was told that he had moved in with his new date, while still seeing me all the time. I wouldn’t see him..
I woke up at 1.30am in the morning with him naked at the end of my bed,
we were having sex within seconds……I spent the first 10 minutes think OMG HE is raping me..This is bad.All the time he was telling me how much he loved me, couldn’t live without me etc………I gave in…..I have tortured myself with HOW? WHY? My Dad was dying and all that made me vulnerable, but I think the truth maybe that I just couldn’t believe the truth. The truth was so out there, so bad, that I had to be wrong?
I couldn’t face it……
So I have no judgement on the girls that are back with him even though it all got exposed, or the woman who thinks she is in a committed relationship with him, because I was the same.
BUT Thanks to you guys, I am not there today.
I encountered one of them today, and I feel so blessed, so lucky…..I know I am healing.
It does get better……Bit by bit we can do this…..We do not want them back, so forward is the only way.
Good luck to all of you brave wonderful ladies….
And thank you so much for this site.
We are survivors.
Love and laughter
@realniceguy…..definitely stop having sex with her. It isn’t just the diseases you can catch if she is sleeping around, but the “sex bond” that is created as well can make it harder to detach from the situation. Sex can be used as a weapon by a Sociopath because of the attachment it creates and draws you back in. When it comes to a Sociopath, you should stop having sex with her before she throws you away and makes you feel confused or starts withholding sex (this happened to me and it was extremely confusing, I was his girlfriend, helping him financially but I was lucky to get a hug from him. He was like taking from one hand but not giving with the other). I think sometimes that is the only way to handle a Sociopath, always be one step ahead of them.
ii agree whole heartedly im doing really well because i dont have any dependency on her emotionally anymore , i know that i cant trust her, she,s ready researching her next victim on SOCIAL MEDIA. i mean she.s on there everyday. but anyhow im so thankful for this site because i can see right through her now, you were right she throws out little feelers to see if im still interested. but im preparing my final exit.and im plannning to go back to school in september so things are really looking up,,,. im so thankful for you guys.we really all your post gave me so much clarity im whole again ,,, anyway im getting there but thanks
I met my sociopathic (psychopathic) ex husband in 2012. He picked me out of a crowd and zeroed in on me at a public event I was at with a friend. He reocgnized her from college 8 or 9 years before and started chatting her up until she introduced me to him. I should have trusted my initial gut reaction to him-that he grinned to widely for my liking and had an overtly sexual vibe that shouldn’t be trusted. He told me later that he picked up on my being put off by him when I initially avoided him and so he tried another approach later in the evening. At that point he came across as innocent and awkward to me and was able to engage me in conversation and what I have later learned was expert mirroring which continued through the first few months of what became a relationship and whirlwind marriage and lovebombing which all abruptly ended when I became pregnant and he thought he had total control. Unfortunately for him both his exgf nd his brother came to me at different times during my tumultuous pregnancy and let me know that both he and other memebers of his family were sociopathic and that I wasn’t crazy. This led to me confronting him and a loss of his control over me. Being hormonal a.d pregnant also gave.me much more gusto and rage over the abuse I had endured which had been emotional passive aggressive financial and gas lighting type abuse. Once I got angry and stood upnfor my self and confronted how he treated me and he knew he had no control (I had also revealed what his ex gf brother and even mother had said about him) he started to get verbally abusive and criticized the way I looked and called me duragatory names until I would snap and the whole ordeal would get blamed on me and I would be called unstable and crazy. I got progressively more depressed during the pregnancy and he even encouraged me to kill myself. I eventually turned the depression back outwards I to anger and rage for how I wad being treated. The fighting escalated and I move back into my own home. He didn’t have the job or income he boasted about and had lied about being able to support me and the child he had conned me into getting pregnant with. I was devastated but was tired of being either angry and in hormonal rages or else depressed. He admitted he was cold hearted and had no empathy. He admitted to conning me but said it was my fault for.being so naive as to trust him. We tried marriage counseling. I got an individual coumselor who told me to get away fast…hat he was pathological and would never change and would only change me and.my life in a bad way. I kept away with no contact beginning in my second trimester when I felt a lot mote stable. This was after fathers day of last year when he had punched me several times while I was sitting in my car, in my inner thighs breasts and stomach becasuse I confronted him about sabotaging my work and income so that he could manipulate me moving back into his house which his parents owned.andnhe paid no rent on and pretended to farm the land around in his delusional peterpan world. It was too much for him to be confronted and to lose control over me again. He went to his father that fathers day and told he changed his mind about family life and came back and told.me the same and said I should move away to live with my parents in another state. I kept no contact until the end of August when I was stupid enough to go to his house when ie said.he would not be here to get some of my things. At this point he did his best seductive stare down depsote the fact that I was angry and crying and kept getting closer and closer and trying to make eyecontsct and hug me. After about an hour of me refusing and crying and telling him how horrible he was he just smiled and stared and said i needed food and water and rest….I should have known this was bs Bc he never once cared for my health or wellbeing since I had become pregnant. In fact he food away from me and refused to care for.me or have any consideration. At all for.months. it was always all about him after the honeymoon stage. He then moved in hard in the kitchen once my guard was down and started kissing and touching g and hugging me like he did in the past and telling me he loved me. This resulted in me getting brainwashed and hoovered back in in my hormonal and vulnerable state. We had sex for hours that day until the bonding hormones set back in. I stayed with him for several days and he seemed to be wonderful again, but deep down I knew better and ignored my intuition once again. On August 4 th of last year when I was 26 weeks pregnant we had sex in the morning and he was very rough and agressive with me despite me protesting. I eneded upn collapsing on my stomach witb him on my backside and yelling out before he finally stopped. I am a very small person and was in pain vaginally and was crushed as well. I was upset but blew it off and laid down to read after he went to his pt 15 hour per week job. He had two degrees and yet no motivation to find a real job depsite having a child on the way and telling me when we married that hewas on brink of beginning his carreer and was already a successful permaculturist-wjich was not at all true as I found out once the first spring rolled around and I was already pregnant. In reality he had a free place to live that should have been a farm but was just a bunch ofnweeds and unfinished projects and a black thumb to boot. He even killed one of my dogs, poisoned another, and had killed hundreds of chickens through starvation and exposure because of neglect during winters when they stopped laying eggs ans were no good to him I was told by acquaintences of his. He always had an excuse for these occurencds and why it was accidental and.not his fault or in the case of he chickens a lie by people out to get him. This brings.us back to the pregnancy….so later that day after the sexual assault on me after I got up from recovering and went back to my own house my water broke. I was 26 weeks pregnant and drove myself to the emergency room. I was rushed to a high risk hospital immediately and stabilized and was put on bed rest for the remainder of.my pregnancy. My husband and his.mother were there hovering acting as if nothing g was wrong or tonworry about as soon as I was admitted. No empathy and inappropriate behavior made my.family who rushed there and hospital staff suspicious over my hudband. The hospital kept asking about abuse after incidents where my husband acted inappropriately and I was upset. One time he screamed at me and this aroused suspicions furtherl. I asked that he and his family leave me alone to rest and they could not keep boundaries. They all started acting out in various ways and I was under.much stress and emotional turmoil. I enede up with placental abruption hemmorraging and delivering at 30 weeks and spent time recovering from a c section and being with my son daily in the NICU for the next two months while dealing with the bombardment of my then estranged husband and his cultish large family. Even his mother whom I.had trusted became invasive and pushed my boundaries and seemed rather brainwadhed and controlled by her husband who came to visit and forced hugs and physical contact like his son. My ex was standoffish and angry towards me and acted.like he didn’t want to be there and told me again to move away with family. Meanwhile he was playing the victim and getting attention for he birth of his child. He refused to add his name to the birth certificate when I handed it to him. Since then he has told people i left his name off and ran off with his son. He has neglected to pay child support until his famiy found out recently when they demanded to see the baby and were told the truth. He then hurriedly paid one month and threatened recourse if his parents and grandparents didn’t get to see the baby. He only cares about appearances and not his son sadly. After reading extensively about sociopaths and psychopaths during and after this relationship I realized many more insidious things hat had been going on. I.could go on and on. The worst was when I asked him to fix a problem in m y
I had asked him to fix a problem in my basement laundrynroom and he left electrical cord instamding water where I needed to stand in order to pull the light switch cord on the ceiling. The lights came on and I realized whet danger I was in and got angry and accused him of trying to electricute me and the baby. He called me crazy and a bitch and said it was an accident. I realized later after realizing the extent of his psychopathy that this wasn’t an accidnrt ans neither were the deaths of dogs cats and chickens. Former friends of his pointed out his obsession with death and his pretentious philosophic musings on facebook about his morbid fascinations. They also told me about hisnobsession with poisons psychoactive drugs and other secrets he had. This really explained who he really was behind the charming smiling happy go lucky guy. He was really a sadistic egomaniac in delusions of grandeur who was obsessed with his misunderstandings of existential philosophy and was constantly experimenting with psychedelic drugs because he always needed some kind of stimulation in his unhappy misanthropic void. Why he fixated on me and thought he could maintain a wife and child is puzzling…other than like his father and grandfather before him he wanted to feel normal and seem normal to others and to have companionship and human possessions. I am just glad I got away and didn’t stay to raise 5 kids with a psychopathic husband in misery like his mother did. I currently have all custody of my child and have offered his family supervised visits but am nervous about where things will go from here and if my family and I will be left alone. Sorry for typos. I’m on a difficult device for typing.
Correction to first post Sept 4th not August. Also clarification. To above post…not just an electrical cord but a whole powerstrip attached to several was laying in puddle of water. I am also suspicious of infest in his family. Emotional most defoitely but there are bizarre physical boundaries or lack thereof and inappropriate sexualization of female members by male.I have heard my Ex’s father sexualize and talk about their neighbors young daughters playing baked in his house while he watched. He was drunk and rambling at a family event when I went to get my coat and leave because the drinking was out of hand. The neighbor girls and their parents had just left. My ex and his 11 years younger sister kiss lingeringly on the mouth and fondle each other publicly including her climbing in him shiftless at family Christmas morning celebration with her shirt pulls up over her bra asking for him to caress ber back. At one point he called me her name in a sexual situation. The very worst have thingg I have seen by far is what caused me to immediately move at the beginning of the year to Texas and swear to supervised visits. One morning after my ex had showed up to visit the baby the night before and had insisted on staying the night because his new electric car (mind you he ia neglecting child support at this point) couldn’t make it back home he claimed. The baby woke up early and he he volunteered to take over. I had let him stay in the guest room. I woke up a little later showered and went to go.get the baby to nurse. That is when I saw my ex in his underwear with an erection holding the baby with his back up against his crotch. He then said to me “he feels so good” . I did not show a reaction and took the baby and went into another room in shock. I Dod not allow him to be alone with him again and moved within a month. It took a long time for me to fully admit to myself much less anyone what i had seen. It was so shocking that I tried to rationalize it as a coincidnce but eventually came to terms. I knew not to leave the baby unattended with him and to get out of town without reacting and letting him know my plans to cut off most contact. This worked until April of this year when his family started putting pressure on him for visitation. Currently trying to mitigate the pitfalls of that and make sure everything is supervised. We were not legally married…the one thing my intuition guided me to do that I did, sonthat is a big plus as well as him not wanting to sign the birthcertificate. He has threatened to go to court if I don’t allow visits, so I have complied with his demands and hope that they do not escalate. He is very cheap when it comes to spending money on things other than material purchases for himself and impulsive in his wasteful spending on trivial things he wants so I doubt he will shell out money for a lawyer, but am still nervous. I wish I had gone to the police withmany of the incidents of abuse…especially when he tried to strangle me in a fight that happened just prior to memorial day 2013 while I was pregnant. I was in denial and was afraid and told only my family and his mother and opted for couples counseling at the urgingt of his mother. I really regret this and not heeding my intuition throughout the unfolding of the relationship. Hindsight is 20/20
I very much agree with Pos. He sounds very dangerous and it a wonder that you or the baby have not been tragically injured or worse yet. It is good that you have awaken to the danger he poses. I would recommend seeking out some legal advice on how to keep him and his family permanently away from you and your child. The danger is real and needs to be dealt with.
Lots of Love AGPT
Thank you AGPT
Hi survivormom he sounds like quite a dangerous psychopath.
They do fixate on people. If they like them, and then see fit to hold them captive like their possession. They see their partner as someone that they own. This man does sound dangerous.
@pr
Hope all is well. Things are good here.I was wondering if there is a way to send a private message to you via wordpress or some other way.
Thanks for the advice and insights. My family has already found a lawyer and I live in a different state, so that is good. It took me so long to get through the cognitive dissonance that resulted from being constantly gaslighted and manipulated with on again off again charm. He was so charming gentle amd sweet at the beginning of relationship and would bring that guy back whenever I left after periods of shunning, ignoring, and putting me down and having no consideration for my needs and feelings. It was a cat and mouse game to him. I read your blog about the mask of charm and charisma recently an he is most definitely a distempered type of sociopath. Very sadistic and controlling, but covertly so, so it was very crazy-making. There was a lot of passive agressive covert abuse and when I would call it out and get angry and emotional about he would get even more abusive in an overt way and the abuse became verbal an physical. I think this is how he reacted to losing control
Thanks for the advice and insights. My family has already found a lawyer and I live in a different state, so that is good. It took me so long to get through the cognitive dissonance that resulted from being constantly gaslighted and manipulated with on again off again charm. He was so charming gentle amd sweet at the beginning of relationship and would bring that guy back (the guy who I had been convinced was my soulmate, even though I had never previously believed in such a thing) whenever I left after periods of shunning, ignoring, and putting me down and having no consideration for my needs and feelings. It was a cat and mouse game to him. I read your blog about the mask of charm and charisma recently an he is most definitely a distempered type of sociopath. Very sadistic and controlling, but covertly so, so it was very crazy-making. There was a lot of passive agressive covert abuse and when I would call it out and get angry and emotional about he would get even more abusive in an overt way and the abuse became verbal an physical. I think this is how he reacted to losing control of me when I would wise up and confront him.
HI survivor mum, you sound like you have been through so much. To be with a sadistic psychopath is the most dangerous experience. I wonder how you are coping? Do you have signs or symptoms of Post Traumatic stress disorder and if so, are you getting treatment for it (as I wouldn’t be surprised if you did after what you have been through).
I think that I might have se PTSD , but am dealing well with it because when I was younger I was sexually assaulted (15 years ago) and learned to recognize the symptoms deal with that kind of thing back then through therapy. My baby is doing great and has been a source of positivity for me as I can focus on him and enjoy caring for him. The worst thing I have to deal with that brings up the ex issues is having to skype with J (my ex) when he feels like seeing the baby. I feel compelled to do this to placate him as well as offer visits supervised by my family if he ever chooses to come and visit (which he probably won’t) because I don’t want to deal with him filling or paternity and getting any legal rights. I know I am doing his out of fear, but I am hoping I can stall him for a while until I get on my feet and can move far far away, perhaps to another country. I don’t know if this is rational, but I get afraid and think of doing this when I sometimes lay awake at night and worry. Seeing him on skype really brings the anxious emotions and fear up, and anger. The emotional attachment to him is gone though, thank goodness! It is nice to just have the dread and fear only, as heartbreak intermingled with dread and fear was pretty chaotic and confusing.
One thing I would try is to gradually lose contact via Skype by setting my status to offline or better yet actually going offline(so as to not see his icon all the time) for long periods of time. If he confronts on this I would claim the responsibilities of parenthood are making it difficult to get any time for being at the computer. Hopefully, he will move on to the next target and forget about you. It sounds like he does not want to be a father and only keeps up contact because of his parents. Not being online might give him the cover to deflect his parents.
Agree that you don’t want to give him a reason to truly ask to the court that his parentage be established via testing. However, he knows if he goes that route the courts will also impose child support payments on him. From what you said of his miserly nature that should act as a large deterrent for him. I am sorry that you have to go through all of this.
Lots of Love AGPT
If I was successful in reducing contact and I did not hear from him in, say, 6 months I would then close my Skype account and establish a new one. If he contacted me in the future with his parental rights threats I would have my lawyer inform him that we would be seeking back due child support payments as part of the same proceedings in lump sum form. That should make him back up.
He is dangerous but you don’t have to have an inordinate amount of fear. He has now lost a primary advantage. You know what he is. The element of surprise is gone. You can take all appropriate steps to counter him. It sounds like you have a supporting family and they can prove instrumental in keeping you safe also.
I totally agree with AGPT idea. It will be hard but in the long run it will be wor it’s your safety if your child is the most important and I wouldn’t want this molester near my child. His behaviour is weird and I would never want that kind of person around my child.
I have a question for all. We have an ex friend who is married to a sociopath. He has disowned many of his family members and others come and go out of their lives because of his wife’s behaviour. Last night I was with family and we were talking about this women and man. I said that “he has disowned his own family as well because of her.” When my cousins husband replied “but he has his own family now.” To me, I don’t think this is right. I will always want my mum and dad in my life, even if I do have my own family. I just don’t think is is a positive way to think or live. When he said that I questioned that maybe I am not thinking right about family. Or maybe he isn’t from a close family and doesn’t understand. I have never been married or have kids so maybe I don’t understand but I wouldn’t want a partner to come into my life and I disown my family like a sociopath makes you do. These are blood relatives that will always be there for you and you need them more than anything when you end a relationship with a sociopath. Would love your honest thoughts about this.
Thanks for the advice about weaning off the contact. The problem is is that I maintained absolutely no contact Jan-April and then (I assume) his family urged him to start sending checks and demanding contact, which he chose to do through threats for legal action. I am afraid if he gains any legal rights then there might be the chance of unsupervised visits and even the far off chance of shares or partial custody. I NEVER want my son alone with either him or his family. He sent a check for May and June. I told him the June one got lost in the mail and don’t plan on cashing it and hope that he will stop sending the checks because he will want to keep the money in his account more than he will want to continue making demands. My parents took the baby to the zoo for a few hours with his parents and grandparents while we were visiting our family in Colorado with the baby this month to get the threats to stop. I don’t think they knew there were threats made (perhaps my Ex’s father, the patriarch sociopath urged him though?) and thought it was just a nice gesture. I guess I am just doing all this to avoid legal rights for my ex which will also dictate where I can live and prevent me from leaving the country or moving further away once he has them, as well as giving him possible unsupervised time with my son. It is really difficult and I can’t wait to just talk to the lawyer and get it all sorted out soon. This is in my mind constantly, and I always worried. Oh, I also always keep my status as invisible, but he has said every Sunday he wants to Skype and sometimes I say I can’t and have avoided it for a few weeks, but am afraid he will start with the threats again.
Please know you are among many Mom’s & indeed we are all survivors & warrior women 🙂
It’s an incredibly tough road but, know at some point it does get better but, it can take years….fight on for your eventual freedom.
Record every interaction & do what you have to do to keep yourself & your child safe. You are not alone, we are many & we are all thinking of you 🙂
Stay strong, keep going & never ever doubt you deserve better.
This is my first post. I’m a male victim of a female sociopath. I will not use her real name here, but will instead call her Laura.
Here’s how it started. In early February she emailed me on a well-known dating site. I was interested. She seemed perfect. She seemed to have it all — grace, charm, sophistication, style, elegance, intelligence, and wit. In her late 30s, she was exceptionally attractive – a real stunner, a 9 or a 10 physically. A short fit blonde. A trophy wife business type. The type of woman you would expect to see married to the CEO of a Fortune 500 company.
We had a lunch date in early February and immediately hit it off. A few days later we had drinks and she started kissing me as I was showing her to her car. A few days later we had our first “real” date. She wore a garter belt and stockings under her short skirt — articles of clothing she explained that could get a man to do anything she wanted. We had sex that night. I was a bit surprised by the way she dressed and by how nonchalant she was about our first sexual experience. She seemed to have an all-too-good understanding of how her appearance and sexuality could be exploited to get what she wants from men.
That was perhaps the first red flag. I discovered several other red flags over the course of several weeks. I asked her questions about her life. She explained that she had been divorced for about a year from a very wealthy and much older man who, as the story goes, had been paying for her to live in a condo in Southern California between 2007 and 2012 but, when he cut her off financially, she moved back to Las Vegas (where I live) and filed for divorce. She claimed to have been victimized in the divorce by her ex. She said her ex had hidden, gambled, or otherwise wasted all of his assets to assure she would get nothing in the divorce. Other than monthly child support, the court only required her ex to take out a $1 million life insurance policy on himself. The premiums are $8,000 every three months due to his age and poor health. She explained that if her ex stops paying the premiums the policy will lapse and she will get nothing. She stated that she was working on getting others to come up with the premium payments if her ex husband does not pay.
I asked what she did for a living. She explained that she does not work because: (a) she has a substantial “nest egg” she is sitting on; (b) her daughter is 7 and she wants to spend time with her; and (c) she takes her daughter back and forth each day to a school that is far away. She also explained that she was living in a house her parents inherited from her grandparents when they passed away so that her living expenses were cheap being limited to utilities, taxes, and insurance. She told me that, to make extra money, she sells things on several Facebook “yard sale” pages from her home. I later learned that she does this using a fake name that is very close to the last name of her last boyfriend, a wealthy and much older attorney. She justified her use of the fake name as a measure she needed to take to protect herself since strangers come to her house to pick up the things she sells on Facebook. I later learned that she has not worked for the last 12 years.
Other red flags.
She often would text me photos of herself. I noticed that some of them were not recent. In one picture she is actually wearing her ex boyfriend’s long sleeve dress shirt with nothing on underneath and the shirt unbuttoned. I thought it was very strange that she would send that to me.
She was ALWAYS on her smartphone texting and messaging people. Her convenient explanation was that since she sold things through Facebook, she was always messaging. But one night after she thought I was asleep, she got out of bed to go into the living room to sit on the couch and text someone. When I went out into the living room to see what she was doing, she was so startled that she nearly jumped off of the couch. She gave me some story about a male “friend” of hers being in town because his parents were dying.
One day a strange post appeared on her Facebook page. It looked like a post she had written. It said: “[Laura] is cutting deals and is full of surprises for everyone.” The post was directed to me and three of her male Facebook “friends.” About a half hour later she posted “password changed.” A little while after that, she deleted the posts. Later that evening when I asked her what that was all about she first acted like she did not know what I was talking about. Then she explained that someone who was formerly her friend who was no longer her friend had hacked her Facebook account and made the post. I did not push for a further explanation because I did not want it to escalate into an argument.
The Seduction Phase.
The seduction phase was amazing. She love-bombed me constantly. Sending me nice texts, making me dinner every night, and having lots of sex. She also came up with fun things for us to do with her daughter, who I bonded with. She asked me in subtle ways about my income and debts. We talked about getting married and buying our own house. Interestingly, she told me that one day her ex-boyfriend (the wealthy older attorney) had stopped by her house to beg and plead for her to get back together with him. I asked her what she said to him. She said she told him that she had moved on and that she no longer lives alone. His reply was something like “wow you move fast.”
Ruining.
In late March I was spending so much time with her that I moved all of my clothes and toiletries into her place. I was, for the most part, not living at my house. At about the same time, my mother who has cancer decided to sell her condo because she could no longer get up and down the stairs. I moved my mother into my house. After that occurred, Laura told me that I had let my 78 year old mother manipulate me into giving her my house, and that I should move her out into an apartment because she (Laura) needed to be the first priority in my life. I was so taken aback by these comments that it took me a few days to process them. During that time I was upset and distant, and she sensed it. That week I noticed she was taking a lot of new selfies and posting them on her Facebook page as her profile photo and that she was more focused on her appearance than normal. We had a follow-up conversation a few days later where I basically told her that I had known her for 3 months and my mother for over thirty years and she could be sure that my mother would come first. I also told her I was not sure that the relationship could continue, given the statements she made. And I brought up my suspicions that she was texting other men. She got angry and claimed that she would never do that. I apologized for accusing her of that since I had no real evidence that she was doing anything behind my back with other men. She had sex with me that night.
Discard #1.
Three days later on 5/24, after making me breakfast and telling me she loved me, she told me to move out seconds after he ex picked up her daughter for visitation at 10:00 a.m. I said “when do you want that to happen?” She said “right now.” I asked her to explain. The only explanation I got was my snoring was keeping her up at night, that she just “didn’t want this,” and that there were “a million other things.” I moved out and back into my house with my mom. I was crushed.
Not really sure what really prompted the discard.
We get back together.
Over the next several days I sent Laura several love letters and poems via email. I texted my undying love for her. I told her there was nothing I would not do if she would only take me back. I told her there was no insurance premium I would not pay if she would only take me back. On 6/3 I sent her a gigantic bouquet of flowers. She agreed to meet me so we could talk the next day. I met her and she said she loved me and wanted me back. I asked her what her concerns were. She said I needed to get surgery to correct my snoring. She said I needed to move my mom out of my house so I could sell my house and so she and I could get a bigger house together and be a family with her daughter. And she said I needed to pay off my credit card balance. I agreed to do all of these things.
We went out on a date then next night 6/5 to an expensive restaurant at the Wynn. Then, on 6/6, my birthday, I arrived at her place after work. She was wearing a long, blonde hair extension that I had never seen her wear before. It made her look over-the-top attractive, but in a very escort-ish sort of way. She took me to a Japanese restaurant in a strip mall. After dinner we went back to her place. After her daughter went to bed, she emerged from her bathroom wearing a Venetian-style mask, and a sexy black nightgown (hair extensions still in place). I stayed the night until the next morning, Saturday, 6/7. Then I left as planned because I had several things to do that day. I met my mom and brother for dinner and was done with them by 6:30 p.m., but the Soc. was not responding to my texts, and did not respond until well after 10:00 p.m. that night. This led me to believe she was out with someone else. The next day, Sunday, she invited me to spend the day with her at her parents’ house to swim in their pool. The day went well. After swimming we went to her place and I stuck around until 10 p.m. or so with her and her daughter. Then I went home to my house.
Each of the next four days, Monday through Thursday, she would text me in the late afternoon while I was at work and would invite me to come over to spend the evening with her and her daughter. Thursday 6/12, she had been out looking at houses for us to buy and sent me floor plans and photos.
Discard #2.
But when Friday 6/13 came around, she did not text me, did not invite me over, and did not respond to my texts until late that evening. When she did respond, she claimed she did not know I was expecting to hear from her. I was pissed because she had completely blown me off. I sent her a text that pointed out that we had spent every other evening that week together and that I thought that would continue. The text was pointed but not rude or nasty. I also said that it seemed obvious that she either did not want to see me that evening or that she had something better to do.
She did not respond at all the next two days (Saturday 6/14 or Sunday 6/15).
I sent her an email on Monday 6/16 saying that I thought we were back together and working things out. She responded by deflecting the conversation away from her having blown me off on 6/7 and 6/13 and accused me of not being “able to stay away from” the female paralegal I work with and often go to lunch with. (I had told her weeks ago that I do this and that it was strictly platonic). Since this was an outrageous statement and false, I responded and told her so. [False jealousy?] She replied with an email that said only that she was “exhausted of trying to teach [me] what boundaries are in every area of [my] life.” Nevertheless, I told her that I would stop having business lunches with the paralegal if that would make her feel better. I found this site that day, 6/16. Thank God. I have been reading it every day.
We had no communication on Tuesday 6/17. I did, however, keep my appointment with the snoring doctor, who did not recommend surgery.
On Wednesday 6/18, I texted her and asked her how she could tell me she loved me one day and then stop communicating with me the next. I told her I was working on all of the issues she identified, the snoring, my mother, and the credit card balance. She responded by referring to the “nasty” text I had sent her on 6/13, saying that she was “sick of the drama” I had created any the “emotional fragility” I displayed when I could not reach her the prior Friday evening 6/13 or the Saturday evening a week before that 6/7. She said: “I’m done” and that “Love should not be so difficult. I’m exhausted.”
I feel like she discarded me this time because she did not have a good explanation for blowing me off on 6/7 and 6/13 or did not want to be honest and tell me that she was out with someone else.
Aftermath
I feel like my heart has been ripped out and discarded like trash. The pain has been absolutely awful. I’m a sensitive guy, so this really hurts bad. I have been unable to sleep and have been crying every day. I have a knot in my stomach that will not go away. I thought she was the love of my life. I thought we were going to get married and have a family. Those dreams have all been crushed. I look at her pictures but it only makes it worse.
In hindsight, I believe she has no “nest egg” (that this was a lie — otherwise why sell stuff out of your garage on Facebook?) and that she is simply searching for a man with a good income that she can exploit.
I have been struggling with no contact. I made it a day 6/20, and then broke down, sending her emails on 6/21 and today 6/22 professing my love for her and writing her love poems. Fortunately I have not heard back from her. I see she is active again on the dating sites, no doubt searching for her next victim. I have read this site from top to bottom. My head knows she’s wrong for me. But my heart does not. I am afraid that if she called me and said “come over,” that I would do just that. In my mind she was the perfect woman, but now the mask has come off and I have to keep telling myself that it was all a lie, that it was not real. I have to know that if she is kind to me that it is not kindness, only an act to hide her lies and rage.
Thanks for this wonderful site. It is so helpful to have some clarity on these issues.
Stay Strong. No Contact is hard at first but once removed from the whirlwind for awhile you will be able to see things in a much clearer light. Take it from another target of a female socio who is about 9 months out.
You already have pointed out many red flags but other elements of your story point to even more. When the emotions subside, your logic and reasoning coupled with the knowledge gained from this site will make even more things clear. There will come a day you will look back and ask yourself ” What was I smoking?”
True love doesn’t generally ask you to get your finances in order or not take care of your filial responsibilities to make it blossom. It sounds like you just dodged a bullet although I fully understand it doesn’t feel that way now. Again stay strong and try to maintain no contact.
I have posted before- when I first found this site. I have continued to read comments, but hAve struggled with my own situation. I find similarities and also sometimes feel like my ex Is also different. I am at a point where I feel like I’m ready to move on. But with no one who understands (offline) except his mother… I am in need of an outlet.
I often wonder if many of your ex’s have an actual diagnosis. Or if they are just terrible people. Sometimes I feel like my situation is different because he has an actual diagnosis, and we are all aware. Sometimes he is in denial, and other times I’ve sat in the floor and cried with him… because he tries to change- and always submits to the urges.
It’s been nearly two years. The first year I was a victim, in the dark… constantly let down, and then he would make up for it and make me forget all the pain. He is a socio to the “T” but when his mom sat me down and showed me some books, and explained his diagnosis… things changed. I have been through 2 suicide attempts with him, one on birthday. Later to find out the reasons he was trying to end his life– were crimes he committed while I was not around.
He is currently in jail. Awaiting a sentence to prison. Possibly 8 years. I believe he deserves to go… But I’m still heart broken. It’s hard because I’m on the “inside” he knows I won’t fall for his games. And also that I love him unconditionally. In the first year, he took me for money… once aware of his mental state- he paid me back in full. He confides his most terrible crimes to me. Nothing violent. Mostly conning people out of large sums of money.
He owned his own house, paid in full. Comes from a wealthy family. 2 vehicles paid off. Very smart. Responsible. Took very good care of his home and dogs. Did a lot for me. Had a ton of friends. Best sense of humor. And loves the best way he can. Even without empathy, he always tried. He is good looking, well kept. But he got on drugs- and all the control he had over his disorder went to shit.
Now that he is in jail and sober…. he is back to being who I fell in love with. Still running games in jail I’m sure. But working in there, applied for welding school, and not getting in trouble. Everyone has had enough of his crap, so his mom and I are his only contact. I have kids- so twice a month I visit him- when they are with their dad.
I am very responsible. Never even had a ticket. Worked for the same company since I was 19, ( 28 now) raise 2 kids with no family, or financial/gvmt help. Even the guards at the jail joke with me, asking if I’m lost. Sometimes I think I just hang on bc it’s easier than being alone. But I am alone. But at least he’s someone to talk to. I have great friends, work at a local bar ( like cheers) during the day. Those people are like family. But mostly everyone thinks I let him go a year ago.
I’ve recently started ignoring his collect calls. I just feel like he needs me, but can offer nothing. Originally he was offered 2 years- which would be less than a year with his time already served. Part of me thinks I wouldn’t even wait that long,, Def not 8! His mom and I cleaned out his house and selling it. I’ve done so much. And because i wanted to. But now I don’t want to do all this work. But I do love him. Makes it so hArd when he does bad things to others, that morally I don’t agree with. But has never said a bad word towards me. Once we apologized for our past problems, we have never done wrong to each other.
There is a chance his charges could be dropped, and he could be home soon. He has made a lot of changes, and wants to go back to therapists regularly when he gets out. He totally accepts how his brain works. And is smart enough to control it. Just sometimes chooses to lose control. Especially when frustrated with his disorder. Everything on these sites/books says to run! But if a sociopath accepts who he is, and tries to be good- isn’t he worth loving?? I have made many mistakes in my life. And have loved many people, including myself, with addictions… Sometimes dating a sociopath is like that for me. He relapses, and tries again.. the first 100 pages of the book “emotional vampires” I really related to.
Part of me is ready to let go. But part of me thinks he can change… with therapy that he’s willing to take. And a supportive family who doesn’t take any of his games. But there’s such a risk he will let us all down. But he loves his control- and if he ever gets in trouble again, he will be gone for good. Might I add, the only crimes he got caught for were when he was using methamphetamine, when we were broken up for a few months. His other crimes were more of cons, where he talked people into giving him property or money.
Back and forth, I go. So hard to love someone like this. All these stories about them abandoning you… Sometimes make me think would be easier. I am resilient. Very strong. I was hurt after the first year, before I was aware of the aspd. But I moved on. No contact was easy. I even dated someone else for a couple months. But somehow I changed from a victim to a confidante. And get to see the real him. Vulnerable and scary. But he trusts me. He even signed over power of attorney of all his assets, because he knew I would be fair.
But a life with him will always be work…. But sometimes I think it could possibly be worth it…. and then somewhere deep down, I know this is wrong. I’m not the type of girl to visit jails, bond people out, put up with a criminal. Or at least I wasn’t. And I never want my boys to think what he’s done is okay. Everyone has a past…. sorry so long, just at a loss. Even if I move on, I’m worried I will drop them as soon as he gets home. Or what if he gets out and becomes the man he wants to be— I will have done all this work, and wasted all this time, if I choose to give up now. I just keep waiting until I KNOW the answer… that’s why I continue to read this site, read books, watch shows about aspd.
Anyone else been with a sociopath who acknowledges his diagnosis, and works hard to change it? Or still mess up and try again???
It is funny that you write this comment today, as I was writing a post about this earlier today. I can really understand and relate to what you are saying. Sociopaths can form very strong attachments to someone if they value that person. This attachment and bond can become stronger, if they feel that the other person understands, and accepts them for who they are. if additional to this they have an indepth understanding of what they are, of who they are, they absolutely can try to ‘manage’ their behaviour.
You should know, that while yes, they can be protective of you, even obsessive of you, possibly care about you, more than anyone else ever has, it will always be dramatic, there will always be jealousy, control, often dominance, and the patterns of behaviour will continually repeat. He might not ever scam you, or do anything to you. However, be warned if you try to leave him and he doesn’t want this, you will see a different side.
If you are not taking his calls and are going no contact, I am surprised, that he didn’t flip and accuse you of seeing someone else etc etc… I have done exactly the same, the sociopath is still around in my life, and although I am going to be away for a week, when I return I am going to change direction with this blog. I wont change the things that I have written, but for the last year, he has worked, and has paid me back money that he owed me. He understands himself now. It doesn’t particularly change the way that he is. It can be incredibly hard work. But then – so can dating a non sociopath also. If the sociopath has respect for you, and they don’t for many people, they can treat you right – the danger is the flip side, which is ALWAYS there. It never goes away. It is sometimes like a sleeping dragon and you just know that the same thing will come around again.
Since writing this blog (and he read every word – because he is nosy and likes to keep tabs) he has tried to turn his life around. But – really he will never just be a ‘normal guy’ that isn’t realistic. He has some qualities that normal guys don’t have, nobody else would have my back like he does. As his connection to me, isn’t particularly based on ’emotions’ in some senses it is more stable, as it is based upon what is in his mind. With a regular guy they can just fall ‘out of love’ as long as the sociopath is mentally challenged, and accepted for who they are, they can still feel deeply attached to their partner.
You might want to read the posts can a sociopath love? and the other post can a sociopath love part 2 the sociopaths response, as there are a lot of comments from sociopaths who say their point of view.
Also, sociopaths are selfish, and manipulative. This is just in their nature. They like to be in control and to win. Is he still using drugs? I would be very wary around a sociopath with drug issues. They can be the most manipulative of all.
Really the questions you need to ask yourself are these:
How do you feel about yourself when you are around this person, how does he make you feel about you? (write those answers down)
Are you growing yourself with him in your life, or is your entire life focused upon his continual drama that he creates?
Is this a healthy relationship for your children – and how would they be affected?
I don’t have children at home, so my life it is just me affected. It isn’t easy at all. But then on the flip side, sometimes it is – incredibly so. You just never know what is going to come next. Sometimes it is problems in life, continually for no reason at all. Just that is the way that they are, and what they seem to attract. They have a low boredom threshold. So create drama just to stir things up.
With you, I think I would be more concerned about the impact on your children. Does this feel right to you? How do you really feel about it. So yes, in the last year the sociopath around in my life (for exactly a year now) has worked hard, he works long hours, he does try to amend his behaviour – doesn’t do things like stealing or being manipulative, he just works. But he does constantly have his dramas which I get tired of sometimes.
Wouldn’t it be a concern that their new behaviors are potentially just reflective of a new pathway of manipulation? and they are still seeing you as a source of supply, just from a different angle?
Reading this answer from you positiva to Kadeednice i have to admit that i felt a little confused. The impression that i got is that you say that you are stil in contact with the sociopath in your life and he now tries to make amendments to you and be a good person? if this is true i have to say that it is very interesting as what is stated in this blog is No Contact with these people. And if this guy is really around you playing the one that he tries to compensate then i can say that he is a master manipulator and he found the way to get onto you again despite all the deep undertanding that you have for this kind of severe pathology. i had a similar experience with the psycopath in my life that when i diagnosed him and he realised that he could not hide anymore he tried to play his last card that i am his confidant and he has a special attachment and relation to me. i knew always and it was evident during the 6 years of our relatonship that he valued and respected me as a person and as a woman more than any other in his life. He still does and always will as he incredilbly values me mentally. BUT this was not enough so to not deceive me in the most despicable way. And when i exposed him and confronted him with his deeds in a way not emotional and i played him in his game , he realised that he could not hide any more and that his lies were over. So then and only then he admitted his pathology . He always knew what he is and by this he tried to manipulate me and keep me in his life PLAYING THE CARD that only me can understand him , only me can stand by him mentally and bla, bla , bla.. well, all these were completely BS as me having the luck to have distance by him , i could see clearly through all his manipulation tactics. What is the reality is that i always presented a challenge to him due to my independed personality and after me diagnosing him and abandoning him, i became a bigger challenge so he had to conquer me all over again.
BUT i never went back though sometimes the confusion that he would create through his lies and tricks and fakery was not easy for me to clear. So if my initial assumption is right conserning your particular case, the only thing that i say is that after you created this blog that immensely helps every day so many victims of psycopaths/ sociopaths , you became a great challenge also for yours. So he would go to great lengths to have any impact in your life. And for sure he will try to play on your empathy and the ability to forget and forgive. Especially if he was a charismatic one and there was not emotional abuse, except of lying , stealing and smearing you. He tries to pay back the money that he stole for you in the first place? he works? great manipulation tactic indeed. He knows what would apply well for you. They are master manipulator and the best liars .That is only my prespective of course and i am not neither judgemental nor anything negative to you. Just a little anxious and confused i think. However , everybody makes his one desicions in life and has his one path.
Apart from the experience coming from the victims is very well stated from the ones that are top in reseach for them , how potentially dangerous these people can be for normal human beings with a conscience. Hare himself and a lot of top psychiatrists where conned by them and they had no emotional connection with them. And there is no treatment for them, they never change, this is told by the experts.
I dont think they are evil , and it doesnt make any difference how somebody labels them, evil, bad, disordered, sufferers, pitiful e.t.c. They are what they are , people without empathy , without consciense, so capable of anything. That alone speaks for itself.
By them….all of THEM….. we are OBJECTIFIED treated as a THING to USE…….what story do you tell yourself to make it ok for ANYONE to MISTREAT you?.
@agoodplantoday, it is always a concern. But less of a concern than you’d probably think. Maybe I should be more concerned, but oddly enough… I trust him in a different way than I do others. Without solid emotion- he says what he knows to be true, and actually admits to previous wrongdoings. He doesn’t make promises like he used to- because it’s his actions I look for. He has cut out everyone but his mom, myself, and his lawyer. That in itself is a major accomplishment. Time will tell.
@positivagirl, thank you for the response. The first one I totally relate to. As soon as I learned what aspd was- it was as if I had this craving to know EVERYTHING about it. And you never hear the other side. What a sociopath is like when they trust you. I have never met anyone like him. In both good and bad ways. But I will focus on the good today.
I did end up answering yesterday. He does not accuse me of anything when I don’t answer. He knows I’m busy with the kids. And work. He trusts me. He also knows it’s $5 per call, and if I don’t have anything to talk about, I will wait a day or two before answering. Gives me time to think, without his input. But I will admit, after answering, it is usually the best 20 min of my day.he has only shown thankfulness. Esp when I go to visit him. Does not ask for favors, or money, just happy that I have hung on. Now, I’ve had my breaking point also. And there’s times I have lost it. But ive made peace with the situation, and take it day by day. Sometimes minute to minute.
As far as drugs go, he has been clean almost 120 days… But that’s because he is in jail. His usage was mostly due to who he hung out with. He stayed clean anytime he was with me, but if drugs were around him- he’d do them with others. This will hAve to be discussed further soon his release. And coming from a daughter of 2 addicts- he knows I won’t put up with it any longer. All his usage was done in his garage- and that house is sold now. I truly believe he did drugs out of boredom, and they enhanced his personality disorder in the worst way possible. Thus, him getting “3 hots and a cot” since January.
How does he make me feel about myself?
He makes me feel special. He makes me realize things I never have about myself. I have been raising my kids alone since they were born. Non socios can walk out too. My mom committed suicide when I was 17- and 5months along with my oldest. My dad recovered crack cocaine addict, 3 years. He is my best friend and confidante. I had an amazing childhood- things fell apart when I was 15 or so. I’ve always felt resilient, and strong. But eventually life caught up and I isolated myself. Then I met j. I knew him for 6 years as a customer at the bar I work at. But he rarely drank. I don’t either- so we always chatted. Looking back, he saw me as the perfect victim. But something changed.
He builds me up, never cuts me down. Has never called me outside of my name. I have suffered from anxiety off and on for years- it’s gone with him. I feel protected and loved. Sometimes I think we work because I am SO emotionally driven, and he is driven off rational thinking. Although sometimes irrational actions ensue.
J makes me feel like a better me. He accepts my past, my children, and keeps me laughing. I used to think he was necessary to be that girl again. And then he went to jail. And I’ve learned to be that girl without him. Enjoying my life. I always know when I’m going off course- I stop writing, and stop listening to music. While he’s been gone, I’ve really indulged in those things, reading also. He is not the center of my life, that spot is taken.
As far as the kids go, he was always great with them. Teaching them things. One moment stands out for me, my kids were outside and I was getting onto my oldest. He tells me later that he thought I played favorites… And then it hit me…. I do. And I’ve learned to be more fair. He calls it like he sees it. And I am very blunt as well. The kids know him as my friend. I am very careful with that. He has many requirements before coming back in their life. They don’t even know he’s gone from their lives, because I didn’t let them around him very often. As with anyone I date… dating a single mom means taking a backseat.
I struggle with him being a role model. But aside from the petty crimes and drug use, he is a good man. Those things are such a small part of the amazing man he can be. His mom and I always say, he has the power to brighten or ruin your whole day by one sentence. Lots of choices to make.
Got a call this morning from his mom. Looks like he will be out next Friday. While I’m excited to hug him, and not have to look at him through glass. I’m worried it’s too soon.
I tend to ramble. But that’s the emotion in me. Even if no one understands,I’ve learned with him… I have to make my own choices. It’s easy for friends or outsiders to say I sound dumb. But no one knows the lessons he’s taught me. Funny how someone who can’t feel love, can teach someone how to do it.unconditional love is hard. Esp when the conditions are so daunting…
Kadeednise, of course he makes you feel well about yourself and your anxiety is gone and you feel better for yourself and very special. This is called mirroring , the first and best technic used from the sociopaths to gain love , attachment and blind trust from their victims and keep them entangled in their web for ever. This is mind control whether they do it consciously or not. Every victim of sociopath/psycopath has experienced that and this is the reason that all of us are here in the first place. You cannot see it becouse you are emotionally attached to him so this blurres your vision . You will see it only when you establish No Contact with this guy.
i believe that the reason why he has only you and his mother in his life is that you are the only ones who still can be manipulated by him, all the others probably left as who would like to keep in touch for long with somebody who continually steals and goes to jail?
if you see it for what it is without emotions as he would do , this man is a criminal, pettty criminal but a criminal. The fact that he has an official diagnosis of ASPD does not make the situation better , it makes it worse becouse it means that he will never recover from this. If you want to
spend your life and expose your children in this kind of pathology becouse you feel pity for him and becouse you love him unconditionally it is your choice as you are a grown up woman. But only the fact that you come in this site and ask questions in my opinion says that you are not happy in this kind of situation. Maybe you should try to find proffesional help as of what you say you had a difficult upbringing yourself , so it makes for him more easy to manipulate your vulnerabilities and keep you attached..
About the thing that he sees clearly becouse he doesnt have emotions, so he can see the truth.. so what? in which way this makes him superior? becouse he can tell you in a harsh way that you are different with your children? since when humans have to become robots and act without any emotional element in their behaviors? the relationship that you have with any of your boys has its own dynamic placed on who you are and who your boys are . You knows better than you ? the sociopath? Why to take his opinion as the ultimate truth? you know what ? becouse he continioned you to do this, as the Psycopath in my life has done the same with me, until i woke up for good.
And in my case also he was also diagnosed psycopath and when i unmasked him he tried to impose exactly the same tactic as yours in me, telling i am the confidant the only person that can support him and other BS. Total manipulation. i realised it fast and i got away thank God. Easy? not at all, hell but it worthed it.
If you want to live a safe life just go NC, both from him and his mother, she influences you badly as she tries to keep you in his life becouse she loves her son and she wants him not to be alone. And the reason why he doensnt press you to answer his phones or texts and he is so patient is becouse he doesnt care. He is devoid of emotion he feels no emotional pain, he doesnt miss any human being in the way that a normal person does. He needs people but not as fellow human beings to connect with and to make bonding but to use them for his needs, as company e.t.c.So dont make the mistake that i had made for years , and dont project your empathy on him. These people dont create relationships , they create captives. sorry for the long post and sorry if i come out harsh and strict but i see in your story so many similarities with mine that all came out so easy and i hope not brutal . It is my hardly earned knowledge through my own horrible experiences with a true psycopath, not just a bad person.
Wow! Two powerful posts. Thank you so much for sharing your experience and insight.
Lots of love AGPT
hey guys its real nice guy, sorry i haven’t posted with you guys in a while but im a musicain and am pretty busy in the summer.since i spoke to my sociopathic girlfriend a few weeks ago and told her that i was seeing a schrink regarding how to deal with coping with a sociopathic relationship..she has not said anything abussive to me, she has actually become that sweet loving person that i fell in love with 3 years ago, however i am still seeing wreckless behavior on her part…im making a decision to stay close to me and do the things that will make me better, so that i never become falsely emotionally attached, she has explained to me how her past as a child has affected her decisions and decision making. i am making a decision to forgive . but its not so easy to forget ..when we go out i am getting a sence that she wants to do something else..meaning try someone else so i have to keep myself in a position of (close friendship.)and its kind of working out,,she was right about one thing..sociopaths are very successful people because they dont relate to any emotion in their decision making so they are very confident and forthright.even though it may hurt someones feelings they make a decisison based on facts and results…..i hate to say this but i have begun to consciencously practice doing this as well , a nd i must tell you it works, of course its not my intention to allow myself to become emotionally attached from the world but im thinking a little more about me and not what makes other people happy ……to all of you my brothers and sisters who like i have fallen prey to these people keep in the back of your mind that there is a problem that exists and the only way to resolve issues is to talk about it IF YOU CAN. i made my sociopath promise to always communicate no matter whats going on SAY WHAT IT IS LETS COME TO A QUICK RESOLUTION AND CONTINUE ON…..LIFE IS TOO SHORT….. stay in touch guys and that goes for me too
Ok, I need consult here. I have been lying to myself about my boyfriend. First I must mention that virtually no one, not my kids or my friends really like him He comes off a lot like an arrogant jerk. My family has tried to find good in him because I have been so happy and they were so happy that I was no longer severely depressed from my divorce 2 years ago. He has also been married 3 times previously so I thought they were prejudice against him. But of course I said he is really so sweet to me yada yada. He came on initially so strong and of course charming and full of flattery (I mean even I know I am not all that!).l would wonder, am I really THAT great??? His dream girl, perfect partner etc. I even overlooked the fact that he lied about his previous girlfriend and she contacted me to tell me he was actually still seeing her! He said she was a depressed psycho, but that psycho seemed to know a lot about me and tried to tell me he is a dishonest cheat. He seems to be emotionally close to no one (except of course me). Not even his family all of whom he seems to dislike. I ignored the warning signs that he has no conscience. He once broke up with a girl on prom day. He didn’t actually tell her though….he just didn’t show up to take her to the prom because he found someone else that afternoon. For some reason he thought this was very funny. He left his first wife “because she was crazy” he said. Just took the daughter and left her to her emotional disorder. The second wife was “an abusive alcoholic” and the third he married “because he was lonely and they were friends.” Ninety percent of the time we have “the perfect relationship” but the other ten percent he will flip on a dime and become some confusing, hyper person who seems delusional about what we are actually fighting about! He says I make him “want to be a better person” which I now realize translates into morphing himself into what is acceptable to me. I thought he was changing but he was really getting better at his acting. So anyhow, this previously-thought cliche’ soul mate will put up one last good try to maintain this relationship as he has now invested the better part of a year…lots of time and energy and he will be pissed. I am changing the locks on my house and trying to figure out how I will get past the loneliness of the next few days…with drawl from his constant affections and not drop into a major depression in the future and realize I made the mistake of my life. Today I called his ex-wife (third) and she validated a lot of my fears. She asked me “what is it he wants from you?” He always has a purpose for choosing who he does. For her he needed a mother for his young daughter. Am I going crazy?? Am I imagining all of these things? I feel like I am losing my mind!
just no you are not crazy. your instinct is kicking in and telling you what you need to do. follow your gut its taking you in the right direction. it is normal to grieve and feel depressed when something turns out to be something its not. it would be abnormal for you not to feel what you are feeling. in time youll be ok. give it time and do your research on this topic. i think you already know your answer. your doing the right thing.
@Christine, you are not losing your mind, you are regaining it…as I read your words I remember clearly how confusing they can be, buy a big lock and get him out of your life.
I agree with No More Insanity. With a lot of help from this site, I have regained my life. The Spaths we are/were all involved in are confusing people and like to make us think we are crazy. To them, we are crazy cause they don’t know what the feelings like love, hurt etc is or what it feels like to receive affection or want attention (not in a needy way lol). It takes a long time to regain the sanity that you once knew.
Get rid of your Spath! I tell you, as someone who has almost completely recovered, life is so wonderful without them. I no longer think twice about what kind of person I am. I am happier and have no need to want to contact him. Of course, I wonder what he is doing, but he is just a sick human being and I can walk away and know that I am a decent human that knows that love shouldn’t be about how much I can give him or how much I understand him. He only wanted someone who could “understand him” and not many will. “Understand him” in giving him what he needs at that point in his life. I came in when he needed money.
When we met, I was a nice, quiet, calm, kind person. He saw that and took advantage of it. BUT now, guess what, I once saw that as an “easy target” but now I look at it as, I was such a wonderful person and he saw that. So maybe we can turn it around as a positive thing. I no longer feel like I need to prove to him what kind of wonderful person I am as, someone that loves me, should already know that.
Sorry, I didn’t mean to go on about myself LOL. Keep up with doing positive improvements in your life. A good start is changing locks!
@ Mariagon67 🙂
I think you know what you have to do but, you have lived with such control in your life that you unwittingly become an enabler 😦
Sadly I did this with my 1st husband & I get trying to fix him & make it all go away. I sat for years just confused & disabled to leave for many years.
To be honest, if he hadn’t left I would probably still be there.
I was the type that stayed stuck & even though I knew it was wrong, I still stayed.
I cannot tell you what to do but, in hindsight I wish I’d had the courage to leave & value myself & my journey more.
If it has come to stalking via recording you then that is indeed very disordered thinking at play.
I never had that level of control thank god & I think that if someone hacks your emails, your phone & stalks you when out etc…is more a dangerous mindset. That’s malicious & sadistic behaviour.
We all have a right to live freely without being watched & listened in on.
Mariagon, I think it’s time you escaped that madness & find your freedom. He has imprisoned you in your own life & that’s awful.
Open the cage door & find your freedom if you can?It is not easy but, it is worth it as you are worth it 🙂
The key is in your hand & always has been. Take back your power 🙂
PR i think i didn’t explain myself correctly. I cant fix him wont even try i need to fix and heal myself. My question was basically, i found the recorder on there there are conversations with my friends that I had personal to them and also conversations with my sons. stuff they confided to me. Do i confront him with this because i know he will be the kind to approach one of them (my friends or sons) and say that i confided in him something they said to me in confidence. I know this would be part of a smear campaign. i mean he has his family believing we are separated because i cheated on him (not true) he still lives at home. IDC what his family believes they knew what he was as i found out much later that he had been in a psychiatric institute for 1 month when he was 18. Way before i met him. and they never warned me.
they left me to deal with him on my own. should i warn my friends and sons about recorder although one son saw it. or do i just confront him and have him delete it all? or do i just let him continue his game until the lawyer gets me the restraining order? it just makes me sick that he has porno on his phone and local dating pages and he thinks he has the right to record conversations on our dining room table. innocent everyday life conversations..i am angrier than ever and more determined to get him out of my life i cant leave as this is my apt my furniture and my stuff and our son lives here although i keep him and the other ones as far away from this as possible..thank you for listening Maria
Hi Maria 🙂
I sent a reply as @maria so, please scroll through & find it 🙂
So many threads on this post so, hard to find comments 😉
PR xoxo
Thank you. Enjoyed your response and also really related. These are all thoughts I’ve had and struggled with. Not much time to respond but I have stopped accepting calls. I also opted out of going to visit at the jail tonight… First time in 8 weeks that I haven’t driven out there. Actually reading my own posts helped me come to this conclusion… And your response to me validated my decision. Thank you for taking the time to write such a long post
@kadeedenice
i am glad if anything of what i wrote helped to give you strength in any way dealing with this kind of pathology. i apologise again if ia came out a little harsh. Of what i read in your posts you seem to be a strong , intelligent and capable woman having raised by yourself 2 children that you gave birth at the very young age of 19. Being a mother myself i am sure that they are the light of your life. You are very young and you deserve to have a beautyful and fulfilling life being the model of your sons. if you finally decide to go NC permanently with this guy know that in the begining it is going to be hard. It will be like you break an addiction. You are going to need all your emotional and cognitive reserve plus much of support of your friends. If you can not have proffesional help from a specialist , at least confide to a close , empathetic and trust worthy friend who will be able to keep you strong in your weak moments. But , i tell you , you will succeed in the end as far as you are determined to heal . Even if it means that for some time you will be without an intimate partner , i think it is better to be stable and sane and happy with your children than to have the stress and drama of a disorder individual in your life. And when yiu will be free from this addiction and back to yourself and when you will seek the least for a relationship , then it will be the best time to let someone in your life who shares the same values with you, who has emptathy and who has his concsience and not his disordered ego as a navigator through life. These kind of people make good life partners even though sometimes appear to be in the begining less charming and less adventourous than the textbook psycopath. Lots of love and have strength in your journey back to yourself.
@Mariagon67 🙂
Sorry that I lost the thread of your story & thought he was still living with you.
I think you would best ask your lawyer & see what they suggest re the recording? It’s a huge invasion of privacy but, I am not sure what you can do. You have the recorder so, that’s evidence but, how to prove he put it there is another problem & naturally he will deny it.
I would probably tell those that were also recorded or spoken about so, that they are aware of this happening & that he has been privy to personal conversations & information.
He’s such a pig to do that anyway!
I hope you get far far away from his ridiculous behaviour soon as he will be loving the game. They don’t care what they do as they lack conscience & empathy so, for him it’s no problem to do this.
For you it’s more stress & anxiety & that’s the aim of the game. Keep you confused, anxious, stressed & on his chain that he yanks when he’s bored!
I am thinking of you as you don’t deserve this ongoing drama & upsetting behaviour. Remember that is what this is designed to do, control & manipulation purely for his self serving egotistical desires!
Please know you are not alone & you deserve peace & you can have it.
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
PR you are right he is still living with me he wont leave and to just ask him to leave he wont do it without a scene. My therapist is helping me through victim services to get the order of protection and legal advice. He has come on to my therapist and even my family doctor(sexually) but very subtly. They both tell me he is a predator but I have to be careful even for them because if he perceives them as a threat or knows they are helping me he will cause a scene in their place of business. I know they can call the police, but still I feel they shouldn’t have to deal with this they have patients there who should not be exposed to this. He has the recorder, when I saw it I left it there because by taking it , it would of led to a confrontation and my grandchildren were expected any minute, And understand in all of this he still says to my face he loves me and cant live without me to which I never reply. I don’t even look him in the face cause I know I will loose control and he still thinks its ok to have sex I am tired of running around the house telling him to get away from me. of course he does this when my son is not at home and I will never tell them because I wont put them in the middle. I am just so tired.
Thank you from the bottom of my heart for listening
PR ..hope all is well I went to my therapist yesterday and she gave me a test. I scored very high on the test she says I am an HSP (highly sensitive person) its sensory processing sensitivity. Have you ever heard of this?
Pr doesn’t run this site Marion 😦 Neither is she, or ever has been admin on this site.
hey guys realniceguy , i need to get regular again.. my socio and i went out last night,,she really cant help herself ….we stopped to go to a restaurant last night after a wonderful show and a couple of younger guys walked up not even paying attention to her …..BUT SHE HAD TO MAKE HERSELF IMBARRASSINGLY AVAILABLE…WHICH I PLAYED OFF AS ANOTHER DISPICABLE DISPLAY OF (will somebody please notice me i:ii do anything) one of the guys turned to me and jokingly sarcastingly saying (HEY MAN SHE PUT IT OUT THERE) I DO REALISE THAT SHE:LL PROBABLY NEVER STOP WITH THIS HORR IBLE SELF DEFEATING DEPLEATION OF SELF WORTH….. but you have to remember . they grew up this way..your dealing with a sickness..and as sane as they believe they are//// they cant change…..i really tested her at the end of the evening….i informed her that a friend of mine was coming over to meet me at her house…she almost couldn:t contain herself with anticipation…so as i watched her undress and make sure that she was good and naked under her clothes… she said lets go outside and sit till your friend gets here..low in behold i cancelled him comming by.(.you know i said to myself…that this will never change . do i really need somebody so badly in life that I tolerate these HORRIBLE DISPLAYS OF SEXUALLY OVEREXPOSING HERSELF SO SHAMELESSLY TO NOT ONLY MY FRIENDS, BUT EVERYBODY SHE MEETS,thankfully my heart is in the right place this time….she:s got to do a whole lot better than sending ms game requests … anyway in recently checking she:s fathfully on her social media websites looking for another victim…you know she:s really a brilliant beautiful person…but like a drug addict needing his fix . he just caves in instead of trying……I WILL NEVER ALLOW MY FRIENDS TO EVER GO TO HER HOUSE ….TO BE HUMILIATED BY A SEXUAL DISPLAY OF THIS SORT …BE CAREFUL BUT DONT DECIEVE YOURSELVES…IF THEY CANT CALL YOU AND SAY HI HOW ARE YOU TODAY OR. INVITE YOU TO SOCIAL EVENTS BELIEVE ME ….THEY DONT THINK YOUR GOOD ENOUGH….SO UNDERSTAND WHAT YOUR DEALING WITH AND KEEP YOUR HEAD AND HEART AT A SAFE DISTANCE
Is your heart really in the right place? If it was I think you would show the caring you show her to yourself first. As much as it hurts, you have to worry about yourself first and stop trying to fix her. Go NC and find someone worthy of your love and attention.
Getting to the point of being able to go NC often takes a buildup of energy and time. It can be difficult to muster the required energy to try to break the addiction. It took me weeks after uncovering her deception to round up my own reserves. I did not want it to be true. I was having trouble getting my head around all the new soc info and how she fit it to a tee. At a dinner one night I asked her questions that I knew the answers to and she lied right to my face and even when pressed did not back off the lies. I knew right then it was true and what I had to do. It made me sick inside but I resolved to do it.
Getting distance allowed my energy to return and a gradual further lifting of the veil. But it was only by really doing true No Contact, none whatsoever, that allowed me to regain myself and see things clearly.
She managed to sneak a pity laden SMS past my call blocker about 10 days ago (first contact in 4 months). It churned my emotions up for days and I had to return here to read others and my own writings to re-balance myself. I maintained NC and even went and changed my phone number so it doesn’t happen again.
I hope my response above did not appear harsh. I truly understand how hard it can be to let these people go. But now I also realize the benefits of doing so. I wish you strength and my best prayers for your journey.
I had an on and off relationship with a psychopath for 2 years which left me overweight, emotionally ruined and fired. It ended officially when he dumped me (i didnt know he was a p back then) and for 6 months i was a depressed wreck trying to make it through every day. Two months ago he resurfaced on fb and it was like his initial wonderful self. He got me hoovered but because we dont live in the same town anymore he started sending naked photos and explicit texts. I thought he had changed his mind, valued me and wanted me back..until i found out he has a new gf this last year and he has also proposed to her. I was so enraged and jealous i contacted her on fb and sent her all the sexting and the naked photos. Part of me wanted to warn her and also punish him for looking down on me. The result was shocking. Despite my tons of solid proof she is still with him and blocked me on fb.
I knew p’s are capable of persuasion but how can she believe him over her own eyes? I go forth and back between shock, sadness and tremendous anger. I am angry at the world too. Noone arounds me understands or cares. Today a friend of mine told me she ”doesnt believe in personality disorders” like it is some occult! I restrained myself from wishing her to encounter a p and see for herself. After the psychopath i feel like the heroine in the movie Konstantine who was the only one able to see demons and everyone laughed at her until she decided not to speak of what she saw even again. I have a loner by choise. Any advice would be much appreciated.
Changed Girl
Don’t listen to people or friends who haven’t been there it takes people like here on this site to understand what you are going through would you have listened if somebody told you that he was a sociopath probably not love is blind if you wanna call it love because its not its just a game and he will treat her the same way the best thing you can do this move on don’t look back share here with like minded people who have been there and work on yourself now this is not love and stay off his facebook blocked him and her
The lies never end. They lie to people in front of you and lie to you too your face. Start no contact. Get away from the lies, they only create more question.. when in a relationship you should trust the person, if they keep lying, that trust is always broken, therefore there is no way you can have a relationship with that person.
thankyou so much for the support… im at a place where im not suprised at the playful but obvious SEXUAL OVER ADVANCEMENT that she displays. im actually doing very well im signing up for school tomorrow and am planning to move to the beach …im a musicain so im always in the (know) so its about to get very exciting….but, i learned one vitally important thing ,keep your heart and mind grounded in you and you will succeed..im feeling really good. even if she told me that she:s sleeping with some else i wouldn:t be suprised..im over the worst part,,she could never regain the love that i had for her… so we:re friends now and im ok with that.. at least we can see each other ,share in some fun things and keep a safe distance so nobody gets hurt anymore …..thanks a million realniceguy
You are welcome. One other thing, I am not a psychiatrist but from the description in your posts it seems that your soc has some symptoms of Histrionic Personality Disorder, another cluster B disorder. Cluster B’s can fall in the intersections of a multitude of of categories so I wouldn’t worry too much about trying to pin it all down neatly. Just know that all cluster B’s can make things hell for their partners. Just thought I would point it out in case you wanted to seek info out on that.
But didn’t your friends stop speaking to you after HE did a smear campaign? Some people just don’t want to get between a couple and maybe it was hurtful to them what he was doing to you. Maybe they tried warning you in the past?
I’m not judging I am still with mine.
I have to thank you all for your support and words of advice on here. Since this site had closed down, I have had the courage to go no contact since then. I no longer feel the need to contact him, I actually feel wonderful and alive again. I was heading that way before this site closed down but I just keep on improving. I can’t say thank you enough for the support I have received. The future looks bright again. There will always be a small part of me that will love my Spath but, if he asked for help ever, I would have no problems in walking away now. I am not his lifesaver, he made his decision and now he must live with that. If anything, I have him to thank for making me a stronger person and know what I want in a partner….and that isn’t any of the attributes that he has.
I went to a physic on the weekend. I know that not everybody believes in it but I kind of do. She picked up on my ex the minute I sat down and said that the last 2 years have been very hard for me. She said that she wants to wrap my heart and me up in cotton wool and protect me. It gave me more hope as she said that she sees a wonderful man in my life that will turn up in around 6 months and he will show me what real love is. She also said that, because of my hurt previously, I will be very protective of myself and go slow, which isn’t a bad thing. At the end, the last thing she said was, my ex tried to put it all back onto me but I must know that I was never the problem and I did nothing wrong at all. So much more she said and it all just made sense. If anything, it just gave me that hope.
No you were never the problem, you cannot be responsible for someone else’s behaviour or actions. You cannot fix someone else, only they can do that for themselves, and with sociopaths, they still have the same brain pattern, the best that can be hoped for is that they could learn to manage their behaviour. Of course they can do that if they choose to, otherwise high functioning sociopaths wouldn’t survive. There are millions of them out there.
Please go careful though with talking to the psychic I am really pleased that it lifted your spirits and has made you feel good about you, and given you fresh hope for the future, after so much pain. But just be careful, hopefully what she says is true… but do not let this blind you to the greatest lesson that the sociopath teaches, and this is to trust yourself!!! To listen to your own inner voice of what is the truth.
I would hate you to be 6 months down the line, and healed and happy with your life, and let someone in…. and give them chances, that they didn’t deserve because a psychic said that you would be happy with this new person. Always listen to yourself, how you feel, and how you feel about yourself when with that person…. its more important than anything 🙂
I just have to share what I have found that is leading me to much healing, this verbalized in ways I could not. I have ordered the book. I hope that everyone takes time to read and finds it most beneficial as well. We all ask ourselves why? and this sure does bring light to the darkness and hell. God Bless all my Sisters…Seek, knock and the door shall be opened to you!
he Dance between Codependents and Narcissists
Ross Rosenberg, M.Ed., LCPC, CADC, CSAT Candidate
We therapists live for moments when everything “clicks” and our client arrives at an understanding that, until that moment, had eluded him. There is nothing more rewarding than when a well-placed analogy or metaphor creates the breakthrough moment. When spot-on, the resulting “light bulb” reaction or “aha” moment is priceless!
Of all of the metaphors I use in psychotherapy, “the dance” has been the most provocative and powerfully impactful with my codependent clients. It has helped them understand their predilection for choosing “dance partners” who are irresistibly attractive to them, but ultimately controlling and harmful. It has also assisted them in coming to terms with their seemingly magnetic attraction to narcissistic romantic partners. Over time, the dance metaphor would develop into one of my favorite psychotherapeutic techniques, which would ultimately facilitate perception of rigid thought patterns, break down systems of denial and enable emotional and intellectual understanding of dysfunctional relationship dynamics.
The dance metaphor works because it almost perfectly aligns with what we know about real dancing partnerships. For example, compatible dancers are well matched in their dance approach or dance roles: one always needs to be the leader and the other the follower. The leader always navigates the dance with precision and the follower acquiesces seamlessly. These two choose songs to dance to that they know completely and intuitively. They are exquisitely experienced, familiar and attuned to the other’s dancing style, moves and idiosyncrasies. To an onlooker, it appears that they dance with ESP, each knowing and predicting the other’s moves before they happen.
Codependents and narcissists “dance” so well with each other because their pathological personalities or “dance styles” are complementary or, in other words, they are perfectly matched partners. Their well-matched dance preferences bond them together in a resilient and lasting partnership, even if one or both partners are unhappy, resentful or angry. As well-matched dancers, they perform magnificently on the dance floor because they instinctively are able to expect each other’s moves. They dance effortlessly with each other, as if they have always danced together. Each knows his or her role and sticks to it. Dysfunctional compatibility is the driving force behind this dynamic dancing duo.
As perfectly compatible dancing partners, the narcissist dancer is the “yin” to the codependent’s “yang.” The codependent’s giving, sacrificial and passive nature matches up perfectly with the narcissist’s entitled, demanding and self-centered traits. Like metal magnets or, as I call them, “human magnets,” codependents and narcissists continue their rocky and seemingly unstable relationship because of their opposite dance roles or, as I refer to it in my book, The Human Magnet Syndrome, their “magnetic roles.” The lasting bond created by perfectly matched human magnets or dysfunctional dancers is interminably powerful; binding them together despite myriad consequences or shared unhappiness. Although their rollercoaster-relationship provokes more anxiety and disconnect than happiness, both seem compelled to continue the dance.
These perfectly matched dancers always seem to nail their dance routines, which are to be expected, as they have been practicing their passive and predictive dance moves their whole adult lives. Codependents’ dancing skills are distinctly connected to their reflexive dysfunctional agility – the ability to be attuned to the cues, gestures and self-serving movements of their pathological narcissist partners. Codependents, in almost every facet of their life, pride themselves on knowing what people want and need, almost before the friend, family member or partner knows it themselves. Hence, they are adept at anticipating their narcissist partner’s moves, while still experiencing the dance as a positive experience.
Conversely, narcissistic “dancers” are drawn to codependent partners because they are allowed to feel dominant, secure and in-control in an activity that brings them much attention, praise and appreciation. They habitually choose or fall in love with codependent “dance” partners because they are given open and tacit permission to be the center-focus, lead the direction of the dance and, ultimately, determine where, when and how the dance will proceed. In other words, the narcissist’s grandiosity, entitlement and need to be in control are not only allowed by their codependent partner, but also paradoxically make the partner feel safe and secure in the dance.
The dance metaphor has been instrumental to my work with codependent clientele because it assisted them understand their persistent dysfunctional attraction pattern to hurtful and selfish narcissistic romantic partners. It also helped them in breaking their perpetual and reflexive pattern of choosing a dance partner who initially felt perfect, but eventually would reveal themselves to be so wrong and harmful to them. As my dad, who sadly is a narcissist, once told me when he was explaining the nature of relationships: “The soul mate of your dreams is gonna become the cellmate of your nightmares.”
Therapy that utilizes my dance metaphor consistently provokes a deeper understanding of dysfunctional relationship patterns. Over time, my clients developed the confidence, insight and feelings of personal efficacy and power to break free from their dysfunctional relationship patterns. Released from their propensity to fall in love with narcissists, these “recovering” codependents would finally be able to fall reflexively, if not magnetically, into the arms of a loving, desirable and emotionally healthy dance partner.
In 2007, following an inspiring breakthrough therapy session with one of my clients, I decided to consolidate all of my ideas about the codependent/narcissist dance phenomenon into one essay, which I would entitle “Codependency, Don’t Dance.” The essay flowed from me with ease, as I had been thinking, contemplating and talking about these concepts for over five years. I would later realize that the ideas/concepts had been marinating in my mind ever since I made the promise to myself that I would put an end to my own penchant for dating, falling in love with and marrying narcissistic women. I have no doubt that if I didn’t figure out how to change my own dysfunctional dance pattern, the dance “light bulb” would never have appeared above my head!
It was an immediate hit with my codependent clients as it seemed to galvanize their understanding of their own dysfunctional and self-defeating relationship choices. It worked for them as it represented my own truism about the psychotherapy process: you can’t change a long-standing dysfunctional pattern until you first understand what it is and from where it comes; the deeper the understanding of the internal processes, the more apt the therapy experience will yield positive results.
Since writing this essay, it has become the most requested piece of my written work and is also included in my book, The Human Magnet Syndrome: Why We Love People Who Hurt Us. Over the past six years since it was written, I’m honored and grateful that the essay has helped thousands of people to analyze and, ultimately, understand their seemingly mysterious and habitual relationship patterns with narcissists.
What follows is an excerpt of the essay:
Codependency, Don’t Dance!
When a codependent and narcissist come together in their relationship, their dance unfolds flawlessly: The narcissistic partner maintains the lead and the codependent follows. Their roles seem natural to them because they have actually been practicing them their whole lives; the codependent reflexively gives up their power and since the narcissist thrives on control and power, the dance is perfectly coordinated. No one gets their toes stepped on.
Typically, codependents give of themselves much more than their partners give back to them. As “generous” but bitter dance partners, they seem to be stuck on the dance floor, always waiting for the “next song,” at which time they naively hope that their narcissistic partner will finally understand their needs. Codependents confuse caretaking and sacrifice with loyalty and love. Although they are proud of their unwavering dedication to the person they love, they end up feeling unappreciated and used. Codependents yearn to be loved, but because of their choice of dance partner, find their dreams unrealized. With the heartbreak of unfulfilled dreams, codependents silently and bitterly swallow their unhappiness.
Codependents are essentially stuck in a pattern of giving and sacrificing, without the possibility of ever receiving the same from their partner. They pretend to enjoy the dance, but really harbor feelings of anger, bitterness, and sadness for not taking an active role in their dance experience. They are convinced that they will never find a dance partner who will love them for who they are, as opposed to what they can do for them. Their low self-esteem and pessimism manifests itself into a form of learned helplessness that ultimately keeps them on the dance floor with their narcissistic partner.
The narcissist dancer, like the codependent, is attracted to a partner who feels perfect to them: Someone who lets them lead the dance while making them feel powerful, competent and appreciated. In other words, the narcissist feels most comfortable with a dancing companion who matches up with their self-absorbed and boldly selfish dance style. Narcissist dancers are able to maintain the direction of the dance because they always find partners who lack self-worth, confidence and who have low self-esteem — codependents. With such a well-matched companion, they are able to control both the dancer and the dance.
Although all codependent dancers desire harmony and balance, they consistently sabotage themselves by choosing a partner who they are initially attracted to, but will ultimately resent. When given a chance to stop dancing with their narcissistic partner and comfortably sit the dance out until someone healthy comes along, they typically choose to continue their dysfunctional dance. They dare not leave their narcissistic dance partner because their lack of self-esteem and self-respect makes them feel like they can do no better. Being alone is the equivalent of feeling lonely, and loneliness is too painful to bear.
Although codependents dream of dancing with an unconditionally loving and affirming partner, they submit to their dysfunctional destiny. Until they decide to heal the psychological wounds that ultimately compel them to dance with their narcissistic dance partners, they will be destined to maintain the steady beat and rhythm of their dysfunctional dance.
Through psychotherapy, and perhaps, a 12-step recovery program, the codependent can begin to recognize that their dream to dance the grand dance of love, reciprocity and mutuality is indeed possible. Through therapy and a change of lifestyle, codependents can build (repair) their tattered self-esteem. The journey of healing and transformation will bring them feelings of personal power and efficacy that will foster a desire to finally dance with someone who is willing and capable of sharing the lead, communicating their movements, and pursuing a mutual loving rhythmic dance.
In conclusion, it is my belief that all codependents, if motivated and committed to a healing and engaging psychotherapy process, are able to stop their insanity-inducing dance with narcissists. Through a non-wavering belief in one’s self-worth and commitment to the ideal of healthy and resilient love, we all can finally experience personal and relational joy. The quote that best captures my philosophy of the codependency recovery process comes from George Eliot: “It’s never too late to be what you might have been.” Or, as I might say it, “It is never too late to dance with the partner of your dreams.”
Ross Rosenberg, M.Ed., LCPC, CADC
Psychotherapist & National Seminar Trainer
Owner of Clinical Care Consultants
Co-Owner of Advanced Clinical Trainers
Author of the Human Magnet Syndrome
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This entry was posted in Articles, codependency, narcissism and tagged best codependency book, best narcissism book, codependency, codependency book, codependency expert, codependency narcissism, codependency treatment, human magnet syndrome, narcissism, narcissism author, narcissist, ross rosenberg on January 11, 2014 by Ross Rosenberg.
About Ross Rosenberg
Ross Rosenberg has over 26 years of experience as a psychotherapist, counseling practice owner, training company co-owner, nationally recognized professional trainer, consultant and certified addiction specialist. Ross is the author of “The Human Magnet Syndrome: Why We Love People Who Hurt Us,” published in April 2013. Ross’s work has been highlighted on various TV programs including, ABC Late Night, Fox News, WGN News and UT-San Diego News. He has appeared in the Chicago Tribune & Publisher Weekly and is a regular contributor for The Huffington Post and PsychCenteral.com. Ross owns Clinical Care Consultants, a full-service counseling center based in the Northwestern suburbs of Chicago. He is a national seminar speaker consultant, and expert psychotherapist in the areas of codependency, sex love addiction and internet addictions, trauma, dysfunctional or problematic relationships, narcissism and borderline personality disorders. The training that inspired his book, “Emotional Manipulators & Codependents: Understanding the Attraction” was hosted in 27 states/60 cities in a two year time span. Ross now owns the Chicago based training company, Advanced Clinical Ross owns Clinical Care Consultants, a full-service counseling center based in the Northwestern suburbs of Chicago. He is a national seminar speaker consultant, and expert psychotherapist. Ross’s clinical expertise spans the areas of codependency, sex love addiction and internet addictions, dysfunctional or problematic relationships, narcissism and borderline personality disorders. By the end of 2013, Ross’s current seminar, “Emotional Manipulators & Codependents: Understanding the Attraction” will have been hosted in 27 states. Rosenberg’s psychotherapy services enable his clients to achieve balance, inner peace and feelings of personal efficacy. He says, “Within a warm and respectful therapeutic relationship lies the power to overcome seemingly overwhelming obstacles.”
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Hi all, this is my story….I had no idea I was susceptible to this type of abuse…I always thought of my self as the “take no shit” type…so what was this strange hold he had over me and why did I ignore the red flags….A few years ago, I was really on top of game, looking and feeling gorgeous from yoga, had wonderful friends, a great job and beautiful home. Within nine months, I was friendless, homeless and jobless, and the psycho was gone…oh and also managed to beat me so badly I had to get five stitches in my eye, then pressed charges against me, then bailed me out of jail the same night, got me a hotel room, and said “I know you hate me now”…I only stayed with him to get my stitches and scar paid for and to get the charge against me dropped. Somehow, it was like he knew, that day he hit me like that, I was finally ready to leave him. As usual, he called me tormenting me, telling me to pack my shit when I got home, we were through. I was going away for four days to see family, this was enough to shake him bad. But my response is what shocked him. “Ok”, and that was that. Until Wham! He did what he had to do to “keep” me. What a sick ordeal. Everything he did was a sick ordeal to keep me. Even after I finally left him, he continued stalking my every move. He was a high level computer coder. A psycho genius. It took me months to realize how he was tracking my every move via computer. I eventually had to report him to the FBI internet hate crimes division. I have not been bothered since. But, I still find myself lamely needing to feel his fake love to feel loved, instead of loving myself. There was nothing so elating as being so wanted and needed. So am I not sick too? I just really need to find a place to get support and help and to remember that I am worth it, that other men are still worth it…and move on already. If anyone can help me, please, and thanks in advance!
What you describe sounds incredibly normal. They display their ‘love’ only it is ownership, and as you know when you try to escape, if they don’t want you to escape, will track your every move, and every thought.
You know in your heart that you are better off without this person, and also lucky to have escaped. Every day when you wake up BREATH OUT FREEDOM, as you escaped and set yourself free. There is never a more dangerous time than the time when you are trying to escape and they don’t want to lose you. What you describe as wanting to ‘keep you’ is a good description, mine would tell me that …
I want to keep you….
He didn’t see how this wasn’t a normal thing to say, as you don’t ‘keep’ people. It should be a two way relationship.
What you describe, it is not missing him, it is addiction, they deliberately create dependency and addiction towards them, this is how they keep control over you.
This explains, and I know that there a lot of posts on this subject
There are quite a few more that I am trying to find for you. Go through the list of posts. I just wanted you to know that there is nothing wrong with you, your reactions are NORMAL. They groom you, manipulate, deceive and completely control you. It isn’t that it was good its that they create addiction and dependency, and it is the addiction that is crying out… that is all. Welcome to the site 🙂
Hi all….I am too tired to go over it all…I let him destroy everything, my world,he beat me, ruined precious friendships, choked me off from reality…he was my insane reality. he left me friendless, jobless, homeless, and destroyed all my wordly belongings aside from putting me the hospital. It has been two years nearly and I finally am facing up to the fact that I need help to psychologically move past this. I am externally moving on, have new friends, new job, secure home life, he is no longer stalking me like he did for months after the breakup ( I had to report him to the fbi….I was no longer scared)….but how do I fix the inside now…if anyone can help? I also need to escape my victim mentality…I allowed this, and some sick part of me still needs to think this is love? I was told by a therapist that he did love me in his own sick way…but sometime I feel like I just changed the external…please help
Roadkill, you didn’t LET HIM destroy everything. This isn’t true. He might allow you to believe that it is all your fault. It absolutely isn’t. If in the beginning he had said to you, when you had just met him ‘I am going to destroy everything in your world’ would you have let him in further?
No of course you wouldn’t. You did, because you thought that you were with someone who was just like you, someone with similar morals, and values. This is not your fault.
Therapy can be really good, it can help you to undo damage that has been done to you. Many victims of abuse are left suffering with post traumatic stress disorder, from continual control and abuse techniques, and additional sometimes also physical abuse. As the sociopath strives to keep control, it can be impossible to escape.
NO it isn’t true that you allowed this. You were manipulated, controlled, and owned. It wasn’t that you allowed this, you had little choice…. I understand this, as would anybody else who has also been a victim of this kind of behaviour.
It might be true that he ‘loved’ you in the only way that he knew how, but did you want this type of love?
As for fixing you…. its about finding the OLD you, the person that you were PRIOR to meeting him. All of this is still within you. He could never take you, your inner you, despite he tried, it is still there within you, I promise. Yes you might be forever changed by your experiences, but I promise you, you can recover.
Dating a Sociopath 
@Tay…..yep, I always question if he was an spath. This is necause we saw a different side of them at the beginning. They built our trust with them. Victims of abuse usually do think that it was something that they did rather than the abuser. They r masters of manipulation. Even if they are not an Spath, our ex’s were not very nice people and not people we want to be in a relationship with. We deserve to be treated with respect, honesty and love but we should be able to be ourselves as well and that person love us for that and make us feel secure in who we are and in our relationship.
The divorce was final yesterday. I know I’m supposed to feel great about this, but I am surprisingly sad. I still have little emotional bouts that overwhelm me throughout the day and night. I sob and mourn, albeit briefly, the loss of what I thought I had. I feel incredibly stupid and vulnerable at times. How could I have fallen for all of his lies. No one sees your soul like an SP. No one throws your soul in your face like an SP. Know one knows you like an SP. Know one haunts you like an SP.
That’s why they are so good at hurting you when they want to… they know exactly where to place the knife… exactly how deep and for how long to do just enough damage… to make you question your very sanity… then they dress your wounds and care for like it wasn’t them that caused them and expect you (and you do) to love them for it.
My counselor asked me today… what it was that I needed, that he gave me… that I got from him that I allowed this relationship to happen… and it wasn’t anything. I wasn’t abused as a child, I have always been smarter than your average bear, I have never been a ‘needy’ person. The simple answer is I don’t know. Maybe over the next weeks and months, I will find that answer… but I am scared too.. is there some hole in my soul, something I didn’t realize… something that ugly, that I felt I needed, or deserved to be treated like that??? That’s almost too horrible to contemplate.
Raven
Hi Raven 🙂
Sometimes it not something inside that you are looking for but, perhaps you thought he was ‘good looking & complimented you?’ or perhaps your a ‘fixer’ or ‘rescuer’ so, with you he will be ‘greater’….it’s hard work but, when you really dig deep, it’s amazing what you find.
I was attracted to ‘power’ as mine is a Commander in the Fire-Brigade but, I mistook that he uses this position to ‘appear’ like a ‘good guy’ with integrity & trust & good values but, boy was I wrong.
I often found myself thinking ‘gee, if people knew what you were like in private, they’d be shocked’…Outside Angel, inside Devil.
I also realized that I liked being with someone that appeared powerful as it made me ‘look better’…..now, I know there were many reasons for that. I was seduced by the power & control etc…when I met him my life was a mess & I thought he was my knight in shinning armor!
Just the type he liked!
After much therapy & self reflection, I am now aware of my own strengths & weaknesses & am working on my weakness & using my strength’s to create the life I want & need 🙂
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
Yeah, I knew when I met him, I wasn’t at my strongest as I had recently lost my father… but as I stated – he in no was was EVER a replacement for my father…
I think – maybe – and maybe since I’ve had half of today to think on it – maybe I was still depressed from that – and possibly that’s where I’m heading… that not necessarily he was the “bad boy” I never had ever considered – as he is, comparatively – but that maybe I even had something of a self destructive wish… that maybe why I’m so lost now… is that I was this lost 5 years ago – and I just put it on hold while I let him destroy me as well…
I really hope not… I’m not sure anyone can fix that… that sort of sounds like it is all my fault on some level doesn’t it….???? Or am I playing his games in my own head???
I can’t even trust myself right now… I’m still making excuses for the jerk. And ~I~ am not even trying to! Just like with his phone calls and texts… I have him fully blocked now… but I have this feeling, a tingle, that I would get if he’d tried to call and I was out of cell range or in a meeting or whatever and he hadn’t been able to reach me and he’d get so mad. Course, when he wouldn’t answer my calls or texts for hours and hours.. it wasn’t supposed to be a big deal. Yet, STILL I dread the next time I see him – as I know he’ll have some spiteful comment about having his number blocked.
I just want to find a big rock and hide. I don’t want to know what’s in my head. I want it to go away. I want to be happy again. But I guess the only way to happy is through my head isn’t it?
PR… thanks… I probably won’t be able to write after tonight untill Tuesday… and I’m sure I’ll have lots to write about.
*hugs and love*
Raven
Raven 🙂
Just remember, self reflection is part of the healing process so, don’t be afraid of it & just let it come naturally. You will keep doubting & questioning yourself but, be careful & try to observe the thought rather than buy into it…stop & pause before you let the mind run away with the thought.
If your were grieving 😦 when you met him then, you were extremely vulnerable to this type of person as that is when they strike, when your normal barrier of resistance in down.
I am sorry for the loss of your Dad as, he was a pivotal person in your life & I am truly sorry, he isn’t there to protect you but, maybe he was & is.
He has set his beautiful daughter free of a man he would not approve of. I think you will be okay so, focus on yourself & what your Dad would say 🙂 he will answer & send messages so, be aware of them. You will see feathers or something to remind you of him & it will be amazing so, stay tuned up & open to it.
Have a great weekend & stay here to heal as it’s cheap therapy & reassuring that you are most definitely among friends & not alone 🙂
Love PR xoxox
There are no accidents.. and you know I am Christian. It’s awesome you mention feathers… I was/am a falconer – haven’t had my own bird since before I met – him – this not because of him though – birds of prey don’t do well in apartments… – still one of the last birds I had before my husband and I had moved north – we release a pair here at my parents. They have stayed here and raised their young for years. And I believe their kids come back as well.
Just today – mom and I found a single perfect red-tailed hawk feather…
Thank you Phoenix. It’s so hard- even when talking to the few friends I am able to talk to… I feel like a broken record and I know they all think I should just get over it… and I can’t explain something I don’t even understand and frankly I don’t want to.
It is so good to have you all… I found you when I was completely floundering as to where to turn.
Have a very safe weekend!
*hugs and love*
Raven
Keep an eye out for more messages from above 🙂
I wondered why I had been obsessing over Eagles lately & knew it was a message as your name “Raven” implied a connection 🙂
I see ‘Raven’s’ all the time…they are messengers as well 🙂
Take care & focus on the feather, it will bring you great comfort…it’s from a loved one 🙂
(((hugs))) to you….I love birds too 🙂
PR xoxox
I’m heading to bed.. have an early morning tomorrow… but my next birds will be two ravens – of course named Hugin and Munin – not orginal – but when I got my first hawk, my master falconer had a clutch of raven chicks… and they were soooo smart!! I have wanted to work with a pair ever since!!
I will let you know how it goes as soon as I can. I don’t expect it to be perfect… but I’m not going to let him get to me… if he tries to start anything – or really even comes near me, I plan to just walk away. I may have to go straight to my tent or the closest portapotta and bawl my eyes out… but I will not let him see me fall apart.
I have everyone on this board with me!!!
PR… thank you – so much!!
*hugs and love*
Raven
Congratulations on the divorce & commiserations to you on feeling so down 😦 You will however rise again as you are very resilient & you just need this time to process & put it behind you once & for all.
Yesterday is just that, yesterday & you have closed that door & now you must open another as that was the ‘sign’ to move forward.
It’s always hard letting go but, you know deep down that it’s for the best.
That is why it happened as, it was not good for you to stay involved with a person that reflected you back at yourself.
Up until their mask slipped & the real person behind it emerged, you were being ‘gamed’ & once he had you, he could stop pretending.
They get you to share & over share everything so, they can use it against you. They know your motivations as they study you so intently & know how you think, feel & act.
Remember the person that was there after the ‘honeymoon’, don’t focus on the ‘seducer’, but, the player & gamer & then you will feel relieved that you are no longer being lied to & manipulated.
Do everything you can to heal as, it’s a constant struggle so, treat yourself like a job & get up everyday & work on you…you are wonderful & beautiful & worthy…you are a soul & you need to remember who you truly are & what makes you the truly unique individual you are.
We all have something ‘special’ that no-one else has so, find the ‘greatness’ within yourself & own it!
You are not your divorce, the divorce is an event so, have an event to celebrate your freedom 🙂
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
On my way to live again…
I can so relate to how you feel…I’m in the process of divorcing my SP after a roller coaster marriage of 12 years. Some days it takes all my strength to cope with emotions…
@Raven……Yep, I believe they pray on the strong ones. I was very much like that as well. Strong, independent woman. It is like a game. See how far they can push you until you break and than take pride in themselves for being able to do it to the strong-willed.
@Ex def an S
Doesn’t that mean that those people aren’t strong at all? If they were, they’d be unbreakable, but clearly they were not.
This isn’t meant to be an insult or attack, I’m merely stating what I see.
I personally believe people pretend to be strong, but when they’re confronted with someone (such as a sociopath) their true strength (or weakness) is shown.
@Lyss….I think the majority of people have a breaking point, no matter how strong or weak that person is. Perhaps I have misunderstood strong with patience LOL. I am always told that I am a strong person as I always seem to put up with a lot of crap and been through a lot and come out with a positive attitude. What doesn’t kill you, just makes you stronger.
@Raven
“but since I’ve found ya’ll, I feel more and more angry and I really do understand more. ” This shows progress through the stages of grieving.
At first I was shell shocked and bewildered when I discovered her duplicity. Once I had more knowledge of cluster B’s and their modus operandi and examined past events in this new light I grew angrier also. Eventually, I drew my lessons out of those examinations and decided to move on. This finally led to the acceptance phase. I had my understanding and lessons learned and realized I can’t change the past but I can influence my present and future. Now if I catch myself thinking about that time I can honestly say to myself “Screw that, I’ve got better things to think and do. ” and it feels good. 🙂
Wow! Falconry and Harleys. You have some really interesting pursuits. I always wanted to try falconry when I was younger. I am going to add taking some lessons in that to my to do list. Stay strong at your camp out. Lots of love. AGPT
Why did I go there….
I left some of my things at Mr. X’s home (where we both used to live). My emails to him were straight and to the point. His were flirtatious, and it was obvious he wanted a booty call. It’s been 3 weeks since I left, and he deleting me from virtual existence. I had to tell him that I thought those moves were childish. From reading here, I understood right away that he was transferring the blame to me, projecting. It wasn’t an argument, but a discussion. He was complimentary (something he hadn’t been in months). He made me dinner.
And then it began…the flirting, the continued compliments, the touching, hugging, kissing. He thinks of me every day, he misses our closeness at night (but admittedly likes the silence of being on his own – remember…I brought a bag in the house with vitamins and when going thru it, he asked me to leave the room). I’m his drug, I’m his porn, I’m his everything…and we went “there”.
I left and all I could think of when driving home was why? Why couldn’t he have treated me that way the past few years. Why couldn’t he compliment me, profess his love to me, caress my face like he did tonight, and kiss me so tenderly that my heart literally skipped a beat.
It’s the game….he wants control over me, without me physically being there.
And now I feel sick…and confused.
And then the self-doubt…from his perspective tonite, I’m the princess but there isn’t a fairy tale happy ever after now that we’re older; I live in my own psychotic reality, it’s my fault he pushes me away (this all said during a pleasant conversation believe it or not). I do agree with him that at this stage of the game, we (being married before, grown kids) should just be “us”…he has his family, I have my family, but it’s about “us”, yet he was the one that pushed me out the door with his isolation. But I question myself, is it me? (I know it’s totally the soc but he sure knows how to get me to question myself).
No, this is NOT you. Why would you make yourself feel bad? Why would you do something to hurt you? Why would you not look out for your own best interests? He is bad news. To know whether he is good or bad for you, ask the question, how do I feel about me? How does he make me feel about me? If it’s bad you know he is bad for you. If it’s really bad you know he is really bad for you.
Oh Dear LA,
Back to the ‘naughty corner’ with you!
Don’t worry as you’ll have plenty of company as quite a few ‘go there’ before they finally break that incessant bond.
Just know that you are not alone & if I could I’d give you a big hug & say, ‘it’s really hard to let go someone you love but, love is not a person that breaks your heart over & over’. 😦
(((o))) an internet hug for you bella,
Only you can break the cycle so, just focus back on yourself & back to support & therapy etc…day one begins again of NC, let’s try & stop you hurting yourself anymore, what do you say?
The heart that loves you wouldn’t hurt you, ever!….Trent Shelton 🙂
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
Because he was playing the game la that is what they do, pull you in, then push you away when it is no longer convenient for them. It’s all about control. He pulls you in when he feels he is losing control. This is about his ego, not your self worth.
So true Pos, the game of cat & mouse.
Love hurts but, it only hurts us & not them as they cannot relate to love.
Sad but true & once we finally accept that fact, we start to accept that our love is best served towards ourselves & others that feel love for real 😃
Sometimes we lie more to ourselves than the Soc does & think we didn’t love them enough otherwise they would’nt abandon us etc…but, thats the biggest lie of all.
We love ‘big’ & they don’t love at all.
Therein lies our mistake if them then using our loving intentions against us.
Their intentions all all ego & self motivation, its easy to leave if you never arrive & they never arrive with loving intentions.
The nature of the beast is what it is & our time is precious & so is our love.
Letting go of someone that hurts you is not a loss, its a recognition to your soul that you are valuable & know your worth 😃
PR xoxo
i was so devastated the first time she suggested to me that something i did was stupid, but it was actually what she did that was stupid. i knew something was wrong . hey Guys realize that these people cant feel anything, they know somethings wrong with them but they are too far gone to change, they.re heading for a train wreck. my ex is back on her social media dating sites EVERYDAY like an obsession looking for her perfect situation. but doesn;t realize without true emotional love its FUTILE. BUT SHE;S GOING AT IT FULL THROTTLE. thank God for this site . cause i have closure and solice and know what im worth. she even has potential but it.s gonna take something pretty dramatic to win this SOUL bless you guys keep posting ps i’ll let you guys know if i hear anything from her on fathersday. she never calls on special days birthdays holidays, new years christmas, life or death OH YES IT REALLY HAPPENED SO LETS JUST SEE
I would like to share my story. Today is Wednesday, May 28th. As of May 25, I had been involved with a sociopath I met on twitter for fifteen months. Initially, there were no red flags. He was EXACTLY. Ex. Zact. Ly. What I wanted in a mate, to a T. Passionate, creative, good career, ambitious, charismatic, charming, well spoken, intellectual and super. fucking. attractive. God he is fine.. at only 22. Amazing right? After only a week of texting, we Skype’d and telling me he wanted me to quit my job and move to his state and work for the company he works for. (it was then I was like okay, this dude is really into me. This might be it. The serious relationship I’ve been feinding for.) I was currently working at McDonalds, a job I loathed for obvious reasons and I constantly complained about my work when we talked. But soon, he began to get annoyed with me. Tell me how I lacked depth and ambition, I guess because I wasn’t as ambitious as he. He would make remarks about how naive he could tell I was. I took these comments in stride, I’ve already fallen. It’s just constructive. NO one wants to see a pretty girl waste their life at a fast food joint making minimum wage. He wants me on his level. Then came the flip flopping. One day, he was all over me another day he couldn’t stand me. wouldn’t text, call, nada. I couldn’t figure him out, it intrigued me even more. The more we talked I yearned to find out more about him, his family, his background. That’s where the inconsistencies started. One day he called me and the name that came on the caller ID was not the name I knew him by. I questioned him about it. “Who the fuck is ____?!” Response: some vague answer I can’t remember. So, I google searched his real name. The entire ____ family popped up. (apparently he’s from an affluent family) I found the brother on Facebook and befriended him and started looking for answers to my questions. Everything. EVERYTHING A was almost always a lie. “He was NOT a bachelor. He never graduated college. He never studied abroad. He wasted our parents money again, and again we do not even deal with him. And he has SEVERAL lady friends” I was devasted. Why so many lies about your family? Then when I confront him about this: He offered NO explanation, no apology, nothing. Just “I’ll contact you again when YOU apologize for calling me a liar” and because I was in love, I gave in. I wanted the full family story tell me the truth. He still didn’t. I let it go, maybe some things are better left unsaid. I don’t need their blessing to be with him. We moved passed the “lying about his identity, education and family” obstacle. I just spent the memorial weekend in his state. That’s when he showed me in real CST that he did not care about me or my feelings. Picked me up from the station, no hug no kiss, no kind of engagement, I fell asleep in his bed and tried to cuddle on him he pushed me off. Ditched me in the middle of the night to go party, then when I confronted him about the way he was acting toward me he flipped it all on me. I was being standoffish. According to him. I left his parents home broken hearted and devastated. “I am in love with you, I did a lot to come see you this weekend why are acting so mean toward me?” Literal tears, right in front of him. He. Did. Not. Care. Dropped me off at the station HOURS before I was supposed to depart. I spent the long ride home crying my eyes out. I had my suspicions about being broken, being sociopathic. It’s all mental, I thought. I would support him through therapy..that’s how much I love him. Right now, I’m on no contact and it hurts me sooo much. He had everything I wanted in a guy but.. I just can’t. Sigh. I’m still not over it.
Hi depressed in Michigen,
You say that he had everything that you wanted in a guy….. but…..
Did he really? He put you down, he lied to you, he disrespected you. He had to fake things about himself to pretend to be good enough for you… then put you down to make himself believe he was good enough for you.
Was he REALLY everything that you wanted in a man?
Write down a list of ALL that you want in a man.
Then write another list all that he WAS (not what he faked to be)
Then write all that he FAKED to be….. and draw a LINE through it…..
You will see he was not everything you ever wanted in a man, he just fed you that illusion. Don’t let this person steal your dreams or your own illusion of what YOU want in life.https://datingasociopath.com/2013/11/13/leaving-the-sociopath-and-the-fog-of-confusion/
There is another post, I need to find it, that I want to share with you, its about how they steal our dreams and this makes us think that they have stolen a part of us> You then think that the answer to the missing piece lies within him – but actually NO it lies within YOU.
welcome to the site 🙂
Hey Raven
Just thinking about you and hoping that you are doing well and making progress. Our prayers are still with you
Lots of Love AGPT
Ditto what AGPT said Raven 😃
I hope you are both doing well 😃
Everyone else here also 😃
Love & Light 😃
PR xoxo
I think I might be a bit odd LOL.1 and a half years later and I find myself still muting, changing the channel or turning the tv off whenever there is a love scene or talking about relationships or sex. It triggers my anxiety. Some days I can watch but the majority of time I do everything. Is anybody else the same?
Hi Ex 😃
Welcome to the ‘odd’ club, gee we have so many clubs here now 😃
My trigger is songs but, not as bad as it once was. Depends on my mood & how things are going in general. If I’m having a bad day & a love song comes on like John Legend ‘All of me’.
I am like ‘get real you perfectly happy gorgeous looking freak’ play ‘Tainted Love’ or some other song I can relate to 😁 then they play ‘Happy’ & I get real & apologise to John & Buble & dance & sing myself clear. I am a little obsessed with Paloma Faiths ‘I can’t rely on you’ but, singing in the car with gusto, means I get a clear run as other drivers think I’m nuts 😉
Just kidding about being nuts, it’s the squirrel in me 😁
It gets better so, its up to you when you control the triggers & not vice versa.
Try making yourself sit through some like a test, you must stop avoiding & face it, then go out & live it 😃
Bring back your Mojo.
My dogs nickname us Mojo & somedays I call out, ‘here Mojo, has anyone seen my Mojo!’
PR x
I first found this site a year ago, you must have been new, but I didn’t know that then. Thank God for you…….I realized that my guy was a sociopath at that time, but I was dealing with another one in my life who had married my Dad, isolated him, through his sickness and death and taken everything. She then came for for the bit my Mom had left us…….Women are socio’s too…….I was in a bad shape from my Dad’s death, the betrayal, not being able to see him in the last 2 years of his life and having to fight back……There was no time to just grieve my Dad……….During these years my Guy ( socio) had established him self in my life as part of my support system. I also changed my job and moved!!! Too many big events all at one time…….
I did break up with my guy for a couple of months after reading this site, but he came back and got back in…….Hardly surprising with everything else I have been dealing with.
This year we had the best relationship we have ever had……I thought we were settling into ‘Us’….Little did I know…….
So here I am to tell you that I have won my case against Dad’s wife. In winning I mean that I managed to hang on to what was left to us after Mom died, she made off with everything my Dad had, but I didn’t fight that……She is having to leave the house and we can sell it, she gets half but so what……..In the legal settlement I have a clause of NO CONTACT……..I want her to go away. I want to legally make sure that she can never come back for us ( my brothers and I ) again……..She already has a new source.
I just want to tell you that she is in her early 70′s now, they never stop!!!
So to the guy…….
Just as this was all ending, the red flags began to appear again with the guy…….I had a phone call from his girlfriend!!! (New source)
I exposed him…….It is the only way for me to get him out of my life. His new source is another one!!!!
She immediately exposed 3 other girlfriends and gave them all my phone number, said I was a stalker. She then sent out an email to us all saying that He was now hers…..And we should all just move on…..
No problem, she hadn’t stopped to notice that we had all stepped back….
I immediately blocked all contact, phone, text and email. I gave the other girls this site and told them to read. One immediately shut him out, one didn’t, not my concern.
I am getting friend requests from her friends, ( the new source) and she is infiltrating my life to keep tabs on me……I have blocked them all…….We have a lot of common circles.
Healing is the only way forward……I can not heal if I hear about him, people want to gossip about them, or tell me more horrifying stories…..
I am begging my friends to not talk about it to anyone other than to say we broke up, he moved on……
The amazing gift from all of this is forgiveness for my Dad. I have spent the last years going How could you?…….Well now I know exactly how my Darling Dad got duped, and treated, because I fell in love with a socio at the same time….The forgiveness for Dad is the gift, I can now grieve him and miss him………
If there is anyone reading this who thinks that they can manage these people with kindness and love, please believe me when I say that you can’t……I tried everything with my Dad’s wife so that I could see my Dad.
I live in the states, My family is in the UK……So I didn’t see why I would be a threat, but I was…….
The other thing I have realized is that it is NOT personal……Its so not about YOU……They have no attachment to you at all, just what they want from You……
NO CONTACT……….It is the only way to heal and move on.
I am 3 weeks into no contact with my Guy, and although I would love closure, I know I can not have it.
Tomorrow I sign the legal document in the UK and the NO CONTACT clause goes into effect with Dad’s wife……
Please if you are reading this, know that the only revenge is happiness.
They live in a perpetual ground hog day. You do not……They are not happy, they are sad, and they do not change…….
I will keep my circle small and strong, I will not hear or listen to the smear tactics of the new source and him, I will keep myself safe…..For the alternative is unacceptable to me…….
Thank you so much for this site.
PLEASE do not stop…..
You have no idea how many lives you are helping and they don’t always come in the form of a relationship, and sometimes they come in packs….
THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU.
Keep it up, It is the best……
Hi Paula, yes I started just over a year ago, end of Feb 2013. I am so sorry that this happened to your dad after losing your mum, that must have been so painful. Wow about your ex that he ended up with one too. Thank you so much for your kind words. You know, the biggest gift of this is that you understand your father what he has been through. . And in turn, he will understand you. This, is a gift of life more precious than anything.
THESE PEOPLE ARE SICK GUYS…. YOU GOTTA LIMIT YOU CONNECTION WITH THEM…. I KNOW HOW LONELY IT CAN BE BUT REMEMBER GOD SEE.S EVERYTHING, SO IF YOU REALLY LOVED THEM PRAY FOR THEM GOD JUST MIGHT SUPRISE YOU !!! HE;S ALREADY ANSWERED PRAYERS FOR ME
Hmm it seems like your site ate my first comment (it was extremely long)
so I guess I’ll just sum it up what I had written and say, I’m thoroughly enjoying your
blog. I too am an aspiring blog writer but I’m still new to the whole thing.
Do you have any tips for novice blog writers? I’d really appreciate
it.
Hi everyone….I have been with some one for 32 years an its been hell on earth. I now see he is a sociopath and I don’t see a way out of this I wouldn’t even know where to begin..I have started to go to a therapist and she also referred me to a psychiatrist because I have started to physically hurt myself. My therapist actually treated him in the past and after about 6 visits with him she requested to meet me only to find out that everything he had said to her was a lie. Thank God she saw through his lies within 2 minutes of meeting me. She says he has delusional disorder but I think it is a lot deeper than that. I don’t know what to do anymore.
32 years is a long time mariagon. It will take some time to undo psychological damage that has been done over such a long period of time.
I always new there was something off with him. I was 15 (32 years ago) when we met and he lied about his age even his name. I discovered that, about a year after we were together. I knew about the insane jealousy and his excuse was that he loved me. The lies, the cheating, never stopped. He reverses everything he does and or acts as if I’m just like him. We have grown children and he has approached them about my perceived infidelities to the point that they just tell him STOP you are making this up (they have caught him in his lies) and they call him on it, then he becomes angry and then he is the victim. That’s were the therapist said he has delusional disorder but I firmly believe he is a Sociopath. I will tell her this when I see her this week. But as I’m writing this I feel that there is probably a lot more going on with him, This website has been a fountain of information or should I say confirmation. At least I know I am not crazy just traumatized.
Hi Mariagon67 😃
My ex has just divorced his wife after 10 years separation? & 25 years married so, 35 yrs for her. He still controls her via their adult children & has implanted his nearly 30 yr old son who had lived with her for last 10 years to make sure she doesn’t move on.
I remember him telling me she had a younger boyfriend & he was livid. He made sure his children destroyed that relationship etc…
This is what they do & continue to do especially if they have children with you.
They don’t want you to move on or be happy, they will but, won’t allow you.
My advice is have little or no contact ever & tell your children they must not discuss what you do etc….
The children are used as proxy’s & even when they try & protect you, he is loving it. Your children should not have to defend you under normal circumstances & if they see him games & call him on it, that is good. Unfortunately though, having to live with him accusing you is torture for them & once again, he loves the game.
Tell your children you want your freedom from his game & work together to stop his game.
Break the cycle of dysfunction he causes by breaking the conduit between him, you & your children.
I wish you well & hope you & your children break free of him one day.
Love & Light 😃
PR xoxo
Hello Lady Phoenix,
This broken-underconstruction. Its been awehile so I wanted to check in. Things are going well. I went to court, the charges were dropped to a non-criminal misdemeanor, my abstinence from booze remains good, and I am in good standing with my employers. It will still be a year before I am able to drive, but that will come in time.
I’m taking a huge time out from the romantic scene, and have remained no contact. My plans for th esummmer are to keep getting my ankle and leg back up to speed and maintain a good level of fitness. I just wanted to say hi to the beautiful funny lady & wish everyone peace.
Things are going well an dI think it does me justice to now say refer to myself as unbroken
Hiya Unbroken Yay 🙂
I am so glad you are okay & have been rebuilding etc…
Like you I am also off the market romantically.
I figure my chances after two disasters are quite low so, I look at what I do have & I am good 🙂
Its necessary to pack up, pick up & push on & that’s what makes us all survivors.
Whats the alternative? Unpack, drop our bundle & push off? Nah, not for us 🙂
I wish you continued strength & support & most of all the best of what remains of this lifetime 🙂
I will see you on the other side eventually, hopefully???
I will be the one with the name tag on upside down or on the wrong cloud. Maybe I will be off complaining that my wings aren’t what I ordered 😉
Rest assured we will know each other well 🙂
Love Always PR xoxo
That’s right realniceguy. When you come out the other end, you realise how messed up that person you were with really was. It is a really hard lesson to have learnt but let’s hope that we grow from it. Even all the stuff they say about their ex’s, it all makes perfect sense when you walk away. Sure, the spaths ex’s probably didn’t behave in a “normal” manner, perhaps crazy, but their lives were spiralling out of control and being manipulated by a sociopath. I understood the spaths ex better after this experience and I have comfort in knowing that I wasn’t the his only victim.
hey ex def an s its hard but it gets better everytime i think about how harsh she was with her mouth, it now reminds me of how sick she is . i recently talked to her about the desease of SOCIOPATHY and she seemed interested , i told her about the research that im doing regarding sociopathic behavior in relationships. one day im gonna sit her down with me and have her read some post maybe it will jar a positive reaction but , KEEP IT MOVIN IS THE POLICY. im gonna have to stop having sex with her because im sure she.s sleeping around …… im not going out that way HIV is very nasty i know somebody who.s dying from it now
& those words would be seize & healthy….damn typo’s!
hey guys this is realnice guy wishing all the fathers a happy fathers day. im going to spend the day at the beach the waterway to my soul. bless you guys, we need each other
I every time used to read post in news papers but now as I am a user
of net thus from now I am using net for content, thanks to web.
I have been with mine 32 years and as I have said before its hell on earth. We are still together, he wont go, I am working on getting everything together to politely ask him to leave once again if not I will take legal action. One thing I have noticed is they are all the same. Last summer we were all having a normal day and when everyone left he accused me of having an affair (not true) it was him trying to have an affair with the wife of the person he was accusing me of having an affair. I checked phone records, she didn’t go for him and he heard her and I make plans to go somewhere that following Friday..(it was wishful thinking on my part because I have never even been shopping without him) not allowed. EVER. when they left we got into an argument and he was accusing me of all types of things he pushed me (first time) and I fell against butcher block hurt my hand, arm and back of head. Long story short he says he is getting me an apartment with our son the only still living at home (hes 24) and that he is going to rent himself a room. My middle child says he will take my apt where I was living. My husband gets happy decides he will stay in basement and live with our middle child. Well when my middle child sent him a text with rules and regulations of living in the dame house he was not happy. He ends up worming his way back into my life saying he is sorry and that he will get help. Understand at this point I didn’t realize he was a Sociopath. He starts going for therapy and about after 6 sessions the therapist says she wants to meet me. I go …with in 2 minutes she realized everything he had said to her was a lie. He said we were separated, that I fooled around badmouthed me to no end she called him on it and let him have it. He never went back…he was calm for a bit but has started again if its not a kid across the street staring at me when I sit on the front porch its I stop traffic. so I stopped going out front. I sit be kitchen window and feed cardinals and have a cigarette now he claims theres a naked man in the window 2 back yards away. Me therapist says he is Sociopath and suffers from delusional disorder. I keep coming back here to read and see so many similarities. Just a few more weeks and hopefully I will be able to move forward. He just wont go away..
Hi Mariagone67 🙂
Your amazing & I hope you realize that!
Staying with a disordered mind for 32 years is a huge battle & I know how hard it is when you have made a life & created a home & have children etc…to get away from the insidious nature of the beast!
Please know that you are not a loser or that your battle has gone unnoticed as you have done your best to overcome a very controlling & manipulative & engulfing man.
Staying is much harder than going as I can attest & the fact that you are contemplating freeing yourself is wonderful.
It’s not easy, never was but, it does get better.
You are worth the peace of mind you will rightfully receive once out of his clutches.
Life doesn’t suddenly drop a better option in your lap, you do.
The peace I have away from the disordered mind is actually amazing & terribly freeing & liberating.
People think having someone is better than no-one at all but, not having a disordered mind game you senseless is the ‘gift’you give yourself.
I am much happier inside & free to think & take responsibility for me &, whilst that hasn’t been a walk in the park, I find that peaceful place & I sit & feast on the picnic that is life!
Focus on you & your life without his delusions, now that’s paradise 🙂
Love & light 🙂
PR xoxo
Thank you for your words of wisdom. Staying is definitely harder, as to not allowing him to use the boys as a tool is a moot point as I discovered a digital voice recorder taped under our dining room table yesterday. Which means every conversation I have had with my sons when they visit or any conversation with friends on phone have been recorded. I did not confront him but I did play a song that is on I believe facebook (I am a liar ,an Ozzy Osbourne song) so I think he knows I know about recorder. I cant even look at him, I got home from work yesterday and went straight to bed at 630 pm and pretended to be asleep. I am Furious, that he feels he has the right to do something like that and think it is ok. These are our children I am having conversations with. I don’t interfere in his relationship with our children. Today the recorder is not there, I have a feeling its in my car and will search before I go home. Should I confront him? onto the recorder I also read the article from this blog about sociopaths wanting people to believe that there partner is doing to them what they are indeed themselves doing, so I think he must have got the hint, but his mind is so warped it probably went over his head and wondered who I was talking about. I guess im just venting..thank you
Hi All,
It has been a month since I ended my on, off 5 year relationship. I can’t thank you enough for being here. You are amazing.
I am reading comments of so many of us in such similar pain. It breaks my heart for us all.
Today I had an encounter with one of his other girls and I noticed that my heart didn’t beat faster, my stomach didn’t turn over, the voice was there in my head, but quieter…..I know that even though he is now in a relationship with his new source, he is still cheating with his other girls….
I know how that feels, that used to be me!!
But today it isn’t, thanks to you guys.You are amazing……
3 years ago, I first broke up with him, when I was told that he had moved in with his new date, while still seeing me all the time. I wouldn’t see him..
I woke up at 1.30am in the morning with him naked at the end of my bed,
we were having sex within seconds……I spent the first 10 minutes think OMG HE is raping me..This is bad.All the time he was telling me how much he loved me, couldn’t live without me etc………I gave in…..I have tortured myself with HOW? WHY? My Dad was dying and all that made me vulnerable, but I think the truth maybe that I just couldn’t believe the truth. The truth was so out there, so bad, that I had to be wrong?
I couldn’t face it……
So I have no judgement on the girls that are back with him even though it all got exposed, or the woman who thinks she is in a committed relationship with him, because I was the same.
BUT Thanks to you guys, I am not there today.
I encountered one of them today, and I feel so blessed, so lucky…..I know I am healing.
It does get better……Bit by bit we can do this…..We do not want them back, so forward is the only way.
Good luck to all of you brave wonderful ladies….
And thank you so much for this site.
We are survivors.
Love and laughter
@realniceguy…..definitely stop having sex with her. It isn’t just the diseases you can catch if she is sleeping around, but the “sex bond” that is created as well can make it harder to detach from the situation. Sex can be used as a weapon by a Sociopath because of the attachment it creates and draws you back in. When it comes to a Sociopath, you should stop having sex with her before she throws you away and makes you feel confused or starts withholding sex (this happened to me and it was extremely confusing, I was his girlfriend, helping him financially but I was lucky to get a hug from him. He was like taking from one hand but not giving with the other). I think sometimes that is the only way to handle a Sociopath, always be one step ahead of them.
ii agree whole heartedly im doing really well because i dont have any dependency on her emotionally anymore , i know that i cant trust her, she,s ready researching her next victim on SOCIAL MEDIA. i mean she.s on there everyday. but anyhow im so thankful for this site because i can see right through her now, you were right she throws out little feelers to see if im still interested. but im preparing my final exit.and im plannning to go back to school in september so things are really looking up,,,. im so thankful for you guys.we really all your post gave me so much clarity im whole again ,,, anyway im getting there but thanks
I met my sociopathic (psychopathic) ex husband in 2012. He picked me out of a crowd and zeroed in on me at a public event I was at with a friend. He reocgnized her from college 8 or 9 years before and started chatting her up until she introduced me to him. I should have trusted my initial gut reaction to him-that he grinned to widely for my liking and had an overtly sexual vibe that shouldn’t be trusted. He told me later that he picked up on my being put off by him when I initially avoided him and so he tried another approach later in the evening. At that point he came across as innocent and awkward to me and was able to engage me in conversation and what I have later learned was expert mirroring which continued through the first few months of what became a relationship and whirlwind marriage and lovebombing which all abruptly ended when I became pregnant and he thought he had total control. Unfortunately for him both his exgf nd his brother came to me at different times during my tumultuous pregnancy and let me know that both he and other memebers of his family were sociopathic and that I wasn’t crazy. This led to me confronting him and a loss of his control over me. Being hormonal a.d pregnant also gave.me much more gusto and rage over the abuse I had endured which had been emotional passive aggressive financial and gas lighting type abuse. Once I got angry and stood upnfor my self and confronted how he treated me and he knew he had no control (I had also revealed what his ex gf brother and even mother had said about him) he started to get verbally abusive and criticized the way I looked and called me duragatory names until I would snap and the whole ordeal would get blamed on me and I would be called unstable and crazy. I got progressively more depressed during the pregnancy and he even encouraged me to kill myself. I eventually turned the depression back outwards I to anger and rage for how I wad being treated. The fighting escalated and I move back into my own home. He didn’t have the job or income he boasted about and had lied about being able to support me and the child he had conned me into getting pregnant with. I was devastated but was tired of being either angry and in hormonal rages or else depressed. He admitted he was cold hearted and had no empathy. He admitted to conning me but said it was my fault for.being so naive as to trust him. We tried marriage counseling. I got an individual coumselor who told me to get away fast…hat he was pathological and would never change and would only change me and.my life in a bad way. I kept away with no contact beginning in my second trimester when I felt a lot mote stable. This was after fathers day of last year when he had punched me several times while I was sitting in my car, in my inner thighs breasts and stomach becasuse I confronted him about sabotaging my work and income so that he could manipulate me moving back into his house which his parents owned.andnhe paid no rent on and pretended to farm the land around in his delusional peterpan world. It was too much for him to be confronted and to lose control over me again. He went to his father that fathers day and told he changed his mind about family life and came back and told.me the same and said I should move away to live with my parents in another state. I kept no contact until the end of August when I was stupid enough to go to his house when ie said.he would not be here to get some of my things. At this point he did his best seductive stare down depsote the fact that I was angry and crying and kept getting closer and closer and trying to make eyecontsct and hug me. After about an hour of me refusing and crying and telling him how horrible he was he just smiled and stared and said i needed food and water and rest….I should have known this was bs Bc he never once cared for my health or wellbeing since I had become pregnant. In fact he food away from me and refused to care for.me or have any consideration. At all for.months. it was always all about him after the honeymoon stage. He then moved in hard in the kitchen once my guard was down and started kissing and touching g and hugging me like he did in the past and telling me he loved me. This resulted in me getting brainwashed and hoovered back in in my hormonal and vulnerable state. We had sex for hours that day until the bonding hormones set back in. I stayed with him for several days and he seemed to be wonderful again, but deep down I knew better and ignored my intuition once again. On August 4 th of last year when I was 26 weeks pregnant we had sex in the morning and he was very rough and agressive with me despite me protesting. I eneded upn collapsing on my stomach witb him on my backside and yelling out before he finally stopped. I am a very small person and was in pain vaginally and was crushed as well. I was upset but blew it off and laid down to read after he went to his pt 15 hour per week job. He had two degrees and yet no motivation to find a real job depsite having a child on the way and telling me when we married that hewas on brink of beginning his carreer and was already a successful permaculturist-wjich was not at all true as I found out once the first spring rolled around and I was already pregnant. In reality he had a free place to live that should have been a farm but was just a bunch ofnweeds and unfinished projects and a black thumb to boot. He even killed one of my dogs, poisoned another, and had killed hundreds of chickens through starvation and exposure because of neglect during winters when they stopped laying eggs ans were no good to him I was told by acquaintences of his. He always had an excuse for these occurencds and why it was accidental and.not his fault or in the case of he chickens a lie by people out to get him. This brings.us back to the pregnancy….so later that day after the sexual assault on me after I got up from recovering and went back to my own house my water broke. I was 26 weeks pregnant and drove myself to the emergency room. I was rushed to a high risk hospital immediately and stabilized and was put on bed rest for the remainder of.my pregnancy. My husband and his.mother were there hovering acting as if nothing g was wrong or tonworry about as soon as I was admitted. No empathy and inappropriate behavior made my.family who rushed there and hospital staff suspicious over my hudband. The hospital kept asking about abuse after incidents where my husband acted inappropriately and I was upset. One time he screamed at me and this aroused suspicions furtherl. I asked that he and his family leave me alone to rest and they could not keep boundaries. They all started acting out in various ways and I was under.much stress and emotional turmoil. I enede up with placental abruption hemmorraging and delivering at 30 weeks and spent time recovering from a c section and being with my son daily in the NICU for the next two months while dealing with the bombardment of my then estranged husband and his cultish large family. Even his mother whom I.had trusted became invasive and pushed my boundaries and seemed rather brainwadhed and controlled by her husband who came to visit and forced hugs and physical contact like his son. My ex was standoffish and angry towards me and acted.like he didn’t want to be there and told me again to move away with family. Meanwhile he was playing the victim and getting attention for he birth of his child. He refused to add his name to the birth certificate when I handed it to him. Since then he has told people i left his name off and ran off with his son. He has neglected to pay child support until his famiy found out recently when they demanded to see the baby and were told the truth. He then hurriedly paid one month and threatened recourse if his parents and grandparents didn’t get to see the baby. He only cares about appearances and not his son sadly. After reading extensively about sociopaths and psychopaths during and after this relationship I realized many more insidious things hat had been going on. I.could go on and on. The worst was when I asked him to fix a problem in m y
I had asked him to fix a problem in my basement laundrynroom and he left electrical cord instamding water where I needed to stand in order to pull the light switch cord on the ceiling. The lights came on and I realized whet danger I was in and got angry and accused him of trying to electricute me and the baby. He called me crazy and a bitch and said it was an accident. I realized later after realizing the extent of his psychopathy that this wasn’t an accidnrt ans neither were the deaths of dogs cats and chickens. Former friends of his pointed out his obsession with death and his pretentious philosophic musings on facebook about his morbid fascinations. They also told me about hisnobsession with poisons psychoactive drugs and other secrets he had. This really explained who he really was behind the charming smiling happy go lucky guy. He was really a sadistic egomaniac in delusions of grandeur who was obsessed with his misunderstandings of existential philosophy and was constantly experimenting with psychedelic drugs because he always needed some kind of stimulation in his unhappy misanthropic void. Why he fixated on me and thought he could maintain a wife and child is puzzling…other than like his father and grandfather before him he wanted to feel normal and seem normal to others and to have companionship and human possessions. I am just glad I got away and didn’t stay to raise 5 kids with a psychopathic husband in misery like his mother did. I currently have all custody of my child and have offered his family supervised visits but am nervous about where things will go from here and if my family and I will be left alone. Sorry for typos. I’m on a difficult device for typing.
Correction to first post Sept 4th not August. Also clarification. To above post…not just an electrical cord but a whole powerstrip attached to several was laying in puddle of water. I am also suspicious of infest in his family. Emotional most defoitely but there are bizarre physical boundaries or lack thereof and inappropriate sexualization of female members by male.I have heard my Ex’s father sexualize and talk about their neighbors young daughters playing baked in his house while he watched. He was drunk and rambling at a family event when I went to get my coat and leave because the drinking was out of hand. The neighbor girls and their parents had just left. My ex and his 11 years younger sister kiss lingeringly on the mouth and fondle each other publicly including her climbing in him shiftless at family Christmas morning celebration with her shirt pulls up over her bra asking for him to caress ber back. At one point he called me her name in a sexual situation. The very worst have thingg I have seen by far is what caused me to immediately move at the beginning of the year to Texas and swear to supervised visits. One morning after my ex had showed up to visit the baby the night before and had insisted on staying the night because his new electric car (mind you he ia neglecting child support at this point) couldn’t make it back home he claimed. The baby woke up early and he he volunteered to take over. I had let him stay in the guest room. I woke up a little later showered and went to go.get the baby to nurse. That is when I saw my ex in his underwear with an erection holding the baby with his back up against his crotch. He then said to me “he feels so good” . I did not show a reaction and took the baby and went into another room in shock. I Dod not allow him to be alone with him again and moved within a month. It took a long time for me to fully admit to myself much less anyone what i had seen. It was so shocking that I tried to rationalize it as a coincidnce but eventually came to terms. I knew not to leave the baby unattended with him and to get out of town without reacting and letting him know my plans to cut off most contact. This worked until April of this year when his family started putting pressure on him for visitation. Currently trying to mitigate the pitfalls of that and make sure everything is supervised. We were not legally married…the one thing my intuition guided me to do that I did, sonthat is a big plus as well as him not wanting to sign the birthcertificate. He has threatened to go to court if I don’t allow visits, so I have complied with his demands and hope that they do not escalate. He is very cheap when it comes to spending money on things other than material purchases for himself and impulsive in his wasteful spending on trivial things he wants so I doubt he will shell out money for a lawyer, but am still nervous. I wish I had gone to the police withmany of the incidents of abuse…especially when he tried to strangle me in a fight that happened just prior to memorial day 2013 while I was pregnant. I was in denial and was afraid and told only my family and his mother and opted for couples counseling at the urgingt of his mother. I really regret this and not heeding my intuition throughout the unfolding of the relationship. Hindsight is 20/20
I very much agree with Pos. He sounds very dangerous and it a wonder that you or the baby have not been tragically injured or worse yet. It is good that you have awaken to the danger he poses. I would recommend seeking out some legal advice on how to keep him and his family permanently away from you and your child. The danger is real and needs to be dealt with.
Lots of Love AGPT
Thank you AGPT
Hi survivormom he sounds like quite a dangerous psychopath.
They do fixate on people. If they like them, and then see fit to hold them captive like their possession. They see their partner as someone that they own. This man does sound dangerous.
@pr
Hope all is well. Things are good here.I was wondering if there is a way to send a private message to you via wordpress or some other way.
Lots of Love AGPT
Thanks for the advice and insights. My family has already found a lawyer and I live in a different state, so that is good. It took me so long to get through the cognitive dissonance that resulted from being constantly gaslighted and manipulated with on again off again charm. He was so charming gentle amd sweet at the beginning of relationship and would bring that guy back whenever I left after periods of shunning, ignoring, and putting me down and having no consideration for my needs and feelings. It was a cat and mouse game to him. I read your blog about the mask of charm and charisma recently an he is most definitely a distempered type of sociopath. Very sadistic and controlling, but covertly so, so it was very crazy-making. There was a lot of passive agressive covert abuse and when I would call it out and get angry and emotional about he would get even more abusive in an overt way and the abuse became verbal an physical. I think this is how he reacted to losing control
Thanks for the advice and insights. My family has already found a lawyer and I live in a different state, so that is good. It took me so long to get through the cognitive dissonance that resulted from being constantly gaslighted and manipulated with on again off again charm. He was so charming gentle amd sweet at the beginning of relationship and would bring that guy back (the guy who I had been convinced was my soulmate, even though I had never previously believed in such a thing) whenever I left after periods of shunning, ignoring, and putting me down and having no consideration for my needs and feelings. It was a cat and mouse game to him. I read your blog about the mask of charm and charisma recently an he is most definitely a distempered type of sociopath. Very sadistic and controlling, but covertly so, so it was very crazy-making. There was a lot of passive agressive covert abuse and when I would call it out and get angry and emotional about he would get even more abusive in an overt way and the abuse became verbal an physical. I think this is how he reacted to losing control of me when I would wise up and confront him.
HI survivor mum, you sound like you have been through so much. To be with a sadistic psychopath is the most dangerous experience. I wonder how you are coping? Do you have signs or symptoms of Post Traumatic stress disorder and if so, are you getting treatment for it (as I wouldn’t be surprised if you did after what you have been through).
I think that I might have se PTSD , but am dealing well with it because when I was younger I was sexually assaulted (15 years ago) and learned to recognize the symptoms deal with that kind of thing back then through therapy. My baby is doing great and has been a source of positivity for me as I can focus on him and enjoy caring for him. The worst thing I have to deal with that brings up the ex issues is having to skype with J (my ex) when he feels like seeing the baby. I feel compelled to do this to placate him as well as offer visits supervised by my family if he ever chooses to come and visit (which he probably won’t) because I don’t want to deal with him filling or paternity and getting any legal rights. I know I am doing his out of fear, but I am hoping I can stall him for a while until I get on my feet and can move far far away, perhaps to another country. I don’t know if this is rational, but I get afraid and think of doing this when I sometimes lay awake at night and worry. Seeing him on skype really brings the anxious emotions and fear up, and anger. The emotional attachment to him is gone though, thank goodness! It is nice to just have the dread and fear only, as heartbreak intermingled with dread and fear was pretty chaotic and confusing.
One thing I would try is to gradually lose contact via Skype by setting my status to offline or better yet actually going offline(so as to not see his icon all the time) for long periods of time. If he confronts on this I would claim the responsibilities of parenthood are making it difficult to get any time for being at the computer. Hopefully, he will move on to the next target and forget about you. It sounds like he does not want to be a father and only keeps up contact because of his parents. Not being online might give him the cover to deflect his parents.
Agree that you don’t want to give him a reason to truly ask to the court that his parentage be established via testing. However, he knows if he goes that route the courts will also impose child support payments on him. From what you said of his miserly nature that should act as a large deterrent for him. I am sorry that you have to go through all of this.
Lots of Love AGPT
If I was successful in reducing contact and I did not hear from him in, say, 6 months I would then close my Skype account and establish a new one. If he contacted me in the future with his parental rights threats I would have my lawyer inform him that we would be seeking back due child support payments as part of the same proceedings in lump sum form. That should make him back up.
He is dangerous but you don’t have to have an inordinate amount of fear. He has now lost a primary advantage. You know what he is. The element of surprise is gone. You can take all appropriate steps to counter him. It sounds like you have a supporting family and they can prove instrumental in keeping you safe also.
I totally agree with AGPT idea. It will be hard but in the long run it will be wor it’s your safety if your child is the most important and I wouldn’t want this molester near my child. His behaviour is weird and I would never want that kind of person around my child.
I have a question for all. We have an ex friend who is married to a sociopath. He has disowned many of his family members and others come and go out of their lives because of his wife’s behaviour. Last night I was with family and we were talking about this women and man. I said that “he has disowned his own family as well because of her.” When my cousins husband replied “but he has his own family now.” To me, I don’t think this is right. I will always want my mum and dad in my life, even if I do have my own family. I just don’t think is is a positive way to think or live. When he said that I questioned that maybe I am not thinking right about family. Or maybe he isn’t from a close family and doesn’t understand. I have never been married or have kids so maybe I don’t understand but I wouldn’t want a partner to come into my life and I disown my family like a sociopath makes you do. These are blood relatives that will always be there for you and you need them more than anything when you end a relationship with a sociopath. Would love your honest thoughts about this.
Thanks for the advice about weaning off the contact. The problem is is that I maintained absolutely no contact Jan-April and then (I assume) his family urged him to start sending checks and demanding contact, which he chose to do through threats for legal action. I am afraid if he gains any legal rights then there might be the chance of unsupervised visits and even the far off chance of shares or partial custody. I NEVER want my son alone with either him or his family. He sent a check for May and June. I told him the June one got lost in the mail and don’t plan on cashing it and hope that he will stop sending the checks because he will want to keep the money in his account more than he will want to continue making demands. My parents took the baby to the zoo for a few hours with his parents and grandparents while we were visiting our family in Colorado with the baby this month to get the threats to stop. I don’t think they knew there were threats made (perhaps my Ex’s father, the patriarch sociopath urged him though?) and thought it was just a nice gesture. I guess I am just doing all this to avoid legal rights for my ex which will also dictate where I can live and prevent me from leaving the country or moving further away once he has them, as well as giving him possible unsupervised time with my son. It is really difficult and I can’t wait to just talk to the lawyer and get it all sorted out soon. This is in my mind constantly, and I always worried. Oh, I also always keep my status as invisible, but he has said every Sunday he wants to Skype and sometimes I say I can’t and have avoided it for a few weeks, but am afraid he will start with the threats again.
Hi Survivor Mom 🙂
Please know you are among many Mom’s & indeed we are all survivors & warrior women 🙂
It’s an incredibly tough road but, know at some point it does get better but, it can take years….fight on for your eventual freedom.
Record every interaction & do what you have to do to keep yourself & your child safe. You are not alone, we are many & we are all thinking of you 🙂
Stay strong, keep going & never ever doubt you deserve better.
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
Hi everyone.
This is my first post. I’m a male victim of a female sociopath. I will not use her real name here, but will instead call her Laura.
Here’s how it started. In early February she emailed me on a well-known dating site. I was interested. She seemed perfect. She seemed to have it all — grace, charm, sophistication, style, elegance, intelligence, and wit. In her late 30s, she was exceptionally attractive – a real stunner, a 9 or a 10 physically. A short fit blonde. A trophy wife business type. The type of woman you would expect to see married to the CEO of a Fortune 500 company.
We had a lunch date in early February and immediately hit it off. A few days later we had drinks and she started kissing me as I was showing her to her car. A few days later we had our first “real” date. She wore a garter belt and stockings under her short skirt — articles of clothing she explained that could get a man to do anything she wanted. We had sex that night. I was a bit surprised by the way she dressed and by how nonchalant she was about our first sexual experience. She seemed to have an all-too-good understanding of how her appearance and sexuality could be exploited to get what she wants from men.
That was perhaps the first red flag. I discovered several other red flags over the course of several weeks. I asked her questions about her life. She explained that she had been divorced for about a year from a very wealthy and much older man who, as the story goes, had been paying for her to live in a condo in Southern California between 2007 and 2012 but, when he cut her off financially, she moved back to Las Vegas (where I live) and filed for divorce. She claimed to have been victimized in the divorce by her ex. She said her ex had hidden, gambled, or otherwise wasted all of his assets to assure she would get nothing in the divorce. Other than monthly child support, the court only required her ex to take out a $1 million life insurance policy on himself. The premiums are $8,000 every three months due to his age and poor health. She explained that if her ex stops paying the premiums the policy will lapse and she will get nothing. She stated that she was working on getting others to come up with the premium payments if her ex husband does not pay.
I asked what she did for a living. She explained that she does not work because: (a) she has a substantial “nest egg” she is sitting on; (b) her daughter is 7 and she wants to spend time with her; and (c) she takes her daughter back and forth each day to a school that is far away. She also explained that she was living in a house her parents inherited from her grandparents when they passed away so that her living expenses were cheap being limited to utilities, taxes, and insurance. She told me that, to make extra money, she sells things on several Facebook “yard sale” pages from her home. I later learned that she does this using a fake name that is very close to the last name of her last boyfriend, a wealthy and much older attorney. She justified her use of the fake name as a measure she needed to take to protect herself since strangers come to her house to pick up the things she sells on Facebook. I later learned that she has not worked for the last 12 years.
Other red flags.
She often would text me photos of herself. I noticed that some of them were not recent. In one picture she is actually wearing her ex boyfriend’s long sleeve dress shirt with nothing on underneath and the shirt unbuttoned. I thought it was very strange that she would send that to me.
She was ALWAYS on her smartphone texting and messaging people. Her convenient explanation was that since she sold things through Facebook, she was always messaging. But one night after she thought I was asleep, she got out of bed to go into the living room to sit on the couch and text someone. When I went out into the living room to see what she was doing, she was so startled that she nearly jumped off of the couch. She gave me some story about a male “friend” of hers being in town because his parents were dying.
One day a strange post appeared on her Facebook page. It looked like a post she had written. It said: “[Laura] is cutting deals and is full of surprises for everyone.” The post was directed to me and three of her male Facebook “friends.” About a half hour later she posted “password changed.” A little while after that, she deleted the posts. Later that evening when I asked her what that was all about she first acted like she did not know what I was talking about. Then she explained that someone who was formerly her friend who was no longer her friend had hacked her Facebook account and made the post. I did not push for a further explanation because I did not want it to escalate into an argument.
The Seduction Phase.
The seduction phase was amazing. She love-bombed me constantly. Sending me nice texts, making me dinner every night, and having lots of sex. She also came up with fun things for us to do with her daughter, who I bonded with. She asked me in subtle ways about my income and debts. We talked about getting married and buying our own house. Interestingly, she told me that one day her ex-boyfriend (the wealthy older attorney) had stopped by her house to beg and plead for her to get back together with him. I asked her what she said to him. She said she told him that she had moved on and that she no longer lives alone. His reply was something like “wow you move fast.”
Ruining.
In late March I was spending so much time with her that I moved all of my clothes and toiletries into her place. I was, for the most part, not living at my house. At about the same time, my mother who has cancer decided to sell her condo because she could no longer get up and down the stairs. I moved my mother into my house. After that occurred, Laura told me that I had let my 78 year old mother manipulate me into giving her my house, and that I should move her out into an apartment because she (Laura) needed to be the first priority in my life. I was so taken aback by these comments that it took me a few days to process them. During that time I was upset and distant, and she sensed it. That week I noticed she was taking a lot of new selfies and posting them on her Facebook page as her profile photo and that she was more focused on her appearance than normal. We had a follow-up conversation a few days later where I basically told her that I had known her for 3 months and my mother for over thirty years and she could be sure that my mother would come first. I also told her I was not sure that the relationship could continue, given the statements she made. And I brought up my suspicions that she was texting other men. She got angry and claimed that she would never do that. I apologized for accusing her of that since I had no real evidence that she was doing anything behind my back with other men. She had sex with me that night.
Discard #1.
Three days later on 5/24, after making me breakfast and telling me she loved me, she told me to move out seconds after he ex picked up her daughter for visitation at 10:00 a.m. I said “when do you want that to happen?” She said “right now.” I asked her to explain. The only explanation I got was my snoring was keeping her up at night, that she just “didn’t want this,” and that there were “a million other things.” I moved out and back into my house with my mom. I was crushed.
Not really sure what really prompted the discard.
We get back together.
Over the next several days I sent Laura several love letters and poems via email. I texted my undying love for her. I told her there was nothing I would not do if she would only take me back. I told her there was no insurance premium I would not pay if she would only take me back. On 6/3 I sent her a gigantic bouquet of flowers. She agreed to meet me so we could talk the next day. I met her and she said she loved me and wanted me back. I asked her what her concerns were. She said I needed to get surgery to correct my snoring. She said I needed to move my mom out of my house so I could sell my house and so she and I could get a bigger house together and be a family with her daughter. And she said I needed to pay off my credit card balance. I agreed to do all of these things.
We went out on a date then next night 6/5 to an expensive restaurant at the Wynn. Then, on 6/6, my birthday, I arrived at her place after work. She was wearing a long, blonde hair extension that I had never seen her wear before. It made her look over-the-top attractive, but in a very escort-ish sort of way. She took me to a Japanese restaurant in a strip mall. After dinner we went back to her place. After her daughter went to bed, she emerged from her bathroom wearing a Venetian-style mask, and a sexy black nightgown (hair extensions still in place). I stayed the night until the next morning, Saturday, 6/7. Then I left as planned because I had several things to do that day. I met my mom and brother for dinner and was done with them by 6:30 p.m., but the Soc. was not responding to my texts, and did not respond until well after 10:00 p.m. that night. This led me to believe she was out with someone else. The next day, Sunday, she invited me to spend the day with her at her parents’ house to swim in their pool. The day went well. After swimming we went to her place and I stuck around until 10 p.m. or so with her and her daughter. Then I went home to my house.
Each of the next four days, Monday through Thursday, she would text me in the late afternoon while I was at work and would invite me to come over to spend the evening with her and her daughter. Thursday 6/12, she had been out looking at houses for us to buy and sent me floor plans and photos.
Discard #2.
But when Friday 6/13 came around, she did not text me, did not invite me over, and did not respond to my texts until late that evening. When she did respond, she claimed she did not know I was expecting to hear from her. I was pissed because she had completely blown me off. I sent her a text that pointed out that we had spent every other evening that week together and that I thought that would continue. The text was pointed but not rude or nasty. I also said that it seemed obvious that she either did not want to see me that evening or that she had something better to do.
She did not respond at all the next two days (Saturday 6/14 or Sunday 6/15).
I sent her an email on Monday 6/16 saying that I thought we were back together and working things out. She responded by deflecting the conversation away from her having blown me off on 6/7 and 6/13 and accused me of not being “able to stay away from” the female paralegal I work with and often go to lunch with. (I had told her weeks ago that I do this and that it was strictly platonic). Since this was an outrageous statement and false, I responded and told her so. [False jealousy?] She replied with an email that said only that she was “exhausted of trying to teach [me] what boundaries are in every area of [my] life.” Nevertheless, I told her that I would stop having business lunches with the paralegal if that would make her feel better. I found this site that day, 6/16. Thank God. I have been reading it every day.
We had no communication on Tuesday 6/17. I did, however, keep my appointment with the snoring doctor, who did not recommend surgery.
On Wednesday 6/18, I texted her and asked her how she could tell me she loved me one day and then stop communicating with me the next. I told her I was working on all of the issues she identified, the snoring, my mother, and the credit card balance. She responded by referring to the “nasty” text I had sent her on 6/13, saying that she was “sick of the drama” I had created any the “emotional fragility” I displayed when I could not reach her the prior Friday evening 6/13 or the Saturday evening a week before that 6/7. She said: “I’m done” and that “Love should not be so difficult. I’m exhausted.”
I feel like she discarded me this time because she did not have a good explanation for blowing me off on 6/7 and 6/13 or did not want to be honest and tell me that she was out with someone else.
Aftermath
I feel like my heart has been ripped out and discarded like trash. The pain has been absolutely awful. I’m a sensitive guy, so this really hurts bad. I have been unable to sleep and have been crying every day. I have a knot in my stomach that will not go away. I thought she was the love of my life. I thought we were going to get married and have a family. Those dreams have all been crushed. I look at her pictures but it only makes it worse.
In hindsight, I believe she has no “nest egg” (that this was a lie — otherwise why sell stuff out of your garage on Facebook?) and that she is simply searching for a man with a good income that she can exploit.
I have been struggling with no contact. I made it a day 6/20, and then broke down, sending her emails on 6/21 and today 6/22 professing my love for her and writing her love poems. Fortunately I have not heard back from her. I see she is active again on the dating sites, no doubt searching for her next victim. I have read this site from top to bottom. My head knows she’s wrong for me. But my heart does not. I am afraid that if she called me and said “come over,” that I would do just that. In my mind she was the perfect woman, but now the mask has come off and I have to keep telling myself that it was all a lie, that it was not real. I have to know that if she is kind to me that it is not kindness, only an act to hide her lies and rage.
Thanks for this wonderful site. It is so helpful to have some clarity on these issues.
Hi VictimX
Stay Strong. No Contact is hard at first but once removed from the whirlwind for awhile you will be able to see things in a much clearer light. Take it from another target of a female socio who is about 9 months out.
You already have pointed out many red flags but other elements of your story point to even more. When the emotions subside, your logic and reasoning coupled with the knowledge gained from this site will make even more things clear. There will come a day you will look back and ask yourself ” What was I smoking?”
True love doesn’t generally ask you to get your finances in order or not take care of your filial responsibilities to make it blossom. It sounds like you just dodged a bullet although I fully understand it doesn’t feel that way now. Again stay strong and try to maintain no contact.
Lots of Love AGPT
Maybe you’re just clingy.
I have posted before- when I first found this site. I have continued to read comments, but hAve struggled with my own situation. I find similarities and also sometimes feel like my ex Is also different. I am at a point where I feel like I’m ready to move on. But with no one who understands (offline) except his mother… I am in need of an outlet.
I often wonder if many of your ex’s have an actual diagnosis. Or if they are just terrible people. Sometimes I feel like my situation is different because he has an actual diagnosis, and we are all aware. Sometimes he is in denial, and other times I’ve sat in the floor and cried with him… because he tries to change- and always submits to the urges.
It’s been nearly two years. The first year I was a victim, in the dark… constantly let down, and then he would make up for it and make me forget all the pain. He is a socio to the “T” but when his mom sat me down and showed me some books, and explained his diagnosis… things changed. I have been through 2 suicide attempts with him, one on birthday. Later to find out the reasons he was trying to end his life– were crimes he committed while I was not around.
He is currently in jail. Awaiting a sentence to prison. Possibly 8 years. I believe he deserves to go… But I’m still heart broken. It’s hard because I’m on the “inside” he knows I won’t fall for his games. And also that I love him unconditionally. In the first year, he took me for money… once aware of his mental state- he paid me back in full. He confides his most terrible crimes to me. Nothing violent. Mostly conning people out of large sums of money.
He owned his own house, paid in full. Comes from a wealthy family. 2 vehicles paid off. Very smart. Responsible. Took very good care of his home and dogs. Did a lot for me. Had a ton of friends. Best sense of humor. And loves the best way he can. Even without empathy, he always tried. He is good looking, well kept. But he got on drugs- and all the control he had over his disorder went to shit.
Now that he is in jail and sober…. he is back to being who I fell in love with. Still running games in jail I’m sure. But working in there, applied for welding school, and not getting in trouble. Everyone has had enough of his crap, so his mom and I are his only contact. I have kids- so twice a month I visit him- when they are with their dad.
I am very responsible. Never even had a ticket. Worked for the same company since I was 19, ( 28 now) raise 2 kids with no family, or financial/gvmt help. Even the guards at the jail joke with me, asking if I’m lost. Sometimes I think I just hang on bc it’s easier than being alone. But I am alone. But at least he’s someone to talk to. I have great friends, work at a local bar ( like cheers) during the day. Those people are like family. But mostly everyone thinks I let him go a year ago.
I’ve recently started ignoring his collect calls. I just feel like he needs me, but can offer nothing. Originally he was offered 2 years- which would be less than a year with his time already served. Part of me thinks I wouldn’t even wait that long,, Def not 8! His mom and I cleaned out his house and selling it. I’ve done so much. And because i wanted to. But now I don’t want to do all this work. But I do love him. Makes it so hArd when he does bad things to others, that morally I don’t agree with. But has never said a bad word towards me. Once we apologized for our past problems, we have never done wrong to each other.
There is a chance his charges could be dropped, and he could be home soon. He has made a lot of changes, and wants to go back to therapists regularly when he gets out. He totally accepts how his brain works. And is smart enough to control it. Just sometimes chooses to lose control. Especially when frustrated with his disorder. Everything on these sites/books says to run! But if a sociopath accepts who he is, and tries to be good- isn’t he worth loving?? I have made many mistakes in my life. And have loved many people, including myself, with addictions… Sometimes dating a sociopath is like that for me. He relapses, and tries again.. the first 100 pages of the book “emotional vampires” I really related to.
Part of me is ready to let go. But part of me thinks he can change… with therapy that he’s willing to take. And a supportive family who doesn’t take any of his games. But there’s such a risk he will let us all down. But he loves his control- and if he ever gets in trouble again, he will be gone for good. Might I add, the only crimes he got caught for were when he was using methamphetamine, when we were broken up for a few months. His other crimes were more of cons, where he talked people into giving him property or money.
Back and forth, I go. So hard to love someone like this. All these stories about them abandoning you… Sometimes make me think would be easier. I am resilient. Very strong. I was hurt after the first year, before I was aware of the aspd. But I moved on. No contact was easy. I even dated someone else for a couple months. But somehow I changed from a victim to a confidante. And get to see the real him. Vulnerable and scary. But he trusts me. He even signed over power of attorney of all his assets, because he knew I would be fair.
But a life with him will always be work…. But sometimes I think it could possibly be worth it…. and then somewhere deep down, I know this is wrong. I’m not the type of girl to visit jails, bond people out, put up with a criminal. Or at least I wasn’t. And I never want my boys to think what he’s done is okay. Everyone has a past…. sorry so long, just at a loss. Even if I move on, I’m worried I will drop them as soon as he gets home. Or what if he gets out and becomes the man he wants to be— I will have done all this work, and wasted all this time, if I choose to give up now. I just keep waiting until I KNOW the answer… that’s why I continue to read this site, read books, watch shows about aspd.
Anyone else been with a sociopath who acknowledges his diagnosis, and works hard to change it? Or still mess up and try again???
Hi Kadeedenise,
It is funny that you write this comment today, as I was writing a post about this earlier today. I can really understand and relate to what you are saying. Sociopaths can form very strong attachments to someone if they value that person. This attachment and bond can become stronger, if they feel that the other person understands, and accepts them for who they are. if additional to this they have an indepth understanding of what they are, of who they are, they absolutely can try to ‘manage’ their behaviour.
You should know, that while yes, they can be protective of you, even obsessive of you, possibly care about you, more than anyone else ever has, it will always be dramatic, there will always be jealousy, control, often dominance, and the patterns of behaviour will continually repeat. He might not ever scam you, or do anything to you. However, be warned if you try to leave him and he doesn’t want this, you will see a different side.
If you are not taking his calls and are going no contact, I am surprised, that he didn’t flip and accuse you of seeing someone else etc etc… I have done exactly the same, the sociopath is still around in my life, and although I am going to be away for a week, when I return I am going to change direction with this blog. I wont change the things that I have written, but for the last year, he has worked, and has paid me back money that he owed me. He understands himself now. It doesn’t particularly change the way that he is. It can be incredibly hard work. But then – so can dating a non sociopath also. If the sociopath has respect for you, and they don’t for many people, they can treat you right – the danger is the flip side, which is ALWAYS there. It never goes away. It is sometimes like a sleeping dragon and you just know that the same thing will come around again.
Since writing this blog (and he read every word – because he is nosy and likes to keep tabs) he has tried to turn his life around. But – really he will never just be a ‘normal guy’ that isn’t realistic. He has some qualities that normal guys don’t have, nobody else would have my back like he does. As his connection to me, isn’t particularly based on ’emotions’ in some senses it is more stable, as it is based upon what is in his mind. With a regular guy they can just fall ‘out of love’ as long as the sociopath is mentally challenged, and accepted for who they are, they can still feel deeply attached to their partner.
You might want to read the posts can a sociopath love? and the other post can a sociopath love part 2 the sociopaths response, as there are a lot of comments from sociopaths who say their point of view.
Also, sociopaths are selfish, and manipulative. This is just in their nature. They like to be in control and to win. Is he still using drugs? I would be very wary around a sociopath with drug issues. They can be the most manipulative of all.
Really the questions you need to ask yourself are these:
How do you feel about yourself when you are around this person, how does he make you feel about you? (write those answers down)
Are you growing yourself with him in your life, or is your entire life focused upon his continual drama that he creates?
Is this a healthy relationship for your children – and how would they be affected?
I don’t have children at home, so my life it is just me affected. It isn’t easy at all. But then on the flip side, sometimes it is – incredibly so. You just never know what is going to come next. Sometimes it is problems in life, continually for no reason at all. Just that is the way that they are, and what they seem to attract. They have a low boredom threshold. So create drama just to stir things up.
With you, I think I would be more concerned about the impact on your children. Does this feel right to you? How do you really feel about it. So yes, in the last year the sociopath around in my life (for exactly a year now) has worked hard, he works long hours, he does try to amend his behaviour – doesn’t do things like stealing or being manipulative, he just works. But he does constantly have his dramas which I get tired of sometimes.
Wouldn’t it be a concern that their new behaviors are potentially just reflective of a new pathway of manipulation? and they are still seeing you as a source of supply, just from a different angle?
Reading this answer from you positiva to Kadeednice i have to admit that i felt a little confused. The impression that i got is that you say that you are stil in contact with the sociopath in your life and he now tries to make amendments to you and be a good person? if this is true i have to say that it is very interesting as what is stated in this blog is No Contact with these people. And if this guy is really around you playing the one that he tries to compensate then i can say that he is a master manipulator and he found the way to get onto you again despite all the deep undertanding that you have for this kind of severe pathology. i had a similar experience with the psycopath in my life that when i diagnosed him and he realised that he could not hide anymore he tried to play his last card that i am his confidant and he has a special attachment and relation to me. i knew always and it was evident during the 6 years of our relatonship that he valued and respected me as a person and as a woman more than any other in his life. He still does and always will as he incredilbly values me mentally. BUT this was not enough so to not deceive me in the most despicable way. And when i exposed him and confronted him with his deeds in a way not emotional and i played him in his game , he realised that he could not hide any more and that his lies were over. So then and only then he admitted his pathology . He always knew what he is and by this he tried to manipulate me and keep me in his life PLAYING THE CARD that only me can understand him , only me can stand by him mentally and bla, bla , bla.. well, all these were completely BS as me having the luck to have distance by him , i could see clearly through all his manipulation tactics. What is the reality is that i always presented a challenge to him due to my independed personality and after me diagnosing him and abandoning him, i became a bigger challenge so he had to conquer me all over again.
BUT i never went back though sometimes the confusion that he would create through his lies and tricks and fakery was not easy for me to clear. So if my initial assumption is right conserning your particular case, the only thing that i say is that after you created this blog that immensely helps every day so many victims of psycopaths/ sociopaths , you became a great challenge also for yours. So he would go to great lengths to have any impact in your life. And for sure he will try to play on your empathy and the ability to forget and forgive. Especially if he was a charismatic one and there was not emotional abuse, except of lying , stealing and smearing you. He tries to pay back the money that he stole for you in the first place? he works? great manipulation tactic indeed. He knows what would apply well for you. They are master manipulator and the best liars .That is only my prespective of course and i am not neither judgemental nor anything negative to you. Just a little anxious and confused i think. However , everybody makes his one desicions in life and has his one path.
Apart from the experience coming from the victims is very well stated from the ones that are top in reseach for them , how potentially dangerous these people can be for normal human beings with a conscience. Hare himself and a lot of top psychiatrists where conned by them and they had no emotional connection with them. And there is no treatment for them, they never change, this is told by the experts.
I dont think they are evil , and it doesnt make any difference how somebody labels them, evil, bad, disordered, sufferers, pitiful e.t.c. They are what they are , people without empathy , without consciense, so capable of anything. That alone speaks for itself.
By them….all of THEM….. we are OBJECTIFIED treated as a THING to USE…….what story do you tell yourself to make it ok for ANYONE to MISTREAT you?.
@agoodplantoday, it is always a concern. But less of a concern than you’d probably think. Maybe I should be more concerned, but oddly enough… I trust him in a different way than I do others. Without solid emotion- he says what he knows to be true, and actually admits to previous wrongdoings. He doesn’t make promises like he used to- because it’s his actions I look for. He has cut out everyone but his mom, myself, and his lawyer. That in itself is a major accomplishment. Time will tell.
@positivagirl, thank you for the response. The first one I totally relate to. As soon as I learned what aspd was- it was as if I had this craving to know EVERYTHING about it. And you never hear the other side. What a sociopath is like when they trust you. I have never met anyone like him. In both good and bad ways. But I will focus on the good today.
I did end up answering yesterday. He does not accuse me of anything when I don’t answer. He knows I’m busy with the kids. And work. He trusts me. He also knows it’s $5 per call, and if I don’t have anything to talk about, I will wait a day or two before answering. Gives me time to think, without his input. But I will admit, after answering, it is usually the best 20 min of my day.he has only shown thankfulness. Esp when I go to visit him. Does not ask for favors, or money, just happy that I have hung on. Now, I’ve had my breaking point also. And there’s times I have lost it. But ive made peace with the situation, and take it day by day. Sometimes minute to minute.
As far as drugs go, he has been clean almost 120 days… But that’s because he is in jail. His usage was mostly due to who he hung out with. He stayed clean anytime he was with me, but if drugs were around him- he’d do them with others. This will hAve to be discussed further soon his release. And coming from a daughter of 2 addicts- he knows I won’t put up with it any longer. All his usage was done in his garage- and that house is sold now. I truly believe he did drugs out of boredom, and they enhanced his personality disorder in the worst way possible. Thus, him getting “3 hots and a cot” since January.
How does he make me feel about myself?
He makes me feel special. He makes me realize things I never have about myself. I have been raising my kids alone since they were born. Non socios can walk out too. My mom committed suicide when I was 17- and 5months along with my oldest. My dad recovered crack cocaine addict, 3 years. He is my best friend and confidante. I had an amazing childhood- things fell apart when I was 15 or so. I’ve always felt resilient, and strong. But eventually life caught up and I isolated myself. Then I met j. I knew him for 6 years as a customer at the bar I work at. But he rarely drank. I don’t either- so we always chatted. Looking back, he saw me as the perfect victim. But something changed.
He builds me up, never cuts me down. Has never called me outside of my name. I have suffered from anxiety off and on for years- it’s gone with him. I feel protected and loved. Sometimes I think we work because I am SO emotionally driven, and he is driven off rational thinking. Although sometimes irrational actions ensue.
J makes me feel like a better me. He accepts my past, my children, and keeps me laughing. I used to think he was necessary to be that girl again. And then he went to jail. And I’ve learned to be that girl without him. Enjoying my life. I always know when I’m going off course- I stop writing, and stop listening to music. While he’s been gone, I’ve really indulged in those things, reading also. He is not the center of my life, that spot is taken.
As far as the kids go, he was always great with them. Teaching them things. One moment stands out for me, my kids were outside and I was getting onto my oldest. He tells me later that he thought I played favorites… And then it hit me…. I do. And I’ve learned to be more fair. He calls it like he sees it. And I am very blunt as well. The kids know him as my friend. I am very careful with that. He has many requirements before coming back in their life. They don’t even know he’s gone from their lives, because I didn’t let them around him very often. As with anyone I date… dating a single mom means taking a backseat.
I struggle with him being a role model. But aside from the petty crimes and drug use, he is a good man. Those things are such a small part of the amazing man he can be. His mom and I always say, he has the power to brighten or ruin your whole day by one sentence. Lots of choices to make.
Got a call this morning from his mom. Looks like he will be out next Friday. While I’m excited to hug him, and not have to look at him through glass. I’m worried it’s too soon.
I tend to ramble. But that’s the emotion in me. Even if no one understands,I’ve learned with him… I have to make my own choices. It’s easy for friends or outsiders to say I sound dumb. But no one knows the lessons he’s taught me. Funny how someone who can’t feel love, can teach someone how to do it.unconditional love is hard. Esp when the conditions are so daunting…
Kadeednise, of course he makes you feel well about yourself and your anxiety is gone and you feel better for yourself and very special. This is called mirroring , the first and best technic used from the sociopaths to gain love , attachment and blind trust from their victims and keep them entangled in their web for ever. This is mind control whether they do it consciously or not. Every victim of sociopath/psycopath has experienced that and this is the reason that all of us are here in the first place. You cannot see it becouse you are emotionally attached to him so this blurres your vision . You will see it only when you establish No Contact with this guy.
i believe that the reason why he has only you and his mother in his life is that you are the only ones who still can be manipulated by him, all the others probably left as who would like to keep in touch for long with somebody who continually steals and goes to jail?
if you see it for what it is without emotions as he would do , this man is a criminal, pettty criminal but a criminal. The fact that he has an official diagnosis of ASPD does not make the situation better , it makes it worse becouse it means that he will never recover from this. If you want to
spend your life and expose your children in this kind of pathology becouse you feel pity for him and becouse you love him unconditionally it is your choice as you are a grown up woman. But only the fact that you come in this site and ask questions in my opinion says that you are not happy in this kind of situation. Maybe you should try to find proffesional help as of what you say you had a difficult upbringing yourself , so it makes for him more easy to manipulate your vulnerabilities and keep you attached..
About the thing that he sees clearly becouse he doesnt have emotions, so he can see the truth.. so what? in which way this makes him superior? becouse he can tell you in a harsh way that you are different with your children? since when humans have to become robots and act without any emotional element in their behaviors? the relationship that you have with any of your boys has its own dynamic placed on who you are and who your boys are . You knows better than you ? the sociopath? Why to take his opinion as the ultimate truth? you know what ? becouse he continioned you to do this, as the Psycopath in my life has done the same with me, until i woke up for good.
And in my case also he was also diagnosed psycopath and when i unmasked him he tried to impose exactly the same tactic as yours in me, telling i am the confidant the only person that can support him and other BS. Total manipulation. i realised it fast and i got away thank God. Easy? not at all, hell but it worthed it.
If you want to live a safe life just go NC, both from him and his mother, she influences you badly as she tries to keep you in his life becouse she loves her son and she wants him not to be alone. And the reason why he doensnt press you to answer his phones or texts and he is so patient is becouse he doesnt care. He is devoid of emotion he feels no emotional pain, he doesnt miss any human being in the way that a normal person does. He needs people but not as fellow human beings to connect with and to make bonding but to use them for his needs, as company e.t.c.So dont make the mistake that i had made for years , and dont project your empathy on him. These people dont create relationships , they create captives. sorry for the long post and sorry if i come out harsh and strict but i see in your story so many similarities with mine that all came out so easy and i hope not brutal . It is my hardly earned knowledge through my own horrible experiences with a true psycopath, not just a bad person.
@Clarity
Wow! Two powerful posts. Thank you so much for sharing your experience and insight.
Lots of love AGPT
hey guys its real nice guy, sorry i haven’t posted with you guys in a while but im a musicain and am pretty busy in the summer.since i spoke to my sociopathic girlfriend a few weeks ago and told her that i was seeing a schrink regarding how to deal with coping with a sociopathic relationship..she has not said anything abussive to me, she has actually become that sweet loving person that i fell in love with 3 years ago, however i am still seeing wreckless behavior on her part…im making a decision to stay close to me and do the things that will make me better, so that i never become falsely emotionally attached, she has explained to me how her past as a child has affected her decisions and decision making. i am making a decision to forgive . but its not so easy to forget ..when we go out i am getting a sence that she wants to do something else..meaning try someone else so i have to keep myself in a position of (close friendship.)and its kind of working out,,she was right about one thing..sociopaths are very successful people because they dont relate to any emotion in their decision making so they are very confident and forthright.even though it may hurt someones feelings they make a decisison based on facts and results…..i hate to say this but i have begun to consciencously practice doing this as well , a nd i must tell you it works, of course its not my intention to allow myself to become emotionally attached from the world but im thinking a little more about me and not what makes other people happy ……to all of you my brothers and sisters who like i have fallen prey to these people keep in the back of your mind that there is a problem that exists and the only way to resolve issues is to talk about it IF YOU CAN. i made my sociopath promise to always communicate no matter whats going on SAY WHAT IT IS LETS COME TO A QUICK RESOLUTION AND CONTINUE ON…..LIFE IS TOO SHORT….. stay in touch guys and that goes for me too
Ok, I need consult here. I have been lying to myself about my boyfriend. First I must mention that virtually no one, not my kids or my friends really like him He comes off a lot like an arrogant jerk. My family has tried to find good in him because I have been so happy and they were so happy that I was no longer severely depressed from my divorce 2 years ago. He has also been married 3 times previously so I thought they were prejudice against him. But of course I said he is really so sweet to me yada yada. He came on initially so strong and of course charming and full of flattery (I mean even I know I am not all that!).l would wonder, am I really THAT great??? His dream girl, perfect partner etc. I even overlooked the fact that he lied about his previous girlfriend and she contacted me to tell me he was actually still seeing her! He said she was a depressed psycho, but that psycho seemed to know a lot about me and tried to tell me he is a dishonest cheat. He seems to be emotionally close to no one (except of course me). Not even his family all of whom he seems to dislike. I ignored the warning signs that he has no conscience. He once broke up with a girl on prom day. He didn’t actually tell her though….he just didn’t show up to take her to the prom because he found someone else that afternoon. For some reason he thought this was very funny. He left his first wife “because she was crazy” he said. Just took the daughter and left her to her emotional disorder. The second wife was “an abusive alcoholic” and the third he married “because he was lonely and they were friends.” Ninety percent of the time we have “the perfect relationship” but the other ten percent he will flip on a dime and become some confusing, hyper person who seems delusional about what we are actually fighting about! He says I make him “want to be a better person” which I now realize translates into morphing himself into what is acceptable to me. I thought he was changing but he was really getting better at his acting. So anyhow, this previously-thought cliche’ soul mate will put up one last good try to maintain this relationship as he has now invested the better part of a year…lots of time and energy and he will be pissed. I am changing the locks on my house and trying to figure out how I will get past the loneliness of the next few days…with drawl from his constant affections and not drop into a major depression in the future and realize I made the mistake of my life. Today I called his ex-wife (third) and she validated a lot of my fears. She asked me “what is it he wants from you?” He always has a purpose for choosing who he does. For her he needed a mother for his young daughter. Am I going crazy?? Am I imagining all of these things? I feel like I am losing my mind!
just no you are not crazy. your instinct is kicking in and telling you what you need to do. follow your gut its taking you in the right direction. it is normal to grieve and feel depressed when something turns out to be something its not. it would be abnormal for you not to feel what you are feeling. in time youll be ok. give it time and do your research on this topic. i think you already know your answer. your doing the right thing.
@Christine, you are not losing your mind, you are regaining it…as I read your words I remember clearly how confusing they can be, buy a big lock and get him out of your life.
I agree with No More Insanity. With a lot of help from this site, I have regained my life. The Spaths we are/were all involved in are confusing people and like to make us think we are crazy. To them, we are crazy cause they don’t know what the feelings like love, hurt etc is or what it feels like to receive affection or want attention (not in a needy way lol). It takes a long time to regain the sanity that you once knew.
Get rid of your Spath! I tell you, as someone who has almost completely recovered, life is so wonderful without them. I no longer think twice about what kind of person I am. I am happier and have no need to want to contact him. Of course, I wonder what he is doing, but he is just a sick human being and I can walk away and know that I am a decent human that knows that love shouldn’t be about how much I can give him or how much I understand him. He only wanted someone who could “understand him” and not many will. “Understand him” in giving him what he needs at that point in his life. I came in when he needed money.
When we met, I was a nice, quiet, calm, kind person. He saw that and took advantage of it. BUT now, guess what, I once saw that as an “easy target” but now I look at it as, I was such a wonderful person and he saw that. So maybe we can turn it around as a positive thing. I no longer feel like I need to prove to him what kind of wonderful person I am as, someone that loves me, should already know that.
Sorry, I didn’t mean to go on about myself LOL. Keep up with doing positive improvements in your life. A good start is changing locks!
@ Mariagon67 🙂
I think you know what you have to do but, you have lived with such control in your life that you unwittingly become an enabler 😦
Sadly I did this with my 1st husband & I get trying to fix him & make it all go away. I sat for years just confused & disabled to leave for many years.
To be honest, if he hadn’t left I would probably still be there.
I was the type that stayed stuck & even though I knew it was wrong, I still stayed.
I cannot tell you what to do but, in hindsight I wish I’d had the courage to leave & value myself & my journey more.
If it has come to stalking via recording you then that is indeed very disordered thinking at play.
I never had that level of control thank god & I think that if someone hacks your emails, your phone & stalks you when out etc…is more a dangerous mindset. That’s malicious & sadistic behaviour.
We all have a right to live freely without being watched & listened in on.
Mariagon, I think it’s time you escaped that madness & find your freedom. He has imprisoned you in your own life & that’s awful.
Open the cage door & find your freedom if you can?It is not easy but, it is worth it as you are worth it 🙂
The key is in your hand & always has been. Take back your power 🙂
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
PR i think i didn’t explain myself correctly. I cant fix him wont even try i need to fix and heal myself. My question was basically, i found the recorder on there there are conversations with my friends that I had personal to them and also conversations with my sons. stuff they confided to me. Do i confront him with this because i know he will be the kind to approach one of them (my friends or sons) and say that i confided in him something they said to me in confidence. I know this would be part of a smear campaign. i mean he has his family believing we are separated because i cheated on him (not true) he still lives at home. IDC what his family believes they knew what he was as i found out much later that he had been in a psychiatric institute for 1 month when he was 18. Way before i met him. and they never warned me.
they left me to deal with him on my own. should i warn my friends and sons about recorder although one son saw it. or do i just confront him and have him delete it all? or do i just let him continue his game until the lawyer gets me the restraining order? it just makes me sick that he has porno on his phone and local dating pages and he thinks he has the right to record conversations on our dining room table. innocent everyday life conversations..i am angrier than ever and more determined to get him out of my life i cant leave as this is my apt my furniture and my stuff and our son lives here although i keep him and the other ones as far away from this as possible..thank you for listening Maria
Hi Maria 🙂
I sent a reply as @maria so, please scroll through & find it 🙂
So many threads on this post so, hard to find comments 😉
PR xoxo
Thank you. Enjoyed your response and also really related. These are all thoughts I’ve had and struggled with. Not much time to respond but I have stopped accepting calls. I also opted out of going to visit at the jail tonight… First time in 8 weeks that I haven’t driven out there. Actually reading my own posts helped me come to this conclusion… And your response to me validated my decision. Thank you for taking the time to write such a long post
@kadeedenice
i am glad if anything of what i wrote helped to give you strength in any way dealing with this kind of pathology. i apologise again if ia came out a little harsh. Of what i read in your posts you seem to be a strong , intelligent and capable woman having raised by yourself 2 children that you gave birth at the very young age of 19. Being a mother myself i am sure that they are the light of your life. You are very young and you deserve to have a beautyful and fulfilling life being the model of your sons. if you finally decide to go NC permanently with this guy know that in the begining it is going to be hard. It will be like you break an addiction. You are going to need all your emotional and cognitive reserve plus much of support of your friends. If you can not have proffesional help from a specialist , at least confide to a close , empathetic and trust worthy friend who will be able to keep you strong in your weak moments. But , i tell you , you will succeed in the end as far as you are determined to heal . Even if it means that for some time you will be without an intimate partner , i think it is better to be stable and sane and happy with your children than to have the stress and drama of a disorder individual in your life. And when yiu will be free from this addiction and back to yourself and when you will seek the least for a relationship , then it will be the best time to let someone in your life who shares the same values with you, who has emptathy and who has his concsience and not his disordered ego as a navigator through life. These kind of people make good life partners even though sometimes appear to be in the begining less charming and less adventourous than the textbook psycopath. Lots of love and have strength in your journey back to yourself.
@Mariagon67 🙂
Sorry that I lost the thread of your story & thought he was still living with you.
I think you would best ask your lawyer & see what they suggest re the recording? It’s a huge invasion of privacy but, I am not sure what you can do. You have the recorder so, that’s evidence but, how to prove he put it there is another problem & naturally he will deny it.
I would probably tell those that were also recorded or spoken about so, that they are aware of this happening & that he has been privy to personal conversations & information.
He’s such a pig to do that anyway!
I hope you get far far away from his ridiculous behaviour soon as he will be loving the game. They don’t care what they do as they lack conscience & empathy so, for him it’s no problem to do this.
For you it’s more stress & anxiety & that’s the aim of the game. Keep you confused, anxious, stressed & on his chain that he yanks when he’s bored!
I am thinking of you as you don’t deserve this ongoing drama & upsetting behaviour. Remember that is what this is designed to do, control & manipulation purely for his self serving egotistical desires!
Please know you are not alone & you deserve peace & you can have it.
Love & Light 🙂
PR xoxo
PR you are right he is still living with me he wont leave and to just ask him to leave he wont do it without a scene. My therapist is helping me through victim services to get the order of protection and legal advice. He has come on to my therapist and even my family doctor(sexually) but very subtly. They both tell me he is a predator but I have to be careful even for them because if he perceives them as a threat or knows they are helping me he will cause a scene in their place of business. I know they can call the police, but still I feel they shouldn’t have to deal with this they have patients there who should not be exposed to this. He has the recorder, when I saw it I left it there because by taking it , it would of led to a confrontation and my grandchildren were expected any minute, And understand in all of this he still says to my face he loves me and cant live without me to which I never reply. I don’t even look him in the face cause I know I will loose control and he still thinks its ok to have sex I am tired of running around the house telling him to get away from me. of course he does this when my son is not at home and I will never tell them because I wont put them in the middle. I am just so tired.
Thank you from the bottom of my heart for listening
Maria
PR ..hope all is well I went to my therapist yesterday and she gave me a test. I scored very high on the test she says I am an HSP (highly sensitive person) its sensory processing sensitivity. Have you ever heard of this?
Pr doesn’t run this site Marion 😦 Neither is she, or ever has been admin on this site.
hey guys realniceguy , i need to get regular again.. my socio and i went out last night,,she really cant help herself ….we stopped to go to a restaurant last night after a wonderful show and a couple of younger guys walked up not even paying attention to her …..BUT SHE HAD TO MAKE HERSELF IMBARRASSINGLY AVAILABLE…WHICH I PLAYED OFF AS ANOTHER DISPICABLE DISPLAY OF (will somebody please notice me i:ii do anything) one of the guys turned to me and jokingly sarcastingly saying (HEY MAN SHE PUT IT OUT THERE) I DO REALISE THAT SHE:LL PROBABLY NEVER STOP WITH THIS HORR IBLE SELF DEFEATING DEPLEATION OF SELF WORTH….. but you have to remember . they grew up this way..your dealing with a sickness..and as sane as they believe they are//// they cant change…..i really tested her at the end of the evening….i informed her that a friend of mine was coming over to meet me at her house…she almost couldn:t contain herself with anticipation…so as i watched her undress and make sure that she was good and naked under her clothes… she said lets go outside and sit till your friend gets here..low in behold i cancelled him comming by.(.you know i said to myself…that this will never change . do i really need somebody so badly in life that I tolerate these HORRIBLE DISPLAYS OF SEXUALLY OVEREXPOSING HERSELF SO SHAMELESSLY TO NOT ONLY MY FRIENDS, BUT EVERYBODY SHE MEETS,thankfully my heart is in the right place this time….she:s got to do a whole lot better than sending ms game requests … anyway in recently checking she:s fathfully on her social media websites looking for another victim…you know she:s really a brilliant beautiful person…but like a drug addict needing his fix . he just caves in instead of trying……I WILL NEVER ALLOW MY FRIENDS TO EVER GO TO HER HOUSE ….TO BE HUMILIATED BY A SEXUAL DISPLAY OF THIS SORT …BE CAREFUL BUT DONT DECIEVE YOURSELVES…IF THEY CANT CALL YOU AND SAY HI HOW ARE YOU TODAY OR. INVITE YOU TO SOCIAL EVENTS BELIEVE ME ….THEY DONT THINK YOUR GOOD ENOUGH….SO UNDERSTAND WHAT YOUR DEALING WITH AND KEEP YOUR HEAD AND HEART AT A SAFE DISTANCE
Is your heart really in the right place? If it was I think you would show the caring you show her to yourself first. As much as it hurts, you have to worry about yourself first and stop trying to fix her. Go NC and find someone worthy of your love and attention.
Agreed
your right and i like the rest of us am working on it and… its getting better….thanks
@realniceguy
Getting to the point of being able to go NC often takes a buildup of energy and time. It can be difficult to muster the required energy to try to break the addiction. It took me weeks after uncovering her deception to round up my own reserves. I did not want it to be true. I was having trouble getting my head around all the new soc info and how she fit it to a tee. At a dinner one night I asked her questions that I knew the answers to and she lied right to my face and even when pressed did not back off the lies. I knew right then it was true and what I had to do. It made me sick inside but I resolved to do it.
Getting distance allowed my energy to return and a gradual further lifting of the veil. But it was only by really doing true No Contact, none whatsoever, that allowed me to regain myself and see things clearly.
She managed to sneak a pity laden SMS past my call blocker about 10 days ago (first contact in 4 months). It churned my emotions up for days and I had to return here to read others and my own writings to re-balance myself. I maintained NC and even went and changed my phone number so it doesn’t happen again.
I hope my response above did not appear harsh. I truly understand how hard it can be to let these people go. But now I also realize the benefits of doing so. I wish you strength and my best prayers for your journey.
Lots of Love AGPT
I had an on and off relationship with a psychopath for 2 years which left me overweight, emotionally ruined and fired. It ended officially when he dumped me (i didnt know he was a p back then) and for 6 months i was a depressed wreck trying to make it through every day. Two months ago he resurfaced on fb and it was like his initial wonderful self. He got me hoovered but because we dont live in the same town anymore he started sending naked photos and explicit texts. I thought he had changed his mind, valued me and wanted me back..until i found out he has a new gf this last year and he has also proposed to her. I was so enraged and jealous i contacted her on fb and sent her all the sexting and the naked photos. Part of me wanted to warn her and also punish him for looking down on me. The result was shocking. Despite my tons of solid proof she is still with him and blocked me on fb.
I knew p’s are capable of persuasion but how can she believe him over her own eyes? I go forth and back between shock, sadness and tremendous anger. I am angry at the world too. Noone arounds me understands or cares. Today a friend of mine told me she ”doesnt believe in personality disorders” like it is some occult! I restrained myself from wishing her to encounter a p and see for herself. After the psychopath i feel like the heroine in the movie Konstantine who was the only one able to see demons and everyone laughed at her until she decided not to speak of what she saw even again. I have a loner by choise. Any advice would be much appreciated.
Changed Girl
Don’t listen to people or friends who haven’t been there it takes people like here on this site to understand what you are going through would you have listened if somebody told you that he was a sociopath probably not love is blind if you wanna call it love because its not its just a game and he will treat her the same way the best thing you can do this move on don’t look back share here with like minded people who have been there and work on yourself now this is not love and stay off his facebook blocked him and her
The lies never end. They lie to people in front of you and lie to you too your face. Start no contact. Get away from the lies, they only create more question.. when in a relationship you should trust the person, if they keep lying, that trust is always broken, therefore there is no way you can have a relationship with that person.
So true
thankyou so much for the support… im at a place where im not suprised at the playful but obvious SEXUAL OVER ADVANCEMENT that she displays. im actually doing very well im signing up for school tomorrow and am planning to move to the beach …im a musicain so im always in the (know) so its about to get very exciting….but, i learned one vitally important thing ,keep your heart and mind grounded in you and you will succeed..im feeling really good. even if she told me that she:s sleeping with some else i wouldn:t be suprised..im over the worst part,,she could never regain the love that i had for her… so we:re friends now and im ok with that.. at least we can see each other ,share in some fun things and keep a safe distance so nobody gets hurt anymore …..thanks a million realniceguy
You are welcome. One other thing, I am not a psychiatrist but from the description in your posts it seems that your soc has some symptoms of Histrionic Personality Disorder, another cluster B disorder. Cluster B’s can fall in the intersections of a multitude of of categories so I wouldn’t worry too much about trying to pin it all down neatly. Just know that all cluster B’s can make things hell for their partners. Just thought I would point it out in case you wanted to seek info out on that.
As one of the sociopaths who frequently posts on here so eloquently stated
– “A sociopath does not need nor want help, it’s an altered way of thinking, not a condition”.
Whenever I feel I am dealing with one, this quote goes through my head, and my behavior changes accordingly.
NIBSIH.
I am aware of that, but she has answered questions for me in the past, it was just a question.
But didn’t your friends stop speaking to you after HE did a smear campaign? Some people just don’t want to get between a couple and maybe it was hurtful to them what he was doing to you. Maybe they tried warning you in the past?
I’m not judging I am still with mine.
I have to thank you all for your support and words of advice on here. Since this site had closed down, I have had the courage to go no contact since then. I no longer feel the need to contact him, I actually feel wonderful and alive again. I was heading that way before this site closed down but I just keep on improving. I can’t say thank you enough for the support I have received. The future looks bright again. There will always be a small part of me that will love my Spath but, if he asked for help ever, I would have no problems in walking away now. I am not his lifesaver, he made his decision and now he must live with that. If anything, I have him to thank for making me a stronger person and know what I want in a partner….and that isn’t any of the attributes that he has.
I went to a physic on the weekend. I know that not everybody believes in it but I kind of do. She picked up on my ex the minute I sat down and said that the last 2 years have been very hard for me. She said that she wants to wrap my heart and me up in cotton wool and protect me. It gave me more hope as she said that she sees a wonderful man in my life that will turn up in around 6 months and he will show me what real love is. She also said that, because of my hurt previously, I will be very protective of myself and go slow, which isn’t a bad thing. At the end, the last thing she said was, my ex tried to put it all back onto me but I must know that I was never the problem and I did nothing wrong at all. So much more she said and it all just made sense. If anything, it just gave me that hope.
By the way, it is ex is def a Spath. I changed my name 🙂
No you were never the problem, you cannot be responsible for someone else’s behaviour or actions. You cannot fix someone else, only they can do that for themselves, and with sociopaths, they still have the same brain pattern, the best that can be hoped for is that they could learn to manage their behaviour. Of course they can do that if they choose to, otherwise high functioning sociopaths wouldn’t survive. There are millions of them out there.
Please go careful though with talking to the psychic I am really pleased that it lifted your spirits and has made you feel good about you, and given you fresh hope for the future, after so much pain. But just be careful, hopefully what she says is true… but do not let this blind you to the greatest lesson that the sociopath teaches, and this is to trust yourself!!! To listen to your own inner voice of what is the truth.
I would hate you to be 6 months down the line, and healed and happy with your life, and let someone in…. and give them chances, that they didn’t deserve because a psychic said that you would be happy with this new person. Always listen to yourself, how you feel, and how you feel about yourself when with that person…. its more important than anything 🙂
I just have to share what I have found that is leading me to much healing, this verbalized in ways I could not. I have ordered the book. I hope that everyone takes time to read and finds it most beneficial as well. We all ask ourselves why? and this sure does bring light to the darkness and hell. God Bless all my Sisters…Seek, knock and the door shall be opened to you!
he Dance between Codependents and Narcissists
Ross Rosenberg, M.Ed., LCPC, CADC, CSAT Candidate
We therapists live for moments when everything “clicks” and our client arrives at an understanding that, until that moment, had eluded him. There is nothing more rewarding than when a well-placed analogy or metaphor creates the breakthrough moment. When spot-on, the resulting “light bulb” reaction or “aha” moment is priceless!
Of all of the metaphors I use in psychotherapy, “the dance” has been the most provocative and powerfully impactful with my codependent clients. It has helped them understand their predilection for choosing “dance partners” who are irresistibly attractive to them, but ultimately controlling and harmful. It has also assisted them in coming to terms with their seemingly magnetic attraction to narcissistic romantic partners. Over time, the dance metaphor would develop into one of my favorite psychotherapeutic techniques, which would ultimately facilitate perception of rigid thought patterns, break down systems of denial and enable emotional and intellectual understanding of dysfunctional relationship dynamics.
The dance metaphor works because it almost perfectly aligns with what we know about real dancing partnerships. For example, compatible dancers are well matched in their dance approach or dance roles: one always needs to be the leader and the other the follower. The leader always navigates the dance with precision and the follower acquiesces seamlessly. These two choose songs to dance to that they know completely and intuitively. They are exquisitely experienced, familiar and attuned to the other’s dancing style, moves and idiosyncrasies. To an onlooker, it appears that they dance with ESP, each knowing and predicting the other’s moves before they happen.
Codependents and narcissists “dance” so well with each other because their pathological personalities or “dance styles” are complementary or, in other words, they are perfectly matched partners. Their well-matched dance preferences bond them together in a resilient and lasting partnership, even if one or both partners are unhappy, resentful or angry. As well-matched dancers, they perform magnificently on the dance floor because they instinctively are able to expect each other’s moves. They dance effortlessly with each other, as if they have always danced together. Each knows his or her role and sticks to it. Dysfunctional compatibility is the driving force behind this dynamic dancing duo.
As perfectly compatible dancing partners, the narcissist dancer is the “yin” to the codependent’s “yang.” The codependent’s giving, sacrificial and passive nature matches up perfectly with the narcissist’s entitled, demanding and self-centered traits. Like metal magnets or, as I call them, “human magnets,” codependents and narcissists continue their rocky and seemingly unstable relationship because of their opposite dance roles or, as I refer to it in my book, The Human Magnet Syndrome, their “magnetic roles.” The lasting bond created by perfectly matched human magnets or dysfunctional dancers is interminably powerful; binding them together despite myriad consequences or shared unhappiness. Although their rollercoaster-relationship provokes more anxiety and disconnect than happiness, both seem compelled to continue the dance.
These perfectly matched dancers always seem to nail their dance routines, which are to be expected, as they have been practicing their passive and predictive dance moves their whole adult lives. Codependents’ dancing skills are distinctly connected to their reflexive dysfunctional agility – the ability to be attuned to the cues, gestures and self-serving movements of their pathological narcissist partners. Codependents, in almost every facet of their life, pride themselves on knowing what people want and need, almost before the friend, family member or partner knows it themselves. Hence, they are adept at anticipating their narcissist partner’s moves, while still experiencing the dance as a positive experience.
Conversely, narcissistic “dancers” are drawn to codependent partners because they are allowed to feel dominant, secure and in-control in an activity that brings them much attention, praise and appreciation. They habitually choose or fall in love with codependent “dance” partners because they are given open and tacit permission to be the center-focus, lead the direction of the dance and, ultimately, determine where, when and how the dance will proceed. In other words, the narcissist’s grandiosity, entitlement and need to be in control are not only allowed by their codependent partner, but also paradoxically make the partner feel safe and secure in the dance.
The dance metaphor has been instrumental to my work with codependent clientele because it assisted them understand their persistent dysfunctional attraction pattern to hurtful and selfish narcissistic romantic partners. It also helped them in breaking their perpetual and reflexive pattern of choosing a dance partner who initially felt perfect, but eventually would reveal themselves to be so wrong and harmful to them. As my dad, who sadly is a narcissist, once told me when he was explaining the nature of relationships: “The soul mate of your dreams is gonna become the cellmate of your nightmares.”
Therapy that utilizes my dance metaphor consistently provokes a deeper understanding of dysfunctional relationship patterns. Over time, my clients developed the confidence, insight and feelings of personal efficacy and power to break free from their dysfunctional relationship patterns. Released from their propensity to fall in love with narcissists, these “recovering” codependents would finally be able to fall reflexively, if not magnetically, into the arms of a loving, desirable and emotionally healthy dance partner.
In 2007, following an inspiring breakthrough therapy session with one of my clients, I decided to consolidate all of my ideas about the codependent/narcissist dance phenomenon into one essay, which I would entitle “Codependency, Don’t Dance.” The essay flowed from me with ease, as I had been thinking, contemplating and talking about these concepts for over five years. I would later realize that the ideas/concepts had been marinating in my mind ever since I made the promise to myself that I would put an end to my own penchant for dating, falling in love with and marrying narcissistic women. I have no doubt that if I didn’t figure out how to change my own dysfunctional dance pattern, the dance “light bulb” would never have appeared above my head!
It was an immediate hit with my codependent clients as it seemed to galvanize their understanding of their own dysfunctional and self-defeating relationship choices. It worked for them as it represented my own truism about the psychotherapy process: you can’t change a long-standing dysfunctional pattern until you first understand what it is and from where it comes; the deeper the understanding of the internal processes, the more apt the therapy experience will yield positive results.
Since writing this essay, it has become the most requested piece of my written work and is also included in my book, The Human Magnet Syndrome: Why We Love People Who Hurt Us. Over the past six years since it was written, I’m honored and grateful that the essay has helped thousands of people to analyze and, ultimately, understand their seemingly mysterious and habitual relationship patterns with narcissists.
What follows is an excerpt of the essay:
Codependency, Don’t Dance!
When a codependent and narcissist come together in their relationship, their dance unfolds flawlessly: The narcissistic partner maintains the lead and the codependent follows. Their roles seem natural to them because they have actually been practicing them their whole lives; the codependent reflexively gives up their power and since the narcissist thrives on control and power, the dance is perfectly coordinated. No one gets their toes stepped on.
Typically, codependents give of themselves much more than their partners give back to them. As “generous” but bitter dance partners, they seem to be stuck on the dance floor, always waiting for the “next song,” at which time they naively hope that their narcissistic partner will finally understand their needs. Codependents confuse caretaking and sacrifice with loyalty and love. Although they are proud of their unwavering dedication to the person they love, they end up feeling unappreciated and used. Codependents yearn to be loved, but because of their choice of dance partner, find their dreams unrealized. With the heartbreak of unfulfilled dreams, codependents silently and bitterly swallow their unhappiness.
Codependents are essentially stuck in a pattern of giving and sacrificing, without the possibility of ever receiving the same from their partner. They pretend to enjoy the dance, but really harbor feelings of anger, bitterness, and sadness for not taking an active role in their dance experience. They are convinced that they will never find a dance partner who will love them for who they are, as opposed to what they can do for them. Their low self-esteem and pessimism manifests itself into a form of learned helplessness that ultimately keeps them on the dance floor with their narcissistic partner.
The narcissist dancer, like the codependent, is attracted to a partner who feels perfect to them: Someone who lets them lead the dance while making them feel powerful, competent and appreciated. In other words, the narcissist feels most comfortable with a dancing companion who matches up with their self-absorbed and boldly selfish dance style. Narcissist dancers are able to maintain the direction of the dance because they always find partners who lack self-worth, confidence and who have low self-esteem — codependents. With such a well-matched companion, they are able to control both the dancer and the dance.
Although all codependent dancers desire harmony and balance, they consistently sabotage themselves by choosing a partner who they are initially attracted to, but will ultimately resent. When given a chance to stop dancing with their narcissistic partner and comfortably sit the dance out until someone healthy comes along, they typically choose to continue their dysfunctional dance. They dare not leave their narcissistic dance partner because their lack of self-esteem and self-respect makes them feel like they can do no better. Being alone is the equivalent of feeling lonely, and loneliness is too painful to bear.
Although codependents dream of dancing with an unconditionally loving and affirming partner, they submit to their dysfunctional destiny. Until they decide to heal the psychological wounds that ultimately compel them to dance with their narcissistic dance partners, they will be destined to maintain the steady beat and rhythm of their dysfunctional dance.
Through psychotherapy, and perhaps, a 12-step recovery program, the codependent can begin to recognize that their dream to dance the grand dance of love, reciprocity and mutuality is indeed possible. Through therapy and a change of lifestyle, codependents can build (repair) their tattered self-esteem. The journey of healing and transformation will bring them feelings of personal power and efficacy that will foster a desire to finally dance with someone who is willing and capable of sharing the lead, communicating their movements, and pursuing a mutual loving rhythmic dance.
In conclusion, it is my belief that all codependents, if motivated and committed to a healing and engaging psychotherapy process, are able to stop their insanity-inducing dance with narcissists. Through a non-wavering belief in one’s self-worth and commitment to the ideal of healthy and resilient love, we all can finally experience personal and relational joy. The quote that best captures my philosophy of the codependency recovery process comes from George Eliot: “It’s never too late to be what you might have been.” Or, as I might say it, “It is never too late to dance with the partner of your dreams.”
Ross Rosenberg, M.Ed., LCPC, CADC
Psychotherapist & National Seminar Trainer
Owner of Clinical Care Consultants
Co-Owner of Advanced Clinical Trainers
Author of the Human Magnet Syndrome
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This entry was posted in Articles, codependency, narcissism and tagged best codependency book, best narcissism book, codependency, codependency book, codependency expert, codependency narcissism, codependency treatment, human magnet syndrome, narcissism, narcissism author, narcissist, ross rosenberg on January 11, 2014 by Ross Rosenberg.
About Ross Rosenberg
Ross Rosenberg has over 26 years of experience as a psychotherapist, counseling practice owner, training company co-owner, nationally recognized professional trainer, consultant and certified addiction specialist. Ross is the author of “The Human Magnet Syndrome: Why We Love People Who Hurt Us,” published in April 2013. Ross’s work has been highlighted on various TV programs including, ABC Late Night, Fox News, WGN News and UT-San Diego News. He has appeared in the Chicago Tribune & Publisher Weekly and is a regular contributor for The Huffington Post and PsychCenteral.com. Ross owns Clinical Care Consultants, a full-service counseling center based in the Northwestern suburbs of Chicago. He is a national seminar speaker consultant, and expert psychotherapist in the areas of codependency, sex love addiction and internet addictions, trauma, dysfunctional or problematic relationships, narcissism and borderline personality disorders. The training that inspired his book, “Emotional Manipulators & Codependents: Understanding the Attraction” was hosted in 27 states/60 cities in a two year time span. Ross now owns the Chicago based training company, Advanced Clinical Ross owns Clinical Care Consultants, a full-service counseling center based in the Northwestern suburbs of Chicago. He is a national seminar speaker consultant, and expert psychotherapist. Ross’s clinical expertise spans the areas of codependency, sex love addiction and internet addictions, dysfunctional or problematic relationships, narcissism and borderline personality disorders. By the end of 2013, Ross’s current seminar, “Emotional Manipulators & Codependents: Understanding the Attraction” will have been hosted in 27 states. Rosenberg’s psychotherapy services enable his clients to achieve balance, inner peace and feelings of personal efficacy. He says, “Within a warm and respectful therapeutic relationship lies the power to overcome seemingly overwhelming obstacles.”
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Hi all, this is my story….I had no idea I was susceptible to this type of abuse…I always thought of my self as the “take no shit” type…so what was this strange hold he had over me and why did I ignore the red flags….A few years ago, I was really on top of game, looking and feeling gorgeous from yoga, had wonderful friends, a great job and beautiful home. Within nine months, I was friendless, homeless and jobless, and the psycho was gone…oh and also managed to beat me so badly I had to get five stitches in my eye, then pressed charges against me, then bailed me out of jail the same night, got me a hotel room, and said “I know you hate me now”…I only stayed with him to get my stitches and scar paid for and to get the charge against me dropped. Somehow, it was like he knew, that day he hit me like that, I was finally ready to leave him. As usual, he called me tormenting me, telling me to pack my shit when I got home, we were through. I was going away for four days to see family, this was enough to shake him bad. But my response is what shocked him. “Ok”, and that was that. Until Wham! He did what he had to do to “keep” me. What a sick ordeal. Everything he did was a sick ordeal to keep me. Even after I finally left him, he continued stalking my every move. He was a high level computer coder. A psycho genius. It took me months to realize how he was tracking my every move via computer. I eventually had to report him to the FBI internet hate crimes division. I have not been bothered since. But, I still find myself lamely needing to feel his fake love to feel loved, instead of loving myself. There was nothing so elating as being so wanted and needed. So am I not sick too? I just really need to find a place to get support and help and to remember that I am worth it, that other men are still worth it…and move on already. If anyone can help me, please, and thanks in advance!
Hi roadkill, and welcome to the site!! 🙂
What you describe sounds incredibly normal. They display their ‘love’ only it is ownership, and as you know when you try to escape, if they don’t want you to escape, will track your every move, and every thought.
You know in your heart that you are better off without this person, and also lucky to have escaped. Every day when you wake up BREATH OUT FREEDOM, as you escaped and set yourself free. There is never a more dangerous time than the time when you are trying to escape and they don’t want to lose you. What you describe as wanting to ‘keep you’ is a good description, mine would tell me that …
I want to keep you….
He didn’t see how this wasn’t a normal thing to say, as you don’t ‘keep’ people. It should be a two way relationship.
What you describe, it is not missing him, it is addiction, they deliberately create dependency and addiction towards them, this is how they keep control over you.
This explains, and I know that there a lot of posts on this subject
https://datingasociopath.com/2013/06/04/the-relationship-with-the-sociopath-is-over-so-why-cant-you-let-go-take-me-to-your-drug-dealer/
https://datingasociopath.com/2013/12/04/what-is-in-your-comfort-zone-how-the-sociopath-grooms-its-victim/
There are quite a few more that I am trying to find for you. Go through the list of posts. I just wanted you to know that there is nothing wrong with you, your reactions are NORMAL. They groom you, manipulate, deceive and completely control you. It isn’t that it was good its that they create addiction and dependency, and it is the addiction that is crying out… that is all. Welcome to the site 🙂
Hi all….I am too tired to go over it all…I let him destroy everything, my world,he beat me, ruined precious friendships, choked me off from reality…he was my insane reality. he left me friendless, jobless, homeless, and destroyed all my wordly belongings aside from putting me the hospital. It has been two years nearly and I finally am facing up to the fact that I need help to psychologically move past this. I am externally moving on, have new friends, new job, secure home life, he is no longer stalking me like he did for months after the breakup ( I had to report him to the fbi….I was no longer scared)….but how do I fix the inside now…if anyone can help? I also need to escape my victim mentality…I allowed this, and some sick part of me still needs to think this is love? I was told by a therapist that he did love me in his own sick way…but sometime I feel like I just changed the external…please help
Roadkill, you didn’t LET HIM destroy everything. This isn’t true. He might allow you to believe that it is all your fault. It absolutely isn’t. If in the beginning he had said to you, when you had just met him ‘I am going to destroy everything in your world’ would you have let him in further?
No of course you wouldn’t. You did, because you thought that you were with someone who was just like you, someone with similar morals, and values. This is not your fault.
Therapy can be really good, it can help you to undo damage that has been done to you. Many victims of abuse are left suffering with post traumatic stress disorder, from continual control and abuse techniques, and additional sometimes also physical abuse. As the sociopath strives to keep control, it can be impossible to escape.
NO it isn’t true that you allowed this. You were manipulated, controlled, and owned. It wasn’t that you allowed this, you had little choice…. I understand this, as would anybody else who has also been a victim of this kind of behaviour.
It might be true that he ‘loved’ you in the only way that he knew how, but did you want this type of love?
As for fixing you…. its about finding the OLD you, the person that you were PRIOR to meeting him. All of this is still within you. He could never take you, your inner you, despite he tried, it is still there within you, I promise. Yes you might be forever changed by your experiences, but I promise you, you can recover.
https://datingasociopath.com/recovery-and-healing-after-dating-a-sociopath/from-victim-to-survivor/how-to-reclaim-the-person-in-the-mirror/